Player Features and Ideas Discussion

No ... cloak is a tactical device for just the purpose you want to circumvent .

While cloakers in a nullsec system are annoying they can be mitigated. I was in a system near curse at one point and members got down right frustrated because the same characters were always cloaked up in our systems. They'd wait for juicy targets and hotdrop or titan bridge in a gank fleet. They had no problems with us and never attacked our sov, they just wanted to farm us for thrills. The real problem is that lovely little cyno beacon imo. I believe the standard solution to a cloaky in a system is to move to a different system and maybe try to camp the gate along the line if you know they'll follow. Or if someone's camping every system that you frequent just go to highsec.

Wormholes are awesome, no local, you can sneak around and do high reward activities. The no local works because there are no cyno beacons and travel between systems is slow due to scanning. Ambushes can be setup and executed with the prey never knowing you're there until you spring.

Remove nullsec local
Remove covert cynos
Removing ability for cov ops ships to light a cyno would make things more interesting as well

There are many ideas about how cloaking should be hunted, and to a greater degree, how basic effort should allow awareness of a possible cloaked threat.

I believe keeping it simple and basic is the key.

For awareness, I believe active scanning should allow the chance to be tipped off a cloaked vessel is around.
I detail that in this thread: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=112964&find=unread

For hunting purposes, I suggest the following:
The craft that actually does the hunting needs to be balanced against the cloaked vessels, or else it will be one sided.
The proper combination of skills / specialized ship hull / modules should let the hunting pilot see the cloaked vessel, and subsequently paint them with a target painter like module, thereby allowing other players to see and lock onto the craft.

Differences between the hunted and hunter in skill and equipment quality would determine the time to lock and engage the target painter module, creating demand for the best available on both sides.
This time to lock would be expected to affect whether the cloaked pilot could evade a successful hunt.

Now, as to details how this works:
The hunting craft activates the painter module.
This activates an enhanced sensor decryption mode, which like cloaks vessels works better on certain hulls. The covops hulls themselves work better for this for many of the same reasons they work so well for cloaking devices. They can control and limit their own sensor emissions to a greater degree.
You can launch probes prior to activating this module, and use them and or D-Scan / active scan.
While in this operating mode, cloaked vessels appear to your sensors as if they were not cloaked, allowing you to detect them using normal means.
The only device you can use beyond sensors, is the painting function. Locking onto the vessel using this takes an amount of time determined by the difference between your skills and equipment, and the cloaked pilot with their vessel.
Once you are locked on, they become visible to everyone, and can be locked and attacked normally.

Rejecting the notion Local has to exist for x reason. It simply doesn't. It will require more work to find an uncloaked target in a system which is balanced just fine by cloakers not showing in system either. The tyranny of locals amateur implementation is long overdue for change.

If you want to guard your system then do so. If you lack the manpower to guard your system, it's not your system.

Local affects much more than combat craft as well. I'd love to sneak a hauler through a system but you can't with the current system. You show up as soon as you cross the gate.

Hisec war decs would be worthwhile participating in without day long camp sessions, you could actually have a stealth reactionary force deal with the aggressors and you could maneuver around much easier in noncombat craft if you weren't displayed for all of your targets to see each and every time you came in system.

CCP knows full well how bad local is screwing up EVE. What they don't know/agree on is how many players want a real visceral EVE as opposed to a nanny gamestate and how much that will affect their bottom line.

The problem with allowing the population to strictly decide whats best for EVE is that the suggestions will always incrementally inch towards a safer experience in the individuals activity. Since activities are finite in EVE there is overlap so the safer begins to drown out the opposite to the detriment of the game. 10 years from now EVE will be a very dull game. Unless of course CCP makes some hard decisions, does what's needed and let's the chips fall as they will. Very few are going to be satisfied playing EVE for PVE. The game succeeds because its a niche game advertising itself as open and chaotic and non-consensual in nature. Anyone that plays EVE long enough realizes this is false as there are arbitrary restrictions in place to make the chaos much more order like and watered down.

Being "old" but truth means exactly what? Its been true for a very long time that 2 + 2 = 4. Should we accept 2 + 2 = 5 because it may be a newer concept?

We could argue that activation of mining lasers requires all defenses to be turned off. Or that firing weapons requires you to come to a complete standstill. Adapt?

@#91
Ill grant you the wisdom as soon as you explain one part of your argument. In your statement you inject a presupposition that you indeed should be able to find a cloaked ship. The definition of cloaked in game terms is unseen or hidden. The ships that use these mechanisms lose a great deal of combat ability. Why would anyone use the cloaks and endure the drawbacks if cloaked doesn't mean cloaked?

While you ponder your answer

The ships could still be used to the same purposes that they are used at the moment and people would still use them. I would use them. One would just need to think more how to use them rather than just going somewhere, press a button and then go to a shoppingmall for a pack fo cigarettes or swapping to an alt and start grinding isks elsewhere.



Local is not a counter. It just tells theres something there. It does not do anything except tell who are in the same system with you. It does not negate the effects of a claoking module like and ECCM would negate ECM. And yes agreed there needs to point where counters needs to stop but cloaking does not have a counter.

There's a difference between "adapting" and "this playstyle has been trashed because useless self entitled carebears want 100% safety in 0.0 space that they evidently lack the will or manpower to control in against a SINGLE PILOT WHO MAY NOT EVEN BE THERE"

Further still, just saying "well adapt!" in response to suggestions (especially suggestions such as probes) shows extreme ignorance of some of the mechanics. How, for example, does a pilot in wormhole space "adapt" to a probe that shows they are present in the system (when current mechanics mean their presence is unknowable)? There is literally nothing that pilot can do to "adapt" to that change.

If I'm cloaked and someone knows I'm there I consider the cloak pretty solidly countered.

They might not know where I am well enough to make me go away, but it's hard to see what people are doing in a system when all the intrusion alarms are blaring.

Remove cloacks
Remove local
improve dscan

Problem solved