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PvE seriously needs to be overhauled
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Batto Rem
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#101 - 2013-01-01 03:14:23 UTC
I am conflicted on what i want to do with PVE, i want to make it more fun for people but at the same i want to make it less profitable in Empire in order for the risk to be balance.

I would make missions are harder, maybe put level 5 missions in empire? So people actually have to work together in order to do them. That is what i really loved about incursions. I got to fly with people i would never really fly with. I really enjoyed the community of it. I want that back but incursions are kind of dead now. If there was a way to make this kind of community in Null sec that would be great. That people have to work together in order to make isk or at least decent isk.

At the same time there should be activities that make isk that do not require other people because i know not everyone is into joining other. But i feel like those should not be as profitable as the group activities.

Working together will save Pve that is my answer. Make Null more profitable than Empire and that is all i want.
Hamalkar Baca
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#102 - 2013-01-01 03:39:49 UTC
Greetings to all, I am what most of you would call a Newbie. There are many facets of Eve that I love and one big facet that I hate. I came to Eve as a request of my life long best friend, which I keep in contact with via online games.

When we first came to Eve, since I always do allot of literature research, it didn't take long for me to realize that the game was created around a PvP environment. Now to me PvP is like sex: totally fine and encouraged between consenting adults, but totally un-exceptable when not agreed upon by both. I found it discouraging that to truly succeed in this game I would have to subject myself to being PKd. I mentioned this to my buddy, but he insists that we can do fine in high sec space (he really loves this game). I told him that the game is designed around PvP and that it would not be long before some schmuck would PK one of us and that would be the last day I played. Well that day was 23 months ago and I quit on the spot. My friend was quite displeased with this but he quit too since we only play to play together. Well after 22 months he still wanted to try again, and so we are back. Unfortunately I am back doing my literature research and the more I read the more discouraged I get.

The reason I mention all of this here is because I see this thread as a providing a great example of why I am doomed. Several times, in so many words, it has been posted that this game is not for me. While the OP and others have posted a desire to make this game better in ways that interest themselves, there are more out there that would have it remain the way it is; a game by design based upon PvP (which again, would be totally fine if it was constrained to consenting players only). I believe that there is such opposition because if there was enough fun available in high sec space then many of the needed victims would never have a reason to venture into the grasp of the PK populace.


To the OP: good luck with seeking improvement for this game, and forgive me for interrupting.
Petra Hakaari
Stalking Wolfpack
#103 - 2013-01-01 03:58:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Petra Hakaari
Hamalkar Baca wrote:
Greetings to all, I am what most of you would call a Newbie. There are many facets of Eve that I love and one big facet that I hate. I came to Eve as a request of my life long best friend, which I keep in contact with via online games.

When we first came to Eve, since I always do allot of literature research, it didn't take long for me to realize that the game was created around a PvP environment. Now to me PvP is like sex: totally fine and encouraged between consenting adults, but totally un-exceptable when not agreed upon by both. I found it discouraging that to truly succeed in this game I would have to subject myself to being PKd. I mentioned this to my buddy, but he insists that we can do fine in high sec space (he really loves this game). I told him that the game is designed around PvP and that it would not be long before some ******* would PK one of us and that would be the last day I played. Well that day was 23 months ago and I quit on the spot. My friend was quite displeased with this but he quit too since we only play to play together. Well after 22 months he still wanted to try again, and so we are back. Unfortunately I am back doing my literature research and the more I read the more discouraged I get.

The reason I mention all of this here is because I see this thread as a providing a great example of why I am doomed. Several times, in so many words, it has been posted that this game is not for me. While the OP and others have posted a desire to make this game better in ways that interest themselves, there are more out there that would have it remain the way it is; a game by design based upon PvP (which again, would be totally fine if it was constrained to consenting players only). I believe that there is such opposition because if there was enough fun available in high sec space then many of the needed victims would never have a reason to venture into the grasp of the PK populace.


To the OP: good luck with seeking improvement for this game, and forgive me for interrupting.



Not at all, there is nothing to forgive, and thanks for sharing your opinion.


I understand what you say and i partially agree, eve is basically built around pvp and for a game its really important to be rules for both sides to "stand each other", however, eve is slightly different, more like real life, you dont know what dumbarse youre gonna find at the next corner or when you go buy tobacco, you dont know if tonight youll go to bed with a broken teeth... this might be the reason because often ppl take this as much more than a game.

As an advice to you, ive only been powned twice in high sec, and both because of my own fault, the first one i was afk hauling stuff in a badger and got caught by a nado in highsec, and the second time i was confident (or dumb, hehehe) enough as to be careless while being wardecked, as i said, my own fault, no one is going to bother you if you arent flying a full'o-good hauler or a shinny ship or in wardec while in highsec, so if you went down to lowsec, you knew where you where going, so when you crossed that gate you kinda give your consent...


Since ive learned this lesson, i dont leave my rattlesnake floating afk on a gate or station, or my orca, and i never afk haul stuff, i always keep an eye on suicide gankers and i always fly pvp fitted ships while wardec, and stop my routine until its over.



I really hope you can find your balance and place in eve, im sure there is a spot for you :)

Because tities .
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#104 - 2013-01-01 04:02:04 UTC
that has to be a troll post. it has to be.

please let it be Cry
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#105 - 2013-01-01 04:07:51 UTC
Petra Hakaari wrote:
PD: I blocked that lil' monkey and im not reading him anymore, i hope he finally let it go and let you guys keep the constructive chitchat goin.


Because you are a shining example of constructive posting Roll

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#106 - 2013-01-01 05:21:42 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
People PVP for fun at the expense of increased risk and lack of profit (except for pirating). These same people PVE only to cover their expenses. If PVE were as fun as PVP, but without added risk, I'm sure there are a few people who wouldn't PVP anymore.

Whether that's a substantial amount of people or not is up for debate. It depends on how much people enjoy risk and the human element at their own monetary expense.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#107 - 2013-01-01 09:36:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Scatim Helicon
Sannye wrote:
I dont want any of that - I LIKE to know what missions i venture out in. I use PvE as an isk fountain, to found my pvp ship's. Sometimes it takes longer than expected, to get in the epic fleetfights - but it will happen, from time to time. Then you just have to have enough ships - be it dictors, hic's, carriers, dreads... anything. So, while it's all cool and dandy, that you want pve to be a themepark or whatever, i like it to be predictable. I would like to know what ressist's to equip, and what weapons to bring. I dont like random - in PvE.

You're literally saying that you prefer boring, repetitive, uninspired, easily botted content than for the game to be made interesting and challenging because that way you can grind a bit more isk without having to engage your brain or be exposed to any risk whatsoever.

Good grief.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
Conrad Makbure
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#108 - 2013-01-01 10:24:23 UTC
Batto Rem wrote:
I am conflicted on what i want to do with PVE, i want to make it more fun for people but at the same i want to make it less profitable in Empire in order for the risk to be balance.

I would make missions are harder, maybe put level 5 missions in empire? So people actually have to work together in order to do them. That is what i really loved about incursions. I got to fly with people i would never really fly with. I really enjoyed the community of it. I want that back but incursions are kind of dead now. If there was a way to make this kind of community in Null sec that would be great. That people have to work together in order to make isk or at least decent isk.

At the same time there should be activities that make isk that do not require other people because i know not everyone is into joining other. But i feel like those should not be as profitable as the group activities.

Working together will save Pve that is my answer. Make Null more profitable than Empire and that is all i want.



Hell, you're dead on with moving Level 5's back into empire space, as far as I'm concerned. The only way to get people into null is if they want to move out there.

The missions have to be more engaging though, moving the level 5's back into empire won't be enough...
FoxBird Freir
Bloomberg Horizont
#109 - 2013-01-01 11:10:56 UTC
Petra Hakaari wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
(Crocodile Hunter voice)



(/Crocodile Hunter Vocie)




And here is the example of that behavior i mean xDDDDD


You dont need to try to be a clown to get attention, you could just try to use reason and word, not just over and over and over the same dog-eared argument.


Good night, boy.


But, that exactly what you're doing. Whne people try to explain why they don't like your idea.

Anyway, currently i'd say anoms/wh has the best pve content in the game, it even has the chanse to allow new players to get "rich" with a bit of luck. So i say, don't start the rework where the game is at its best, start fixing the mindless grind.
Randolph Rothstein
whatever corp.
#110 - 2013-01-01 11:45:31 UTC
pve is fine the way it is
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#111 - 2013-01-01 11:57:57 UTC
I'd love to see unpredictability and smarter/tougher individual NPC's in my missions.

No need to change the payout, just make it so you couldn't rinse/repeat every single run through the same thing.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Sannye
Perkone
Caldari State
#112 - 2013-01-01 12:02:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Sannye
Scatim Helicon wrote:
Sannye wrote:
I dont want any of that - I LIKE to know what missions i venture out in. I use PvE as an isk fountain, to found my pvp ship's. Sometimes it takes longer than expected, to get in the epic fleetfights - but it will happen, from time to time. Then you just have to have enough ships - be it dictors, hic's, carriers, dreads... anything. So, while it's all cool and dandy, that you want pve to be a themepark or whatever, i like it to be predictable. I would like to know what ressist's to equip, and what weapons to bring. I dont like random - in PvE.

You're literally saying that you prefer boring, repetitive, uninspired, easily botted content than for the game to be made interesting and challenging because that way you can grind a bit more isk without having to engage your brain or be exposed to any risk whatsoever.

Good grief.



Exposed to risk is when im in lowsec or 0.0
Missions is to found ^.

If you trust CCP to change the NPC's in EVE, without compleatly overdooing it, fine. I dont.

But.. since i've been on an "evebreak" for allmost a year, then maybe i shouldnt be here on the forums at all.. lol
FDIC Agent
Doomheim
#113 - 2013-01-01 12:12:15 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Here is an article I wrote a few days ago discussing how missions could be revamped with a different mindset on what you would learn in the process. The article also talks about the tutorial a bit and in process of everything, players would be better prepared for PvP when the time comes.

that sounds like you don't want us to pve at all and more like you want us to pvp. i don't think that pve is supposed to be hard core challening like you are wanting.

stop trying to make me play a game you want me to and let me play the game how i want to. X
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#114 - 2013-01-01 12:37:10 UTC
Petra Hakaari wrote:

So to end up, my ideas are:


  • Increase difficulty on missions so ppl don't get bored.
  • Increase the number of Anomalies per system and its respawn time.
  • Revamp all anomaly system and pair them to missions to make them interesting.
  • Escalations earned in high sec stay in high say, and they cannot be soloed.
  • More variety on Incursions, more different kind of sites per HQ, Vanguard, Assault, and different type of Incursions for different pirate factions.





Hmmmmmmmmmm, can you tell me where i say that i want more cash and less difficulty?


EH? yeah, as suspected, you fail at reading and trolling.


Your first idea... well "increasing difficulty" how? Just adding more rats? That's not more fun, that's just more boring rats. Maybe you meant something different? If so, what?

Your second suggestion is purely about increasing the numbers. Perhaps you might way to read your own posts more carefully before rudely asking others to do so.

What do you mean by your 3rd suggestion? Make boring predictable anoms more interesting by making them into boring predictable missions? What problem does this solve? What benefits does this bring. Fun won't be one of them.

Your 4th? How does keeping escalations in hi-sec make them anything except safer and more lucrative? How does it make them more fun or challenging? That's not making PvE more fun, that's just keeping your pimp T3 safer.

Your 5th? Adding more 100% predictable PvE doesn't make that PvE less predictable or more fun. It just gives you a few more sites to learn by rote.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#115 - 2013-01-01 12:53:49 UTC
Petra Hakaari wrote:


There has been a lot of fuss about Incursions in high sec giving too much money, then it got nerfed and ppl stopped doing them so original reward had to be reset back, okay, not much solved.





You just broke the economy again, they were nerfed for a reason.
Oxylan
Blood Fanatics
#116 - 2013-01-01 13:22:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Oxylan
My ISK progresion, FYI im carebear who living in empire and i post form main, also im very active player +500day online, look at last graph.

To much money from hi sec, why so serious, Realy??

If it bleed we can kill it.
DSpite Culhach
#117 - 2013-01-01 13:24:19 UTC
Scatim Helicon wrote:
PvE's chief flaw is that its just so predictable.

Every level 4 has been run a hundred thousand times and had a guide written and uploaded to the internet, every NPC rat is named so that you can look them up and know in advance exactly what its abilities are, every asteroid type hands out its ore consistently until it expires. There's no danger of anything interesting or unusual ever happening so PvE focused players min-max their ship and fitting choices to optimise around this absolute predictability and run the grind over and over again until they fall asleep at the keyboard.

I've said before that the best way of making PvE fun is to make it a voyage into the unknown every time.


Your average EVE L4 MIssion:

IF (spawn_ships_in_correct_order) AND (can_tank_DPS) THEN
keep_shooting()
ELSE IF (spawned_too_much) AND (not_warp_scrammed)
warp_out()
END IF

If mission pockets just had a small pool, say 1-10, of packs of ship that got mixed, it might be enough as a first step. Could have

* battleships that like to fan out and snipe with sensor boosters.
* battleships that MJD out of range
* missile ships that try switching ammo types
* ships that when left alive too long are known to call for help
* frigs or destroyers or cruisers that only remote repair or boost or otherwise assist the enemy fleet.
* random special ship spawns that MIGHT have better drops, but are much more slippery and might try to warp off if not web/scrammed, so people might waste slots for a chance to catch them.
etc etc

Even with some randomized mixes the missions could be far more interesting.

Things point to the fact that PvE content is only a way to get new players that have never tried EVE before to have a better look. All I ever see is "This is a PvP game, why are you here if you want to solo PvE", well, my personal reason is that before I resort to fly as someone Corp monkey, I'd like to build up about a year worth of SP in skills and backup isk so I can fly different ships, and sticking my head in low/null to try content that also exists in highsec will just get my "isk fountain" to flow backwards.

I apparently have no idea what I'm doing.
Oxylan
Blood Fanatics
#118 - 2013-01-01 13:39:41 UTC
Guys come on, a lot people play EvE because they like pve and economy, 90% of players chose EvE to wach space and to become a part of big virtual space universe as main reason to play EVE, all additional features like pvp its only a dessert, in most cases glorify by people who think pvp is core of this game, ofc pvp is important mechanic and feature, but not a main thing and reason to chose and play EvE.

If it bleed we can kill it.
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#119 - 2013-01-01 13:47:08 UTC
Oxylan wrote:
Guys come on, a lot people play EvE because they like pve and economy


If you like PvE then EVE is literally the last game you should be playing.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
Oxylan
Blood Fanatics
#120 - 2013-01-01 13:57:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Oxylan
Scatim Helicon wrote:
Oxylan wrote:
Guys come on, a lot people play EvE because they like pve and economy


If you like PvE then EVE is literally the last game you should be playing.


I think same about pvp, i dont avoid pvp, somtime i do it on occasion, but here a lot games with better pvp which offer more dynamic and instant pvp, than waste few hours each day to fit and travel xx jump to be killed in less than 10sec to first gate blob, or waitig x hours in gate camp to kill industral, pve in EvE is more flexibility than pvp, because i feel realy freedom while i do pve things, and while i pvp in most cases i feel like slave of game mechanic .

PvP its awesome in some cases, but in long them suck a lot, and is nothing than killboards statistic farm.

Oh wait, im a stupid carebear who never taste a super roam, titans and caps fleet fight with 2000 + involed ;) dont wory, long time ago on alt i got like 180 kills during one month while roaming with some ally, i taste people rage on TS when somone bump a pixel titan by mistake ( pathetic behaviour) , i got like 500kills on main + alts solo or with few man fleet, belive me or not i know how pvp looks and tase, its a arduous unfrindly proces for me, and its not my thing in general...

If it bleed we can kill it.