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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Titan Bridges… Fair or Not?
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Dan Carter Murray
#101 - 2012-12-26 20:58:30 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Chandaris wrote:

If you had any ability to intel-gather at all, you would know that respecting 1v1's and pre-arranged fights is a founding principle of our alliance, and failure to comply with that golden rule on the part of anyone of our pilots results in ejection from our corp.

It's not like it's not written on our alliance description or anything.

i stopped to believe to word written in public accessible places... i dunno.... like 20 years ago?


I called that number in the public accessible place...it wasn't a good time...her name wasn't Lucy...she wasn't a woman...

http://mfi.re/?j7ldoco 50GB free space @ MediaFire.com
Abannan
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#102 - 2012-12-27 14:37:01 UTC
I don't think them being fair is relevant. The fact of the matter is those corps/alliance have pooled together billions of isk for the luxury of being able to use a titan bridge, so they have the right to use it as and when they please
ALUCARD 1208
Jerkasaurus Wrecks Inc.
Sedition.
#103 - 2012-12-27 17:17:35 UTC
Armeggeda iscariah wrote:
"wahhh i got titanbridged on , nerf titans wahhh" Getting titan bridged on is like getting scammed , if you fall for it then you deserve it.

Titan bridging is easy to counter , be prepared for it or warp the **** off when a cyno goes up instead of going "Hmmm..there's a shiney orb next to the ship we are Ganking....i should do something....but what is it.....HMMMMMMM...OH YES , I SHOULD GET THE **** OUT."
( Here's a kicker. If you get bridged on , you were most likely ganking somebody. But you probably forgot that with the cry's of terror when you saw a cyno huh and went "that's unfair! i was ganking this poor soul!" Roll )

Anywho....
There is a considerable delay between jumping through a bridge to a cyno and loading grid. also if you account for the pilot(s) reaction time to actually click jump , load grid and lock you up it's about 4-6 seconds. PLENTY of time for you to make a decision to warp off, burn away or brawl. You may lose the poor scrub who got tackled but this is eve, **** explodes all the time.
If you find this unfair , go back to highsec where you belong because you aren't in the correct mindset to be in low/null.




THIS.....

BEBOPS ODE TO PERUNGA
Chandaris
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#104 - 2012-12-27 17:22:55 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
[quote=Chandaris]i stopped to believe to word written in public accessible places... i dunno.... like 20 years ago?


a) somewhere only our ceo can post to is hardly a 'public place'
b) i find our lack of faith disturbing
c) ZOMG HOT DROP
Lonig
Destruction Unlimited
#105 - 2012-12-27 20:35:16 UTC
Not enough members to counter a blob? Get more members.
Don't want to get more members? Deal with losing to blob or move.
Can't build a Titan with available resources(minerals/members/sov in space need)? Get more resources.
Don't want to build up resources? Deal with Titans, or move.
Fair fights are funner? Opinions are just that, opinions.


I fail to see why people complain like this. Especially when they don't see that they are. Someone out there took the time to make the Titan. They took the time to setup the blob. They took the time to prepare to attack you. Why then, shouldn't they be allowed to do whatever they want? You have every right to defend, and if you can't, you should accept the loss and move on. No one said you had to undock, no one said you had to stay in the system, no one said you have to stay in your alliance/corp.

This may be a game, and it might not have been fun to you to be the receiving end of a sudden bridge or blob. But it may have been the most fun in-game yet for someone else. Maybe it was a training exercise, and they found you all and decided to make you part of the exercise? I'd commend the Fleet Com for having the ability to lead and turn training into hands on training.

Either way, leave things the way they are. Bridging attacks and blobs might suck for you sometimes, but it should increase your awareness and enhance your skills now that you know they are a threat. Your corp/alliance will now be on better guard and increases your control of the system by doing so. Increase your resources to handle a blob.

For every pvp battle, there is a loser. Gudfights or not, it occasionally stings. And this is coming from someone who hasn't had much success in the game. I tend to lose, but now I'm a paranoid freak even in high sec ventures. My alt list grows with more and more scanner alts by the day.

Prepare and dominate, or die. EVE is a harsh place, and removing the harshness will not increase the fun factor.
Malaugrym
State War Academy
Caldari State
#106 - 2012-12-27 20:56:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Malaugrym
Dragnarok wrote:



We have scouted, and we have found out about some of the Titan pilots... but then a new Alliance or Coalition comes in and drops a fleet over our heads, then another one, and another one, and so on. Would you believe me if I told you after we got wrecked by a 16 man fleet hotdrop, we chased them and forced them to log off in stations with a fleet of 6? Would you? Their biggest ship was BCs (several of them), our biggest ships were BCs too (we only had 2 of them). We chased them with our fleet so that we could kill as many of them as possible before going down... yeah, we did. Guess what they did. They warp to me, their scout jumps in the system where my 5 friends are, and all of their fleet scatters like roaches from the gate we were at... After they trashed talked for like 5 min they logged off. 10 min later they log back on and run. This is what we have to deal with, with bigger fleets that catch us by surprise but run like cowards at the sight of fleet put together to counter them (even if they outnumber us by 3 to 1).




So you know, I too would do a Titan-Bridge on an unsuspecting fleet for the LOLs of it. But I WOULD REFUSE to use it a Warfare Tactic against a small corp or coalition. I would give the small corp a fighting chance... and believe me, PvPing in EVE would be far more fun than it is right now. IF I were to use a Titan-Bridge as a warfare tactic to BLOB a fleet on a daily basis, I am pretty much admitting that I am scared of that corp and that I don't have what it takes to PvP. SO MY GOOD SIR, I AM NOT THE ONE WITH THE ATTITUDE WHO IS KILLING EVE, BUT YOU ARE. Denial at its finest. YOU REFUSE TO SEE THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE WHAT IT TAKES AND SHOW SUPREMACY BY TAKING ON THE SMALLER CORP ON AN EQUAL FOOTING. Go use your Titans against corporations that can use Titans too. All you are doing is picking on the weaker corporations so to make your kill-board look better. Hence, the definition of coward. Now, If you have a brain you would realize that what I am saying is true, and that you do have access to better resources at your disposal than corporations like mine. And if you are intelligent, you would not respond and continue this pointless discussion. But if you do not see eye to eye with me, then please realize that I will just agree to disagree with you. Have yourself a nice day, and keep on flying with the you belief that I am the one ruining EvE.

Taunting you and ridiculing you any further will defeat the purpose of this Forum-Post, and it will derail this Post away from my scope of posting this forum. So do me a favor (and also the likes of you) to please move along. You are welcomed to post a discussion board about my POST, and i will be more than happy to join that post and discuss with you to your hearts content.

Now, for the rest of my peers that have something constructive to add to this forum, I MUST APOLOGIZE for taking such a lengthy post to respond to this coward and the likes of him.


Your argument contains nothing that can be likened to logic. Instead, you rely on ad hominem reasoning in hopes of "proving" your point. You fail sir.

To address your only true argument, only fools fight fair battles. Do not come groveling to the forums demanding game mechanics changes simply because you are weaker than your adversary. Increase your combat power or withdraw from whichever conflict you are engaged in.

Titans are expensive and time consuming precisely because of the benefits they provide. Against the weak(you and I) they are expected to reign supreme.

You call those who titan-drop cowards because they "refuse to fight fairly." You are incorrect. You come to the forums requesting game changes to fit your current situation, rather than putting in the effort to make your situation different. You, sir, are a coward asking others to fight your battles for you.

This is Eve Online, not your childhood softball team where even the losers get a trophy. This is a sandbox universe with multitudinous ways of dealing with any one threat. If you are unwilling or unable to use those options to your benefit, that is your own personal failure. Any change to game mechanics because of this type of request/post would be base negligence on CCPs' part.

TL;DR: Deal with the threats presented within the bounds of the game. If you are incapable of doing so, change your situation by the same methods. You DO NOT have a "right to win." If you are weak, expect to lose.
Victor Bastion
Danger Management
#107 - 2012-12-27 21:48:29 UTC
The great thing about Titan Bridging is that it allows you to project power over great distances.
The bad thing about Titan Bridging is that it allows you to project power over great distances.

In a post on EN24 titled "A Letter to CSM7: Back ot the Gates" the situation with Titan Bridging was detailed in depth and discussed in depth in the comments. The OP of that article had some good points, but the best solutions to the problem were in the comments.

The solution I found most reasonable is the suggestion that if you want to bridge a fleet it should only be allowed between 2 Titans, one of which has to be in the target system already and takes the place of a Cyno to bridge too.

This means that before you can make use of the feature to bridge in a fleet you have to first commit to the fight a Titan. This would curtail the use of this feature for frivolous griefing, add a much needed new flavor to Null Sec war and might lead to some nice Titan kills! \o/ Now how can you not love that?
GhostDragoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#108 - 2012-12-27 22:41:36 UTC
Wey'oun wrote:
show me on the doll where the nasty piwates hotdropped you


seriously all these people bitching about titan hotdrops. its easily avoidable just get scouts in the titan home systems, be intelligent, its not difficult. This new eve attitude is what is killing eve. 'oh noes somthign that beats me, i must forum complain about the mechanics rather than think of a solution via ingame methods'


I tried to +10 this but it only lets me do it one....

+1 to you sir....
Stor Erik
Doomheim
#109 - 2012-12-31 15:46:36 UTC
Titan bridging have hardly any risk and requires zero skill.
I like the "get a Titan of your own" replay to, what if people actually followed your advice ?
We would all sit in a pos and stare up the ass of an erebus untill we died of old age because no one is out roaming.
Sivren Ravenwood
Ravenwood Defense Industries
#110 - 2013-01-01 09:28:10 UTC
I dont think it matters ether way. If you take away the Titan Bridge it will just take a little longer for them to get to you. They might lose 4 or 5 ships bit for the most part you still have to deal with there fleet. So what will be next to take away?
Juliade
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#111 - 2013-01-01 10:58:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Juliade
Hot drops are annoying. I've been on the receiving end of some of them (shout out to Snuff Box). However, in most cases you have enough time to get away, we just decided to stay and try to take it (operand word is try). Remember, OP asked specifically about lowsec, which has no bubbles that can be put up before lighting the cyno.

Now they might disrupt your activities and you might hate that. I personally hate it when people cyno tons of capitals into CCP events taking place in lowsec. However, during the thousands of years that people have killed each other, we invented a tactic to deal with bigger enemies. It's called guerilla warfare.

Indeed, I see a lot of problems with restricting cyno activity in lowsec, the worst of which is disruption of logistics. People in lowsec don't own space and there basically is no industry worth speaking of. At best, stuff is built on site with minerals that are hauled in by Jump Freighters which use, you guessed it, cynos to move around safely.

Granted, I don't know OP's specific case as he doesn't give us much intel and I haven't read every post here but if you are getting cockblocked by hotdrops all the time, just start avoiding the fleet until they realise that they can't catch you. After all, fleet cynos aren't THAT cheap (as I'm being told by some cap pilots I happened to speak with) and if they get blue balled by you all the time, they just won't drop on you any more.
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#112 - 2013-01-01 11:42:58 UTC
Sivren Ravenwood wrote:
I dont think it matters ether way. If you take away the Titan Bridge it will just take a little longer for them to get to you. They might lose 4 or 5 ships bit for the most part you still have to deal with there fleet. So what will be next to take away?

You severely underestimate the power of Sloth. The mere fact that they would have to spend 10 minutes to get to you would instantly remove 99% of all the cases .. and that is not even taking into account that the fight is probably over (or the quarry gone) by the time 'da blob' makes it on scene.

With bridges removed (not likely)/restricted (probably), people would have to start roaming around in combat capable gangs again rather than jumping a single over-kill fleet around to cyno's opened by alts ..
Ginger Barbarella
#113 - 2013-01-01 18:23:31 UTC
Sometimes there's just a bigger bully on the playground. You have options.

1. Punch the bully in the face to gain some respect.
2. Become BFFs with the bully (see: Renting Space, Pets)
3. Find a new playground that you can be the bigger bully in
4. Go rat out the bully to your teacher (see: Forum posting)
5. Get the **** over it

Which will you and your corporation choose?

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#114 - 2013-01-01 22:01:37 UTC
CCP took away the ability to have two jump bridges in the same system, yet they allow players to titan bridge a fleet into a system, then bridge out of the same system within seconds (in theory), just as jump bridges would.

Working as intended?

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Dread Operative
Lowlife.
Snuffed Out
#115 - 2013-01-01 22:46:45 UTC
OP didn't like being called out in forum and went wee wee wee all the way home it looks like.
Xakata
#116 - 2013-01-01 23:29:50 UTC
I was thinking suppers are not the only ships up for re-balancing, battle ships are also in line.
If the problem is the capability to project a counter force at will, then the solution may lie with the black-ops battle ship.

Specifically allow it to bridge any ship when it's a normal cyno - and only cov-ops when it's a cov-cyno.

Because these ships already have limited range this change should not create too much of a stir in in null sec politics and may in fact bring in more small roaming fleets and save null from it's boredom while simultaneously give low sec a viable high-sec build solution to this problem. If it's too much power then limit the number of ships that can be bridged or the total mass using the w-space worm-holes mechanism thereby forcing the use of multiple black-ops.

On the other hand if CCP want to keep FWar smaller and faster and less static than null sec - maybe titan bridging into official state war-zones should be blocked by Concord.

Just my 2c
Sivren Ravenwood
Ravenwood Defense Industries
#117 - 2013-01-02 02:13:02 UTC
Veshta Yoshida wrote:
Sivren Ravenwood wrote:
I dont think it matters ether way. If you take away the Titan Bridge it will just take a little longer for them to get to you. They might lose 4 or 5 ships bit for the most part you still have to deal with there fleet. So what will be next to take away?

You severely underestimate the power of Sloth. The mere fact that they would have to spend 10 minutes to get to you would instantly remove 99% of all the cases .. and that is not even taking into account that the fight is probably over (or the quarry gone) by the time 'da blob' makes it on scene.

With bridges removed (not likely)/restricted (probably), people would have to start roaming around in combat capable gangs again rather than jumping a single over-kill fleet around to cyno's opened by alts ..



I get what you are saying and you are right. I was just pointing out when some one wants to take a large group of **** to one system and engage a bunch of random's to small fleet/gangs its gona happen. There is always a work around to a problim.


But some one has the right idea make it where you can only move so much mass through a Titan Bridge. Our add anther skill that allows you move your ship using one.I think a skill that allows you to only take a certain ship size and maybe tech level. Tech level is kinda pointless over kill on it. But a good combo would be a Skill for each pilot to train up level 1 frig level 2 Destroy and on up to BS. But also have where the Titan bridge its can only move so much mass and maybe even have the mass it can move go up every level of the titan skill.


Those are just my thought some my like them others may hate them. Ether way I think it will make all party happy.
Chese Blacklighter
Doomheim
#118 - 2013-01-02 08:10:51 UTC
the thing i love about eve even though i am pretty new is its pretty realistic.

but, to put this in real world terms. im sure Iraq wanted the US nerfed during the Persian gulf war.
M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#119 - 2013-01-03 00:16:43 UTC
Wey'oun wrote:
seriously all these people bitching about titan hotdrops


*Sigh* Going to make me use the 300 reference...
The 300 Spartans wouldn't have been able to fight the Persians if the Persians were able to teleport right into the middle of Athens.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Bum Shadow
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#120 - 2013-01-03 10:01:09 UTC
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
Wey'oun wrote:
seriously all these people bitching about titan hotdrops


*Sigh* Going to make me use the 300 reference...
The 300 Spartans wouldn't have been able to fight the Persians if the Persians were able to teleport right into the middle of Athens.


If the persians had the technology. The spartans would have worshiped them like gods and not resisted them in the first place.

The persians would also not bother with something like Athens when they have spaceships either....