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Payroll advice needed

Author
Jade Jasman
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-01-10 15:56:33 UTC
So I have played eve for close to 6 years now and most of that time I spent as CEO but the largest problem I have always encountered was rewarding members for their hard work in making the corp successful. I have tried using shares to pay out but that gets messed up should someone go inactive with them, and member dividends work but I run into the problem of the people who weren't online during ops.

I'm looking for an easy straight-forward way of rewarding those that work harder for the corp more then those that just sit around and do their own things. (More Work = More money, Less work = get a job you lazy bum!) I see corps like Red Frog that have a solid and growing business and can't help but wonder how they operate it so that both the members and the corp profit from it.

At this point in time I'm getting so desperate I'm almost willing to hire a full time payroll person so if anyone has any advice on the matter I would love to hear from them.
Gauis Scipii
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#2 - 2013-01-10 16:10:27 UTC
For ops use excel to set up a payroll. I think we used google version for ops while I lived in WH Space. You can link them the spreadsheet and have them put their name in and go from there. If they are mining, put them down for a share or something. What kind of ops are you doing? Please contact if you need anymore help.
Annunaki soldier
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-01-10 16:13:03 UTC
they work it differently. Instead of managing the things as you do start thinking percentages per week. You need to calculate your expenses per week then from the profit give percentages to the people that generates em. The more they are giving the more they will get. So their motivations is actually their own work . Feel free to convo me in game to speak about organising it for you to get it started and how it will cost you (Dont really know how large it can be and time consuming plus how you operate)

Ride hard, live with passion 

Kiger Wulf
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2013-01-10 16:20:10 UTC
This completely depends on the ops you're currently doing. If you're primarily mining, just keep a record of who mines what for the corp and pay accordingly.
Jade Jasman
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-01-10 17:30:25 UTC
Without giving away too much of my business plan, I have a logistics and support corp that runs dedicated support operations for a small collection of corps. At the moment mostly transportation services for massive amounts of minerals or gear. I do have a small mining division that I am hoping to develop into a full scale manufacturing of ships and moduals for the corps I service. The problem comes with figuring out the ratio's and payoff for each individual member when they are helping the corp outside of the well-planned for ops. Like a salary for members to stay productive in between ops but I don't want to pay as much for someone who is on 2 hours a day to run missions for themselves compared to the person that's rolling 5 to 8 hours a day mining up the corp stockpile.
Krystal Blades
Crystal Sabers
#6 - 2013-01-10 18:07:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Krystal Blades
My CEO uses corp contracts for this. He setup up several open contracts avail to corp members for goods and wares generally only slightly below jita buy prices. I win because I get paid a fair amount for my work without having the hassle of hauling and the corp benifits the same by getting materials and needed modules at a fair price. It has always seemed like a win/win for both player and corp. The contracts are always avail so if I feel like working for the corp I know that I am going to get paid for my efforts. And with emphsis on saving time hauling the goods to local trade hubs it also makes me a lot more inclined to do corp work than my own solo thing.
Jade Jasman
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-01-10 18:29:09 UTC
That sounds pretty solid Krystal Blades. I have always left it open ended for the most part just going for raw materials that are dumped into corp hanger but there isn't a paper trail with that method hard to determine exact quantities especially is a third person hauler if used between a few miners. But to have open corp contracts on a set amount of raw minerals or items to be filled by members does take the micro-managing I hate to do out of the equation, leaving taxes set at 10% for the mission allows the corp plenty of room for growth without it becoming a second job to the members

Thanks for that bit of info it certainly gives me a lot to think about and decide where to place my price margins so that the corp and members can both profit.
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#8 - 2013-01-11 04:09:38 UTC
Jade Jasman wrote:
So I have played eve for close to 6 years now and most of that time I spent as CEO but the largest problem I have always encountered was rewarding members for their hard work in making the corp successful. I have tried using shares to pay out but that gets messed up should someone go inactive with them, and member dividends work but I run into the problem of the people who weren't online during ops.


My corp hasn't been very active yet, in spite of being rather old, but I've had ideas along two lines:

One is Corporate Merit Points. You accumulate these for contributing to the corp, with various kinds of work or effort, and your total translates into a Rank, which shows how dedicated you are to the corp. MP cannot be spent, they simply accumulate, and so are meaningless if you leave the corp, although if you leave in good standing and then come back, you probably ought to resume your MP accumulation from where it began.

The other is Corporate Loyalty Points. These are earned for donating things to the corp, e.g. specific quantities of ores or minerals (usually with a limited amount of times you can do each donation, e.g. one quantity of 100k Veldspar = 1 LP once, one quantity of 400k Veldpsar = 2 LP once) or flat out donate ISK, and also for participating in corp activities where the profits go to the corp, e.g. mining ops (note that this is subjective). Corporate LP can then be exchanged for goods with the corp, e.g. the EVEmail the member in charge of LP and tells him what you want. He then gives you the items from the corporate storage, and deducts the cost in LP from your total.

Corp LP stay with you when you leave (unless you leave on bad terms), and you can freely spend them while out of the corp, and of course their accumulation resumes when you re-join.

MP don't do much, so they're essentially bragging rights. They obviously shouldn't be a prerequisite for most corporate positions, as these should be awarded based on skill and on how much the CEO trusts you.

LPs have the problem that you can buy just about everyhing off the Market anyway, so it's not very attractive, although for some there might me a not-really-rational pleasure in getting a T2 Frigate from the corp instead of buying it with ISK. Even though you still bought it, just with LP. If CCP releases some kind of corp logo hull decal thing, then this will change a bit, because then logo'ed hulls might become a LP-only thing, although they can of course still be re-sold.

Also, both methods contain large subjective elements. MP is wholly subjective, and the objective component of LP is labour-intensive. Especially if you keep track of separate donations of different ore sub-types, e.g. there's one one-time "slot" for donating normal Veldspar, one for donating C. Veldspar, one for donating D. Veldspar, then three more one-time slots for donating a larger amount, and three more for a very large amount (which might not be one-time only ones). That'll require a huge document just to show all the options, and keeping track of who has already done utilized which donation options requires some effort.
Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight
Red-Frog
#9 - 2013-01-17 19:18:51 UTC
Jade Jasman wrote:

I'm looking for an easy straight-forward way of rewarding those that work harder for the corp more then those that just sit around and do their own things. (More Work = More money, Less work = get a job you lazy bum!) I see corps like Red Frog that have a solid and growing business and can't help but wonder how they operate it so that both the members and the corp profit from it.


Actually, Red Frog doesn't make any money out of our operation.

the pilot keep 90% of the rewards, and return 10% of those to the insurance fund.

We wish there would be taxes on corp contract, but there isn't!

In your case, as some other mentionned, you should work out an excel sheet (kinda like Dedaf's tool mining op calculator)

Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#10 - 2013-01-19 15:16:32 UTC
Jade Jasman wrote:
Without giving away too much of my business plan, I have a logistics and support corp that runs dedicated support operations for a small collection of corps.


Zaibatsu?

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0

Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2013-01-19 16:22:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Freighdee Katt
As Rufen said, Red Frog really doesn't manage their people directly. They're just a contracts clearinghouse for the corp members, who pick up contracts on whatever schedule they please. You assign contracts to Red Frog, members (as I understand it), just claim them on a first-come, first-served basis. The pilot who takes the contract is responsible for the collateral, and gets the commission at the end.

You could do something similar using private contracts with your own corp if you want. Just post WTB or courier contracts for standard, manageable quantities of things you want to have produced or moved, and make them available to your corp only. People do the work, fill the contract, get the reward. I believe you can post a high number of private, in-corp contracts by default even without Contracts skill trained, so it should be an easy thing to do.

You can also generate a lot of in-corp business between members themselves this way, if you just organize some basic services and set up a program of standard contracts people can post and fill. E-UNI does this with ship building, where they set a schedule of standard, discounted ship prices for every T1 hull, and anyone in the corp could post a WTB contract for 1x of a specific hull, at the stated price, whenever they wanted one. Either the manufacturing officer would fill it, or if someone else happened to have one they wanted to get rid of, another random member might fill it on their own.

Courier contracts work by the same logic with a little standardization to ensure they will be doable by anyone. For small quantities, look at the max volume available to someone with the smallest T1 hauler at skill level IV, and make sure all your small contracts are that size or smaller. Set a standard rate for isk/jump, appropriate collateral not to exceed a "safe" number for the typical T1 hauler, and you're in business.

If you have people with freighters, you can follow Red Frog's pattern; no more than 860,000 m3, collateral not to exceed 1B ISK, and 350K isk/jump standard rate (or whatever you find is fair).

EvE is supposed to suck.  Wait . . . what was the question?