Skill Discussions

Panther and Redeemer

Having flown every ship in the game, including all the fleet issue, pirate issue and marauders, i'd have to say a vargur lists as my favorite for a few reasons:


1: It can do all damage types.
2: Second fastest battleship in the game, second only to a mach.
3: Insane resists because it's a Tech 2 ship.
4: No reliance on cap to fire it's guns....It only needs it for shield tank.
5: It can seriously put out some serious DPS( think 1200+ DPS).
6: Autocannon fitted, it can hit targets at 70 kms, something wich a blaster boat could only dream of.

Since it's 4 guns do double damage, the low powergrid is more than enough for the items that use the most amount of power, and yes the low sensor strength is it's only real drawback, but then again the ships that can ECM it are ships that also do little damage to begin with like falcons or scorpions anyhow, not to mention having 3 utility slots open up top, wich one would without a doubt be a cloak and unlike other ships that need those 8 high slots to do maximum damage, doesn't affect a marauders damage output in a negative way and just takes longer to get a lock and can't be scanned down while cloaked.


My reasoning is based purely on one on one confrontations and the vindicator does a lot of damage, but it's all kinetic and heat based damage using weapons that are useless beyond 15 kms, while the vargur hits to 70 kms and when dealing with a vindicator, i'd switch to explosive damage wich the vindicator has very low resist towards that type of damage.


So unless the vindicator warps in right on top of the vargur where it can lock, web and warp scramble and fire away immediately afterwards, the vargur is heavily advantaged by being able to fire from a range where the vindicator can only fire up the MWD making it's signature quite a bit larger and burns through a lot of cap, and also burning cap for the tank until it gets into range to fire the blasters onto the vargur, wich itself is equipped with an AB( at least mine is), so it'll take time to catch up to it and the vargur will hit the vindicator with at least a good 10~15 volleys since autocannons fire pretty fast.


So the biggest variable is from what range does this fight start in order to reduce the natural advantage of autocannons basically, and in pvp confrontations, i'd also fit the vargur with a cap injector to take advantage of it's large cargo hold wich can hold a lot more cap charges than the vindicator ever would be able to, should the fight turn out to who runs out of cap first should both ships rely on their tank for extended periods of time.


I know marauders are a pain in the ass to train for, but they do have their advantages.

For close to 200mil sp, you really have no idea what you're talking about do you?

Let's list the things you mentioned that made me laugh:

AB PVP Vargur
Using a utility slot on the vargur for a cloak
Believing that you will ever be fighting ECM ships solo
Thinks anybody who flies a vindi won't fit an exp hardener right away
Thinks that a 1v1 manfight vindi vs vargur will ever happen

And the general way you think a pvp fight progresses, dear god.



Also, towards Demolishar, the reason I mentioned the powergrid being bad is the fact that it's very difficult to fit the guns, a heavy cap booster, a shield booster, MWD, and then also fill your 3 utility highs with useful things like smartbombs/neuts.

Well, here's my take on it......I don't gang **** with 10 ships versus a single hostile ship, post the kill on killboards and even attempt to claim it was PVP to begin with....That's one.


Two, in 0.0 space and in order to keep your ship safe and unscannable as well as allowing you to pick your targets, a cloak is pretty much mandatory and that goes double if you're in hostile space.


Three, i didn't say i'd be fighting ECM ships solo, i said it would take an ECM ship to jam me, despite my low sensor strenght and those ships don't do much damage so they'd have to call for backup, while my premise is 1 on 1 fights and prefferably with equal class ships( battleship versus battleship and so forth)....Not the defensless haulers some boast about killing as if it was a huge thing.


Fourth, fitting an explosive hardeners still makes the explosive resist the lowest on the ship.....I've tried every possible combination on a vindicator and explosive is always the lowest resist if you're aiming for an omni tanking ship with good resists towards all types of damage, and by good resists, i mean upwards of 80% resists across all damage types.....Marauders can acheive this and all T1, fleet or pirate ships simply can't do it unless you go for some crazy expensive fit.

D.P.S. = Damage Per Second

Your ship is repairing 1700 every 4 seconds?

So that means the Vindi is doing approximately 1600 D.P.S. x 4 seconds = 6400 damage in 4 seconds.

Which means you're dead regardless of your 85% resists... right? Am I failing on the math here guys?

And what do the calculations come out to when the guns are over-heated?

I think the Vindi can do around 2400 DPS approximately overheated... no boosters...

And you're assuming that the Vindi pilot doesn't have the proper ammo loaded. Right?

I dunno man. I think that tank would melt.

And if you're within 10 kms like most pvp situations? Hows your DPS then? How long til you cap out?

There is a natural enemy to pretty much every turret based, active tanked ship out there in 1 on 1 slugfests, and i'm surprised no one has mentioned it yet since it has several advantages:


The bhaalgorn....


1: It only has 4 turrets but does the same damage of 8, so it's the same as marauders in that sense.
2: It doesn't need ammo to fire it's guns, only cap so there's no need to ressuply for ammo.
3: It NOS and Neut bonus is insane in this thing as it can completely cap out BS's in record time( think under a minute easy).
4: With the cristals using so little cargo space, it leaves more than enough for cap charges and a capacitor injector of it's own.
5: It's actually cheaper than a vindicator .


Only a specifically fitted ship that uses missile launchers( they don't need cap at all) with a completely passive tank( also does not need cap) that's heavily tanked agaisnt laser damage( EM and heat) might have a chance against a bhaalgorn, and of those only 1 or 2 ships comes to mind:


Navy scorpion with 8 mid slots and using torpedos, both of wich don't need cap and can fire all damage types or the T2 variant in black ops form, the widow wich can sneak up to the bhaalgorn while cloaked and attack it by surprise and also has 8 mid slots but with higher base resists.

Passively tanked scorpion navy issue and rattlesnake may give the bhaalgorn a run for it's money again ;p