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Instead of adding "superores" to NullSec...

First post
Author
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#1 - 2013-01-09 22:01:42 UTC
How about they just make all minerals available everywhere, and just change the yields between High, Low, Null?

So for instance -

HighSec would have unnamed basics - Veldspar, Scordite, Plagioclase, Omber, Kernite, and Pyroxeres. It would also have Gravimetric sites which spawned at an average of 1 per system per x amount of days (don't want to make it too easy nor too hard) that contained medium and higher end ores; Hedbergite, Gneiss, and small ABC rocks mixed in. This would make Megacyte and Zydrine available to Empire space. Save for Technetium (which is a problem I won't even get into in this post), Empire would become independent from NullSec.

LowSec would have the 5% basics, and medium ends would appear in belts (I would also suggest that medium ends start appearing as early as 0.4 - right now there's no point in mining in a 0.4 system because they only have basics). Higher end ores would appear in Gravimetric sites. (There could also be additional benefits for performing Industrial activities in LowSec, however, I will not address that in this post, either).

NullSec would have the 10% basics, the mediums, and higher end ABCs would appear in belts. Mining in NullSec would be more lucrative and attractive to higher skilled Indy pilots. In addition to NullSec Indy buffs that have been suggested elsewhere, NullSec could begin to operate independently of HiSec, and have it's own markets that don't rely on jumping things in from Jita.

This would increase quality of life for all people involved; NullSec would be happier with a beefier, more efficient Industry, and the distribution of resources would just make more sense.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#2 - 2013-01-10 00:32:18 UTC
Moving this from Science & Industry to Features and Ideas.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#3 - 2013-01-10 00:47:47 UTC
Nullsec industry does not need to be nerfed. Hichsec income does not need to be buffed.

next.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#4 - 2013-01-10 15:32:09 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
Nullsec industry does not need to be nerfed. Hichsec income does not need to be buffed.

next.


Obviously did not read the post.

Next.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#5 - 2013-01-10 15:54:00 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Nullsec industry does not need to be nerfed. Hichsec income does not need to be buffed.

next.


Obviously did not read the post.

Next.



Tell me again how adding nullsec ores to highsec, even in limited quantities, does not constitute a nerf to nullsec mining?
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#6 - 2013-01-10 15:56:04 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Nullsec industry does not need to be nerfed. Hichsec income does not need to be buffed.

next.


Obviously did not read the post.

Next.



Tell me again how adding nullsec ores to highsec, even in limited quantities, does not constitute a nerf to nullsec mining?


The answer is in the post. YOOZ UR BRANE

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Xavier Thorm
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2013-01-10 16:12:39 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Nullsec industry does not need to be nerfed. Hichsec income does not need to be buffed.

next.


Obviously did not read the post.

Next.



Tell me again how adding nullsec ores to highsec, even in limited quantities, does not constitute a nerf to nullsec mining?


The answer is in the post. YOOZ UR BRANE


I'm honestly not seeing it either, care to explain?
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#8 - 2013-01-10 16:19:30 UTC
Xavier Thorm wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
Nullsec industry does not need to be nerfed. Hichsec income does not need to be buffed.

next.


Obviously did not read the post.

Next.



Tell me again how adding nullsec ores to highsec, even in limited quantities, does not constitute a nerf to nullsec mining?


The answer is in the post. YOOZ UR BRANE


I'm honestly not seeing it either, care to explain?


Okay how does supply and demand work?

Also, adding unnamed medium to high ores to gravimetric belts (non-static, non-predictable) would not be a major "buff" to HiSec. Removing the named ores from HiSec would actually represent a nerf.

NullSec mining would still be king over the others. Add a few buffs to NullSec industry and it would be even more attractive.

LowSec Industry would start to become viable.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Eliniale
Co-operative Resource Extraction
#9 - 2013-01-10 16:54:21 UTC
Honestly i still have something of an issue with only null getting acces to the ABC, and moonmining, and gas, etc.

Since basically both TII and TI production can be done in nullsec.

Now i'm not here to shout that ABC should all come to highsec, gods that would be horrendous. But having null be more about the TII and high (or at least empire) be more about the TI would be a good thing.

Sprinkling more high value ores into higher sec statusses would accomplish this quite easily. The odd out rock of crock in a 0.2 belt, and some ark in 0.4 grav sites wouldn't be too much fo a nerf to null (whose income is already insane as it stands), nor too big a buff to empire (who relies more on quantaty rather than quality at any rate).

So honestly i wouldn't mind a slightly more even division of rocks.

System ideas: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=191928&find=unread

Xavier Thorm
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-01-10 17:24:05 UTC
Xuixien wrote:


Okay how does supply and demand work?

Also, adding unnamed medium to high ores to gravimetric belts (non-static, non-predictable) would not be a major "buff" to HiSec. Removing the named ores from HiSec would actually represent a nerf.

NullSec mining would still be king over the others. Add a few buffs to NullSec industry and it would be even more attractive.

LowSec Industry would start to become viable.


This doesn't clarify your argument, it just restates it as a fact. Nullsec industry is currently almost nonexistent with the exception of things that can only be manufactured in sov space (supercaps), your claim that "NullSec mining would still be king" even after a change which gives people less incentive to mine in nullsec does not make sense to me.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#11 - 2013-01-10 17:28:50 UTC
Xavier Thorm wrote:
Xuixien wrote:


Okay how does supply and demand work?

Also, adding unnamed medium to high ores to gravimetric belts (non-static, non-predictable) would not be a major "buff" to HiSec. Removing the named ores from HiSec would actually represent a nerf.

NullSec mining would still be king over the others. Add a few buffs to NullSec industry and it would be even more attractive.

LowSec Industry would start to become viable.


This doesn't clarify your argument, it just restates it as a fact. Nullsec industry is currently almost nonexistent with the exception of things that can only be manufactured in sov space (supercaps), your claim that "NullSec mining would still be king" even after a change which gives people less incentive to mine in nullsec does not make sense to me.


I'm going to reply to this in the proper EVE-Troll Fashion:

"Please explain to me how removing named ores form HiSec and making them only available in NullSec removes incentive to mine in NullSec."

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Destoya
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#12 - 2013-01-10 18:39:09 UTC
A 10% bonus to mining yield is not nearly emoigh incentive to mine in nullsec, just so you know.

That is all.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#13 - 2013-01-10 19:01:12 UTC
Destoya wrote:
A 10% bonus to mining yield is not nearly emoigh incentive to mine in nullsec, just so you know.

That is all.


So ABC ores in belts won't attract miners huh.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Xavier Thorm
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#14 - 2013-01-10 19:13:11 UTC
Xuixien wrote:


I'm going to reply to this in the proper EVE-Troll Fashion:

"Please explain to me how removing named ores form HiSec and making them only available in NullSec removes incentive to mine in NullSec."


Belt mining is already unpopular (in other words, basically nonexistent) in many parts of NullSec due to the danger. You seem to be suggesting that your idea of removing named ore from hisec while simultaneously adding more types of ore TO hisec is a net gain for nulsec, which is which I don't believe is correct.

Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#15 - 2013-01-10 19:21:57 UTC
Xavier Thorm wrote:
Xuixien wrote:


I'm going to reply to this in the proper EVE-Troll Fashion:

"Please explain to me how removing named ores form HiSec and making them only available in NullSec removes incentive to mine in NullSec."


Belt mining is already unpopular (in other words, basically nonexistent) in many parts of NullSec due to the danger. You seem to be suggesting that your idea of removing named ore from hisec while simultaneously adding more types of ore TO hisec is a net gain for nulsec, which is which I don't believe is correct.



TueFact: Belt mining in NullSec is safer than in HiSec. But if you nullbears are still too skiddish to do it even with a 10% buff, then simply add low-ends to all the gravimetric sites in NullSec and problem solved.

It's not hard, really.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Meytal
Doomheim
#16 - 2013-01-10 19:47:32 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
Empire would become independent from NullSec.
...
NullSec could begin to operate independently of HiSec

These two reasons -- though primarily the first one, since Null is CCP's baby -- are why this proposal will fail. And to be honest, interdependency between all regions of space is healthy for the game, so trying to make each area independent from one another is probably a bad idea.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#17 - 2013-01-10 19:50:43 UTC
Meytal wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
Empire would become independent from NullSec.
...
NullSec could begin to operate independently of HiSec

These two reasons -- though primarily the first one, since Null is CCP's baby -- are why this proposal will fail. And to be honest, interdependency between all regions of space is healthy for the game, so trying to make each area independent from one another is probably a bad idea.


Yes because mining ABC's in NullSec, jumping them to HiSec to sell, then buying what you need from the HiSec market to jump back to the NullSec trade station is a sensical and efficient way of promoting inter-regional commerce.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#18 - 2013-01-10 20:15:42 UTC

I'm sorry, I don't see how this is anything other than a major boost to highsec.... You essentially reduce Highsec's dependence on nullsec by giving concord-protected miners access to all minerals...

Perhaps if we changed the "bonus" to refining named ores...

Example, reduce the refining output of an unnamed ore to about 10% of it's current output... and then named is a 100 fold increase in refined minerals, and best named is a 1000 fold increase... or some such non-sense...

Even then... lets not go down this path because highsec SHOULD be dependent on nullsec!
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#19 - 2013-01-10 20:20:54 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

I'm sorry, I don't see how this is anything other than a major boost to highsec.... You essentially reduce Highsec's dependence on nullsec by giving concord-protected miners access to all minerals...

Perhaps if we changed the "bonus" to refining named ores...

Example, reduce the refining output of an unnamed ore to about 10% of it's current output... and then named is a 100 fold increase in refined minerals, and best named is a 1000 fold increase... or some such non-sense...

Even then... lets not go down this path because highsec SHOULD be dependent on nullsec!


CONCORD? My 700 DPS Catalyst would like a word with you.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist

Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#20 - 2013-01-10 20:39:17 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

I'm sorry, I don't see how this is anything other than a major boost to highsec.... You essentially reduce Highsec's dependence on nullsec by giving concord-protected miners access to all minerals...

Perhaps if we changed the "bonus" to refining named ores...

Example, reduce the refining output of an unnamed ore to about 10% of it's current output... and then named is a 100 fold increase in refined minerals, and best named is a 1000 fold increase... or some such non-sense...

Even then... lets not go down this path because highsec SHOULD be dependent on nullsec!


CONCORD? My 700 DPS Catalyst would like a word with you.


You need a lot more than 700 dps to gank my mining alt before concord arrives... Big smile

On a related note: I'm aware that everything in highsec is suicide gankable.... but that in itself is not justification for moving rare ores to highsec.... not unless you make everyone wardecable, and make it harder to escape wardecs...

p.s. if you ever find this character "mining", it's not there for the ore...

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