These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE Technology Lab

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Final Year Dissertation - EVE Online Third Party Application

First post
Author
Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-11-17 11:05:16 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Logibro
Purpose of the Post

Questionnaires appear in many forms, whether they're from CCP or your local supermarket as these tools provide the respective company vital information regarding their customers. However, it isn't very often you will see a user on the EVE forums posting a questionnaire for their final year dissertation. If I could take about 5 -15 minutes of your time please can you fill out the following questionnaire, hopefully the questions are quick to answer but please provide as much information as possible.

Project Elaboration

As most players are aware game mechanics allow a user/s to infiltrate corporations and even alliances to use various Meta-gaming techniques such as theft of virtual in-game assets. There are a number of tools which can track a user’s EVE history, however a lot of these provide far too much information or just aren’t made available to the community. So the fundamental task is to create a simple application which tracks the user/s ingame history such as corporation, assets, contracts and wallet information. Where possible, I will make the application live for brief periods of time to show you what has been implemented or changed to help provide an incentive and more importantly legitimacy of the project.

Acedemic Research Question

There is a vast number of differing marking criteria and although this has been labeled as a dissertation it isn't a typical dissertation. However, this is the marking criteria I am trying to answer through my survey:

• A clear understanding of wider context and issues, thorough investigation and appraisal of similar products/work which are cited and referenced correctly
• Clear and consistent design and development. Correct application of selected processes, tools and techniques

The two main purposes of the post is to get a clear understanding of what your opinions on popular EVE Applications and to also get an idea of design requirements of the user. Both sections detailed above need to be researched, however, although I can read about designing an application in books and on the Internet it only provides so much information. The best place to find out information is from the community this is being designed for.

Future Improvements

The below URL provides a list of known applications available to the entire EVE Community the problem I see is that all of them are on different websites and maintained by different development teams. Even alliances tend to have their own people for creating third party tools, yet these systems are usually kept in house and rarely get released to the community. One area of development for example is housing systems similar to EVEMon and DOTLAN in one web application and is publically made available to the entire community.

EVE - Third Party Applications

User Disclaimer

I apologise for this section, however it is required by my project moderators so in the interests of ethics and ensuring each participant is aware of what their contribution will provide, please read the following details.

• Research will potentially be readily available outside of the EVE Online forums. If you do not wish for your responses to be added to my dissertation, please stipulate this desire at the end of your response.
• This thread is open to the public as well as the EVE Community; please do not post any personal data within the thread. Only virtual names, a link to the original post and your answers will be written into the final report.
• If you would like to submit an API code for testing purposes at a later date, please send me a private message with this information. Any API details provided will not be passed onto the project moderators when my dissertation and application is complete, instead I will be using my own account details to show the functionality of the application.

Please refrain from posting irrelevant information, if the response is deemed irrelevant it will not be taken into account during the design and development of the application.

If you have any questions regarding this brief, please feel free to message me and I will be happy to help where possible.
Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-11-17 11:05:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenji Balthazar
Brief Version of Project Summary

The purpose of the project is to piece together an application which can review a players character history. This particular application will detail information on an EVE player's account activity, for example where they have been and who they have been with.

Research Questions

1. Applications such as EVEMon & EVEBoard have very specific functions. In the sense of how these applications are designed what are your thoughts and opinions? For example, consider whether it is better as a downloadable or web application.

2. At Fanfest 2012 and in a past DEVBlog, CCP discussed licensing fees for third party application developers so they could charge anyone who downloaded the application a fee (see below link). What are your opinions on advertising to help fund future development of the application?

Monetizing Third Party Applications
EVE Keynote 2012 - 52 Minutes

Development Questions

1. Considering user friendliness and presentation, would you prefer a simplistic layout (e.g. ShatteredCrystal) or more complex like the main EVE website.

2. Following on from the previous question, what are your thoughts and opinions on background images? For example, would you feel it would be more presentable or a hindrance to those with disabilities (i.e. colour blindness)?

3. The below link is a detailed list of all currently available information you can attain through the API system. As a potential user what data would benefit you? For example, account status and a list of active characters will be useful, but what else?

EVE Wiki - XML API Details

4. Would you prefer the proposed application to be deployed as a website or downloadable application? Before answering, consider the ease of use and why it would benefit you in this format.
CCP Falcon
#3 - 2012-11-17 13:49:30 UTC

Lets stick some glue to this one for a while. Smile

CCP Falcon || EVE Universe Community Manager || @CCP_Falcon

Happy Birthday To FAWLTY7! <3

Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-11-17 14:12:34 UTC
Do you want response in this thread or via eve-mail?
Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-11-17 14:24:09 UTC
Preferably in the thread please, just for audit trail reasons when I hand it in. However, if you wish you are more than welcome to send it by EVE-Mail.
Sinkwa Maken
There's a Worm in my Hole
#6 - 2012-11-17 15:38:33 UTC
Hi Kenji

Could you please be a little more specific about what the goal of your research is? In academic terms, what is the 'research question' of your dissertation?

We may be able to help you better (and you may garner more interest) if we know what it is that you are trying to do.

From having re-read your opening posts several times, my understanding is that you wish to "to create an application which only uses transient data" that contains "systems similar to EVEMon and DOTLAN in one [public] web application". Is this correct or have I misunderstood?
Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2012-11-17 16:07:12 UTC
I'll adjust the post accordingly.
Gilbaron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-11-17 16:23:04 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:

Lets stick some glue to this one for a while. Smile



nobody reads the stickies ;)
Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-11-17 21:52:33 UTC
1.
Downloadable apps:
PROS: as they usually use only API for remote access they are not subjected to any server issues other than eve api downtimes. Since database of user API's is not stored externally its safer for users
CONS: have to be downloaded, instaled, hard to share info between players, platform specific (for example: Windows only), updates have to be instaled on each computer

Web apps:
PROS: easier to access, easier to share, available in IGB (usually), can interface with HTTP headers of IGB, runs on all platform, can run on mobile smartphone, updates are automatiacally available to all users
CONS: server access problems, heavy trafic issues, database subjected to attacks

Color, interface, ease of usage - irrelevant of platform, web page can be made to look and work just like moder desktop application (look at the jitonomic)

2.
CCP is the sole owner of EVE IP. They have right to charge people for earining money by using their IP.

BUT they should not charge people if they only get ISK or if they make cash that only covers server costs

3. irrelevant, anything that looks plesant to the eye and dont disturb usage of the app

4. irrelevant, anything that looks plesant to the eye and dont disturb usage of the app

5. Not sure what the question is suppose to answer. If what You mean is: "does the information available trough API would be usefull if presented in application", than YES, altough most of that info is avalable trough other applications (EVEM ON for example adds more and more API info with each release)

6. given pros and cons i would go with WEB, IGB, Mobile - eve is played outside of game as much as inside, so access trough mobile is essential. But when you are ingame you want to alt-tab as little as you can, so IGB access is a go.
Peter Powers
Terrorists of Dimensions
#10 - 2012-11-24 18:27:34 UTC
Kenji Balthazar wrote:
Questions

1. Applications such as EVEMon, DOTLAN & EVE Central Market have very specific functions. However, in the sense of how similar applications are designed what are your thoughts and opinions? Be specific on whether it works well as a downloadable application or whether it’d be better as a web application. Also take into consideration its layout and use of colours, even source code or potential bugs with the system can be considered.

it really depends on the use case, maps like dotlan, market data like eve central are quite nice to have as a website, and providing apis to build further applications on. The same goes for Killboards.
My Skill planning, Wallet app etc. i actually prefer a downloadable client,
and in that case when its opensource.
This is basically a question of how much trust i put into what.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:

What are your thoughts on advertisements? If this went through would you as a user be willing to accept carefully selected advertisements placed sparsely across the web application I create?

Many eve websites run on advertisemen already, and at the moment advertisements on fansites etc are permitted by CCP, i don't see why that would change.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:

3. What is your preferred colour scheme, would you want something simplistic and light/dark in nature such as Shattered Crystal or more complex like the main EVE website.
4. Similar to the previous question, what are your thoughts and opinions on background images? For example, would you feel this provides more interactivity or would it be a hindrance to those with disabilities (i.e. colour blindness)?

3. that depends alot on the purpose of the website, you can't put a site like eveonline.com on the same design like a shattered crystal or vise versa - it allways depends on the requirements of the information you want to display. I believe for what you are suggesting i'd prefer a simple clean look - and thats neither shattered crystal nor eveonline.com
4. personally i'm not a big fan of too much background images, however ccp's web designers have found the right mix to make it bearable.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:

5. Taking a look through the table in the below link, what XML information would benefit you as a user when checking account information via this application?

EVE Wiki - XML API Details

For example, Account Status and Corporation History XML sheets would be useful to the user, however map data would be useless for a background checker.

except you go the extra mile and cross reference information from the map with information you have about the user locations, but most likely that will be one step too far for your project.
Now in this case you write "background checker" the use case you explained earlier was to track a users stuff, now whats the purpose of the application, to check the background of someone, or for a user to track his own stuff? because honestly, thats two totally different pairs of shoes.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:

6. Would you prefer the proposal as a web application or downloadable application? Before answering one or the other, consider the ease of use, e.g. deployment possibilities such as updates may be simpler to implement via web application instead of constantly updating via a standard application.

in case of a background checker application i'd prefer an self-hostable web application, in case of a tool to track my own information i'd prefer a downloadable application.

PS: for a list of a lot more 3rd party tools you can also check 3rdpartyeve.net

PPS: oh man, this "only 5 quotes" rule sucks, hard to answer 6 questions then =)

3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications

Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2012-12-06 17:14:51 UTC
Please can some more users respond to the survey, I have received 2 responses but require about 10 so I can fulfill the project requirements correctly.

Thanks for your time.
Ransyd Spungen
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-12-14 15:04:45 UTC
Kenji, before I answer your questions (which I will do in this post) let me address some comments and questions back to you.

First off, based on some of the other responses I'm not sure there is a solid understanding of the market/goal for the application you are building. It's not stated explicitly anywhere in your posting but there are some hints. From my reading it looks like you are looking to build an application that uses the API specifically to gather and analyse data to detect a user who may engaged in activity hazardous to or counter to the benefit of the Corporation running the scan.

Is this a correct assessment?

Second, and please don't take this the wrong way, are you a native English speaker? If not, this may explain some of the odd phrasing and the occasional syntactically null sentences.

Any way, with that out of the way, on to your questions.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:
1. Applications such as EVEMon, DOTLAN & EVE Central Market have very specific functions. However, in the sense of how similar applications are designed what are your thoughts and opinions?


As a very new (about 1 week) player of Eve I have made limited use of third party applications. However the availability of these applications and the very active developer community is one of the factors that has attracted me to this game as opposed to alternatives. Specifically I've terminated a recent exploration of another (mature) MMO in part because there is little in the way of third party development (the external wiki is woefully out of date, no detailed commerce spreadsheet, etc).

One third party app I do use is Neocon on the iPad. I particularly like the mirroring of the Eve UI into a tablet application. Makes it sort of like using a Star Trek data pad ;-)


Kenji Balthazar wrote:
2. What are your thoughts on advertisements? If this went through would you as a user be willing to accept carefully selected advertisements placed sparsely across the web application I create?


I prefer not to see advertisements and often pay the small fee for iPad apps to remove ads. With respect to webapps I almost never see ads because I block the services that provide these and run addons in my browser to remove code that calls out to ad networks.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:
3. What is your preferred colour scheme, would you want something simplistic and light/dark in nature such as Shattered Crystal or more complex like the main EVE website.


See above comment on Neocon.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:
4. Similar to the previous question, what are your thoughts and opinions on background images? For example, would you feel this provides more interactivity or would it be a hindrance to those with disabilities (i.e. colour blindness)?


Background images add no useful "interactivity" and are disruptive to virtually ever user, not just to those with disabilities.

Kenji Balthazar wrote:
5. Taking a look through the table in the below link, what XML information would benefit you as a user when checking account information via this application?

EVE Wiki - XML API Details

For example, Account Status and Corporation History XML sheets would be useful to the user, however map data would be useless for a background checker.


Ok, so please see my assumption up at the top regarding the focus of this application. What are the functional requirements for this application? What is your target market?

That said, for a tool to be used in the review of applicants and members to detect potential espionage, etc I can not think of any reason to exclude ANY data. And, I will say that your contention that map data would be "useless" is just plain wrong. There are many ways that one might look at map data for a user to gain insight into their actions and potential motivations.


With respect to your last question, not quoted here as I've hit the quote limit, I tend to prefer stand alone apps.
Axium Cog
Grand Solar Trinity
Grand Inquisitors Federation
#13 - 2013-01-03 04:59:00 UTC
[quote=Kenji Balthazar]Questions

1. I think the platform dependency of the application lies in the urgency of its data. Tactical data such as DOTLAN are more useful as a web application for use with the IGB to maximize flexibility to the user in a time critical setting. Market data, skill management, and in your case player history tracking, are generally activities performed while docked. Thus downloadable applications fit this role better as to leverage local system resources and allow more of the applications functionality independent of server state.

2. I have never had a problem with advertizement monitization so long as it is non-intrusive. However, if given the opportunity to donate for an ad-free version i would gladly pay. Im not sure if this option was covered within the license but it merits some consideration.

3. Honestly, color schemes are largely irrelevant so long as its not loud and eye-shattering. Keep the colors on the cool side of the spectrum and i think youll be fine.

4. A fair question. Backgrounds in my book dont increase or hurt interactability, as they are generally (and imo should be) static images. However implementing a "minimal" mode for people who are colorblind, or simply prefer simple schemes should be considered.

5. How often a user lets their account lapse would be very useful to track. I and many other (Ex)CEO's and Dirs would have loved to know beforehand that PlayerX frequently lets his account run dry before i recruit him.

6. I would more likely use this as a downloadable application than web. Its non-time-critical, bandwidth independent, and if it allows exporting of data, could be useful for other data analysis projects. If you want to support a web version, i suggest using a similar tactic that ECentral did with their market cache uploader: Allow users to set their application to volunteer information to your server, therefore only tracking characters that users have explicitly tracked.
Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2013-01-16 22:20:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenji Balthazar
After some deliberation and feedback from a close friend I have overhauled the survey questions to hopefully remove a lot of ambiguity. In addition, a summary of what I am trying to be accomplish has also been provided.

I am sorry if this has caused confusion to readers, however it was difficult to write a survey whilst trying to meet project requirements and cater to you as the readers.

Hopefully it is the last time I should need to change the post. However, if you have any questions about the survey, please feel free to inbox me and I will respond at the earliest opportunity.
Lorellei Blackmoon
Blackmoon Cartel
#15 - 2013-01-25 18:06:29 UTC
1. As a developer myself, I think people do a great job with all tools out there. The one I know/use the most is Eve-central, which I think is great.

2. I think monetizing is a good idea in order to get better quality software developed and I also agree with that it should not be intrusive. Very few developers who have jobs, families etc that could dedicate time and effort to personal projects like the ones I see online. Usually they invest spare time in freelance jobs, so an opportinuty to mix the pleasure of building something Eve-related with the need to increase income would be very attractive.

3. I prefer simplistic websites, although I don't think Shatteredcrystal is a good example: its layout is a bit confusing at a first glance.

4. It makes no difference, as long as the layout makes the tool easier to use.
A suggestion, if I may? It is more important to think about how your website is going to look on a smartphone or tablet.
It is better to have a simple and functional layout that allows people to use your tool anywhere than an awesome layout that works only in certain browsers/platforms. After all, the purpose of a tool is to be used =)

5. As an Invention/Manufacture - oriented player, I focus on market value vs production cost and the API does not provide anything close to that. The only thing I could think of are contracts / wallet but I wouldn't bother using a tool just to check that, since I could log in and manage things directly.

6. I would prefer a web application. I don't like the hassle of monitoring/updating versions of software installed on my PC - the ones I use for work are enough.
Also, since there are many different tools for different purposes, web applications allows me to access them all in the tabs of the same web browser, or even in-game.
Karbowiak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-02-02 23:27:26 UTC
Research:
1. Seeing as mobile devices such as tablets and phones are becoming more and more the norm, i actually prefer programs as websites. Esp. seeing as html5 and javascript is becoming more and more featured, and browsers are becoming even faster.
Ditto for desktops and the IGB.

2. Advertising is pretty much the only way some sites can even survive these days. EVE-KILL for example, needs a massive server to even run properly (could ofc. be fixed by coding it better, lol) - and as such, the cost is also very steep.
As for charging for even getting the app, no, i would personally rather look at ads (or block them entirely)

Development:
1. Personally, i prefer a simple layout, like the one we are putting on zkillboard.com

2. Again, personally, i don't like background images that are too distracting. But simplistic and non distracting background images are ok (such as a subtle pattern)

3. The API as it is now, lacks some information which would be usefull to everyone. Such as faction warfare information, or an alliance lookup api (right now we have to parse the alliancelist)

4. Website all the way. As written earlier, websites are becoming easy to make full of features as a normal desktop app. So i personally would rather look at a website. Also because websites are far easier to make multiplatform.
Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2013-02-04 17:36:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Kenji Balthazar
Thanks to the people who've responded, as an update the preliminary decision is that people would prefer a web application with the functionality towards smartphones and tablets. Baring this information in mind some basic designs are provided in the below links.

Index Page
Account Details
Kill Log

Colour Scheme

Please note, the potential hyperlink called 'Recent Changes' will be changed, however it relates towards website changes. Also, these designs are not yet final and may change,so please use them as a basic representation.

Thanks.
Kenji Balthazar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2013-02-27 18:58:45 UTC
Over the next few weeks, I will be looking at finishing the project and tying any loose ends up where necessary. I have gathered some preliminary data from the responses received, however please can people provide further information over the next few weeks.

This project will eventually be released to the EVE Community so any responses are not in vain. In addition, your answers will help with future development and how the website progresses in the future.

Thank you again for the input which has already been received.