Issues, Workarounds & Localization

Station trade bug/bug abuse/exploit.

I've traded single item for ISK on station using "station trade".
I've checked twice amount of money I was offered and got different sum as a result of trade.

I've petitioned the case, but was not sure is it a bug or an exploit.

I got no sensible reply from GMs, except "is probably scam".
Replies from two different GMs to my petition were contradicted each other.

If it's a bug since I got similar looking sum of ISK but with much less zeroes, then GMs should just check it, and do not give unclear replies.
If it's an exploit (witch GM did not confirmed), that GM's claim to be "legal scam", let's investigate that in details.

I've checked forums. Only remark about similar kind of problem were in 2009. I expect that 3 years is enough to make an easy interface function to work proper way.

Direct station trade window and mechanic is very similar to any other MMO system. In every MMO, except EVE it's safe and usually bug free. I'm aware of 3 different methods: 1. There is an intermediate lock button - both sides press lock, check content of trade, then press Ok. 2. There is a delay in trade and Ok/Accept could not be pressed for a while after trade items were changed. 3. Item's placed in trade could not be removed at all - you ether accept it or cancel whole trade.

EVE uses 3rd method of trade protection but by unknown to me reason makes an exception for ISK. So one could change sum to more/less as much as he wants.

I suppose, it might be possible to change amount of ISK in trade to much less, while opponent pressing OK, but that still should be visible on both sides of trade.

In trade session mentioned above I saw no ISK change at all - I just got different sum as trade result. I suspect that some exploit or bug abuse exists, but it's much easier for GM's to reply "it's a scam", instead of normal investigation.

I really do not see how this bug/exploit fits in other allowed scams.

The 1st GM gave me a link to scam descriptions and anti-scam methods in WIKI:
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Scam

2nd GM claimed that this is not an official position of CCP, but gave no links to public EVE pages where "correct ways of trade" might be described. He also gave no explanation what for direct trade interface exists if it's not safe to use.

None GM gave any reasonable explanation how a problem described above could happen. I think none of them checked the transaction for glitches.

In common sense, scams, that EVE developers like, happens, when one do not check something carefully, or did something risky. Usually more complicated things gives more space for action for scammers. I honestly do not see how interface exploits fit into scam category. More over, recent statements from CCP developers specially claim that they looking to make game interface clear and easy understandable.

"The fog of war should not apply to the UI"
"Our goal this year has been to give you a better understanding ..."

I've been a victim of evil player actions several times in EVE, but after I was killed/robbed or abused another way, after some analysis it was always clear what I did wrong and what legal means opponents used. That's not in case of direct trade. I have no idea how resulting ISK could be changed without being visualized, and how this particular interface bug/exploit could be named "legal scam".

Players could assume that direct station trade is safe, since it works "like in any other MMO". There is no warning around trade window - "this method is unsafe and made only to trade with friends", or anything similar. Forbiddance of item removal from trade window also gives an idea to majority of non scam oriented players that anything could not be removed from trade. All market actions, witch also listed in mentioned above WIKI as safe, gives warnings when a player tried to do something "out of common price range". This also makes an impression that interface is safe and could be trusted to work "as intended".