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[CSM] Begun, the Planning Wars Have... [UPDATED 01/28]

First post
Author
Trebor Daehdoow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-01-18 15:50:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Trebor Daehdoow
CCP has now begun their planning process for the May expansion, and true to the promises made at the Summit by CCP Unifex, CCP Seagull and CCP Ripley, CSM has been given unprecedented access; for the first time, we are being consulted before any significant decisions have been made.

Because of the NDA nature of a lot of what is being discussed, this post will be short on specific details, but I do want to give the community an update on what's happened so far.

Last week, all the major feature teams at CCP made presentations about what features they could potentially work on for release in May; these ranged from big ideas to little things, and from things they'd just like to do to things they'd already done substantial work on. Some were standalone items, while others were dependent on other items (often items from other teams).

Then all the feature teams were given a task -- come up with a "theme" that combines features from all the teams into a package that forms a coherent expansion.

On Wednesday, about the time the Minutes were published, CSM received copies of all the presentations as well as a video recording.

This morning, we had a Skype conference with CCP Seagull. We presented our evaluation of the feature proposals, and received more information on how the planning process was to proceed.

We received a further task: to create our own themes, in order to help CCP Seagull understand what kind of themes the Community might like. While we obviously don't have the same information as CCP teams do (such as the complexity of some of the features and their interactions), she feels that this will be useful in helping evaluate CCP's theme proposals. We will be delivering these themes on Monday, 1/21.

Once all the themes are received, CSM will be provided with copies of all of them. By the end of the week, CCP Seagull will have created a shortlist of candidate themes, and CSM will be told which they are. We currently are scheduled to discuss the shortlist with her on Monday, 1/28.

CCP certainly seems to be executing on their promise to iterate on "CSM as a Stakeholder"... :)

Original blog post link: http://treborofthecsm.blogspot.com/2013/01/begun-planning-wars-have.html

Addendum: I've been asked to give my personal opinion about all of this. While it is early days yet, I am very pleased with the level of access CSM is getting, and all the meetings have been very productive. I look forward to seeing how things evolve, and I feel comfortable in saying that I and other people on CSM are looking forward to putting a lot of effort into trying to help make this new planning process work.

Update: 01/28/13 Variations on a Theme

On Friday, January 18th, we sent our sample themes to CCP Seagull. In return, on January 23rd, CSM got a package of the themes created by CCP teams, performed a quick analysis of them, and sent her our recommendations.

While I can't go into any specifics, I found the CCP themes to be very interesting reading, and they gave me more insight into how people at CCP are addressing the new planning system.

Today, Monday the 28th, we had a followup meeting with CCP Seagull. She gave us a broad overview of the overall theme that had been decided upon, which the CSM members present strongly endorsed. Over the next week, CCP will be determining what set of features best fits the theme and is practical given time and resource constraints.

CSM will receive a package of materials on Friday related to CCP's initial prioritization decisions and will provide our trademark :48hour: turnaround on them.

Based on what has happened so far, I am cautiously optimistic that the new planning process is going to do a good job of ensuring that CCP does a better job of delivering an expansion with good "bang-for-buck" when it comes to pleasing the community.

Original blog post link: http://treborofthecsm.blogspot.com/2013/01/variations-on-theme.html

Private Citizen • CSM in recovery

Seleene
Body Count Inc.
Mercenary Coalition
#2 - 2013-01-18 16:16:01 UTC
Look at us, doing nothing.

2004-2008: Mercenary Coalition Boss

2007-2010: CCP Game Designer | 2011-2013: CSM6 Delegate & CSM7 Chairman

2011-2015: Pandemic Legionnaire

2015- : Mercenary Coalition Boss

Follow Seleene on Twitter!

Buzzy Warstl
Quantum Flux Foundry
#3 - 2013-01-18 16:28:41 UTC
Potential theme: Wagons, Ho!
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0743292/

http://www.mud.co.uk/richard/hcds.htm Richard Bartle: Players who suit MUDs

Montaire
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2013-01-18 16:36:09 UTC
I think the real heart of the matter is not whether or not you get access, but if your input is taken seriously and acted on.

Do you get the sense that your input is being acted on, or that you are just throwing ideas into a pit ?
Alekseyev Karrde
Noir.
Shadow Cartel
#5 - 2013-01-18 16:50:11 UTC
Montaire wrote:
I think the real heart of the matter is not whether or not you get access, but if your input is taken seriously and acted on.

Do you get the sense that your input is being acted on, or that you are just throwing ideas into a pit ?

Based on CCP going full Rambo with the development concepts we supported in our Strategy Document?

Feeling pretty good.

CCP isn't obligated to take our advice of course, but i dont feel like I'm talking to a hole in the wall.

Alek the Kidnapper, Hero of the CSM

Bagehi
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#6 - 2013-01-18 16:57:58 UTC
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
Montaire wrote:
I think the real heart of the matter is not whether or not you get access, but if your input is taken seriously and acted on.

Do you get the sense that your input is being acted on, or that you are just throwing ideas into a pit ?

Based on CCP going full Rambo with the development concepts we supported in our Strategy Document?

Feeling pretty good.

CCP isn't obligated to take our advice of course, but i dont feel like I'm talking to a hole in the wall.


The New CCP. Really nice to read things like this from the CSM.
Rengerel en Distel
#7 - 2013-01-18 16:59:50 UTC
I agree with someone else that posted in the POS thread that EvE: Empire! would be a good theme. It would encompass both the actual Empires (FW, wardecs), null SOV, and personal empires (POS). It would be about having the tools to carve out your own empire in the vastness of space. That empire can be both in terms of land and influence (actual sov mechanics, industry, market).

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.

Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#8 - 2013-01-18 17:08:17 UTC
I'm pretty happy with what we heard from CCP this morning. They are certainly listening, and the experience of going through the theme creation process myself is really interesting.

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog

Rengerel en Distel
#9 - 2013-01-18 17:14:37 UTC
Are you guys actually looking for feedback to present to them, or just going with your own ideas?

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.

Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#10 - 2013-01-18 17:22:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Hans Jagerblitzen
Rengerel en Distel wrote:
Are you guys actually looking for feedback to present to them, or just going with your own ideas?


We ABSOLUTELY want your feedback. There's never been a better time to mail your CSM representatives and pitch your ideas for summer. By all means, send us whatever you have that's on your mind. Stuff that needs fixing, stuff that themes well with other features, and touches on a variety of gameplay styles. Fill our inboxes up, make us regret we ever took on this job. Twisted

We will of course be monitoring all the summit minutes feedback threads as well to mine for feedback and ideas. There will also be a Town Hall announcement shortly. Just finalizing the details there.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

Peter Dostoevsky
Friendly Riot
Good Mental
#11 - 2013-01-18 17:33:29 UTC
Seleene wrote:
Look at us, doing nothing.


Straight from the horse's mouth, people: CSM does nothing.

Lol
Raid'En
#12 - 2013-01-18 17:57:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Raid'En
As I said on Seleene thread on Reddit, I would say "Home" as theme.
You can easily include from big things on this theme, and begin work on them.
For the guy who live on nullsec, updating sov to make it more than a home (change to how the sov works, all the things you said from doing it from the bottom, how there's more need for small engagements, even destructible outpost can be include on this theme)
Obviously POS are a type of home, and so can have modifications on this theme.
Doing things about moon mining can also fit ; the moons are on our soil, they are part of our land, which is a home on sov null.
And of course, if you change some of these things, you'll have a need to do things about industry UI.
I know you can't do *all* these changes on one expansion, but I didn't say you had to pick all of these things. If you can *begin* work on big things and do some little at the same time... well then it's a win ;)
FistyMcBumBasher
State War Academy
Caldari State
#13 - 2013-01-18 18:14:17 UTC  |  Edited by: FistyMcBumBardier
A Goldrush theme is what I am thinking of right now.

It could give you a nice place to put in ring mining (we found out how to mine new minerals, come exploit those riches in 0.0), poses (building shanty towns and communities in deep 0.0 that are either in sov or npc 0.0, or just base your pirating corp out of these poses in lowsec/highsec), as well as giving a way to introduce smaller gang objective based pvp into the mix(this small gang of pirates living in our undefended space are trying to kill our miners and are stealing our moon goo/pi resources!).

This also leaves the possibilities wide open for exploration. Imagine the feeling of exploring a new resource system or new space. Not quite sure what will pop up on scan and not quite sure how to tackle new pve content.

It would tie in with bounty hunting, wars and crime watch as well by fleshing out the bounty hunter profession a little bit. It would also help Eve retain that lawless wild west feel that makes it such an awesome game. Kill or be killed, and all that jazz.

Ship balancing would also tie in nicely because Battle-cruisers, Battleships and Black ops are in the works, so they could be the strong arm of the law that is needed to repel attacks against small gangs of invaders. With pirate frigates and faction frigates not that far off there could be some cool new ways to attain them as well as ample cannon for RP'ers.

Though the debate is also open, it would give the option to create new regions on the map with special attributes(it was talked about somewhere in the minutes).

Entice new players with the dreams of striking it rich on the untapped resources of lawless space. Who would not start a new account or re-sub to try and experience that?

Hell, even dueling would work great with this expansion theme. 1v1 at SUNrise anyone?
Gah'Matar
Phoenix Naval Operations
Phoenix Naval Systems
#14 - 2013-01-18 18:15:45 UTC
Homesteading. I would love to be able to establish a ninja / small-scale "presence" in nullsec. Like a mini-POS with some storage and fitting service. Convenient fueling. Not on a moon. Maybe something that decays over time if not fueled and fueled by tower fuel blocks (ideally, any race's) at a rate that would make bringing in fuel with a bomber viable. More or less equivalent to an anchored orca.

I can dream.
Bob FromMarketing
Space Marketing Department
#15 - 2013-01-18 18:20:10 UTC
FistyMcBumBasher wrote:
A Goldrush theme is what I am thinking of right now.

It could give you a nice place to put in ring mining (we found out how to mine new minerals, come exploit those riches in 0.0), poses (building shanty towns and communities in deep 0.0 that are either in sov or npc 0.0, or just base your pirating corp out of these poses in lowsec/highsec), as well as giving a way to introduce smaller gang objective based pvp into the mix(this small gang of pirates living in our undefended space are trying to kill our miners and are stealing our moon goo/pi resources!).

This also leaves the possibilities wide open for exploration. Imagine the feeling of exploring a new resource system or new space. Not quite sure what will pop up on scan and not quite sure how to tackle new pve content.

It would tie in with bounty hunting, wars and crime watch as well by fleshing out the bounty hunter profession a little bit. It would also help Eve retain that lawless wild west feel that makes it such an awesome game. Kill or be killed, and all that jazz.

Ship balancing would also tie in nicely because Battle-cruisers, Battleships and Black ops are in the works, so they could be the strong arm of the law that is needed to repel attacks against small gangs of invaders. With pirate frigates and faction frigates not that far off there could be some cool new ways to attain them as well as ample cannon for RP'ers.

Though the debate is also open, it would give the option to create new regions on the map with special attributes(it was talked about somewhere in the minutes).

Entice new players with the dreams of striking it rich on the untapped resources of lawless space. Who would not start a new account or re-sub to try and experience that?

Hell, even dueling would work great with this expansion theme. 1v1 at SUNrise anyone?


BUMBASHER FOR CSM.


I like this idea, +1
Rees Noturana
Red Rock Mining Company
#16 - 2013-01-18 18:27:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Rees Noturana
Brainstorming here...

Evolution: Advances in cloning technology, leveraging the tech used by the new mercenaries, allows for the deployment of short-lived combat clones. No implants and no effects on the original clone allow for lower cost and brutal combat but without performance enhancing clones. Due to a short life span you'd need to forward deploy your actual clone or some sort of clone vat system to push an invasion. No 24 hour timer either. Just activate combat clone and go. When that clone dies or expires you revert to last original clone used.

While reducing the cost lost to that of just ships it solves the problem of the risk adverse. Rough idea but putting it out there.

EDIT: Motherships!

--
Faction War Expands: Maybe faction warfare can expand into high sec. Additional systems on the fringes of the empires could be at risk of lowered security status. Trade routes could be at risk of being reduced to low-sec due to the enemy striking deeper. Pirates would then move in...
--
Home: I support the idea of an expansion that improves on a sense of Home. But we need Starbase 2.0 for most of my ideas to work.

_ _

Toterra
Parental Control
Didn't want that Sov anyway.
#17 - 2013-01-18 18:39:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Toterra
Brainstorming here as well...

I like the theme along the lines of Watering Holes. Basically creating content for players to consume (PVE), and by extension for other players to then consume those players (Gank) and more players to consume the gankers (PvP)....

This could include things like...

1. Some mechanic similar to POSs for players to base out of that are not horrible like POSs or as limited as simply a container. (PVE)
2. Extending the Faction war type mechanics into null-sec in some way to create sites for small gangs to engage other small gangs. (PVE)
3. A way for small gangs to attack resources in larger empires on a small scale (raiding moon goo for example) (Gank/PvP)
4. Black ops changes (Gank/PvP)
5. An alert system or a mayday system to summon a response quickly if attacked (PvP)
6. Further balancing of ships (All)
7. Hi-sec wardec mechanics improvements including improvements to Mercinaries (Gank/PvP)
8. Extending the bounty system. (Gank/PvP)
9. Major improvements to NPC Null-sec income sources. (PvE)
10. Improvements and variety of missions. (PvE)
11. More pirate epic arc mission. (PvE)

And other ideas along the line. The idea being that PvE content be added in such a way that it can be attacked, and defended.

Edit: Since Watering Hole is not a name the title would be something like 'Jungle'.
Silvonus
Spacewreck Emporium
#18 - 2013-01-18 18:39:53 UTC
I said it in the POS theadnaught but: "Build your Empire"
WInter Borne
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#19 - 2013-01-18 18:48:57 UTC
EVE Online: Renaissance
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#20 - 2013-01-18 18:51:05 UTC
Silvonus wrote:
I said it in the POS theadnaught but: "Build your Empire"

I like where this guy's head is at ^

I second "Build your Empire" +1

Signatures should be used responsibly...

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