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To CCP: If OGB is being removed Is there going to be a SP refund?
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#161 - 2012-12-12 23:16:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Mara Rinn
Gangname Style wrote:
Did they straight up remove nanofibers? Do you dedicate months of training to fit a nanofiber?


No they did not remove nanofibers, they changed the way nanofibers worked.

CCP will not be removing gang links or leadership skills, they will be changing these work.

Now back to your point which was what, exactly? That you understand why there will be no skill reimbursement when CCP changes the way particular skills work? Your leadership skills will still work. Your gang links will still work. It's just that the way they work will be changed: first and foremost, I expect that gang links will no longer be able to boost from inside POS shields (there are at least two obvious ways of addressing that, BTW).

I currently have a 6-link tengu off-grid boosting alt which I use for Incursion fleets. That alt is currently training to fly a command ship. I will probably put it into a Claymore since that alt specialises in missile weapon systems (being a SB pilot). The Claymore should be able to provide long-range webifier bonus and shield harmonization bonus while on-grid, since those are the two most valuable bonuses for a shield tanking Incursion fleet.

OTOH those of you flying dual rep myrmidons with OGB for your "solo" PvP will have to think about what ship you can put your booster alt into, to allow you to bring it on-grid. Of course there is also the option of having fleets of 1 when you are looking for "solo" PvP.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Gangname Style
Doomheim
#162 - 2012-12-12 23:22:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Gangname Style
Mara Rinn wrote:
Gangname Style wrote:
Did they straight up remove nanofibers? Do you dedicate months of training to fit a nanofiber?


No they did not remove nanofibers, they changed the way nanofibers worked.

CCP will not be removing gang links or leadership skills, they will be changing these work.

Now back to your point which was what, exactly? That you understand why there will be no skill reimbursement when CCP changes the way particular skills work? Your leadership skills will still work. Your gang links will still work. It's just that the way they work will be changed: first and foremost, I expect that gang links will no longer be able to boost from inside POS shields (there are at least two obvious ways of addressing that, BTW).


So essentially my (and many other players) OGB alts will become worthless for what they trained to do.

Its laughable that people are suggesting to fly a paper-thin tank ongrid and expect it to work.

Its laughable that people suggest flying a command ship aswell as your main on the same battlefield and not fail horribly.

There is no denying that these alts are becoming useless.
KrakizBad
Section 8.
#163 - 2012-12-12 23:27:09 UTC
Tough. Train for something else. You're not getting your SP back so might as well stop crying. Or don't tears are fine too.
Sister Lumi
Doomheim
#164 - 2012-12-12 23:28:23 UTC
If your alt is useless it's your problem :D

P.S. I have leadership character too
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#165 - 2012-12-12 23:29:04 UTC
Gangname Style wrote:
So essentially my (and many other players) OGB alts will become worthless for what they trained to do.


Incorrect.

Your booster alt will still be useful for boosting. That you trained it specifically for OGB only means you were busily exploiting a broken game mechanic for your own advantage.

Gangname Style wrote:
Its laughable that people are suggesting to fly a paper-thin tank ongrid and expect it to work.


Remind me again how paper-thin a Damnation is? Oh yeah, it's only 200k EHP.

Gangname Style wrote:
There is no denying that these alts are becoming useless.


Unsubscribe the alt if it's really going to be useless. What are you going to do with that character when it can't OGB anymore? If you aren't going to use it for anything, unsubscribe that account. Of course there is always the option of keeping the character and finding something useful for it to do. Fly your booster characters with your friends in small fleets.

The only useless thing is the player who refuses to adapt to changing game mechanics.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Gangname Style
Doomheim
#166 - 2012-12-12 23:32:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Gangname Style
Mara Rinn wrote:
Gangname Style wrote:
So essentially my (and many other players) OGB alts will become worthless for what they trained to do.


Incorrect.

Your booster alt will still be useful for boosting. That you trained it specifically for OGB only means you were busily exploiting a broken game mechanic for your own advantage.

Gangname Style wrote:
Its laughable that people are suggesting to fly a paper-thin tank ongrid and expect it to work.


Remind me again how paper-thin a Damnation is? Oh yeah, it's only 200k EHP.

Gangname Style wrote:
There is no denying that these alts are becoming useless.


Unsubscribe the alt if it's really going to be useless. What are you going to do with that character when it can't OGB anymore? If you aren't going to use it for anything, unsubscribe that account. Of course there is always the option of keeping the character and finding something useful for it to do. Fly your booster characters with your friends in small fleets.

The only useless thing is the player who refuses to adapt to changing game mechanics.


Exploit huh? Show me where CCP calls it an exploit. Otherwise stop making stuff up.

Yeah I use a damnation as my OGB. Yeah I'm gunna run skirmish links off a damnation too.

Unsub my alt if it becomes useless huh? Yeah I'm sure CCP will like that.
CATPAIN KIRK
State War Academy
Caldari State
#167 - 2012-12-12 23:34:41 UTC  |  Edited by: CATPAIN KIRK
Gangname Style wrote:
huh?




Diesel 47? Is that you or is there really more than one person being that unfathomably dumb?
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#168 - 2012-12-12 23:47:47 UTC
I understand why the OP is frustrated. I have the leadership group of skills all trained. Spec's to 4, everything else to 5. Throw in a T2 hard wire and put me in a battle cruiser it sticks a big fucken bulls eye on my forehead. Titans are the new Command Ships. I don't know what they plan to do with the T2 battle Cruisers but they won't be leading fleets in Alpha blobs Online.
Gangname Style
Doomheim
#169 - 2012-12-12 23:50:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Gangname Style
CATPAIN KIRK wrote:
Gangname Style wrote:
huh?




Diesel 47? Is that you or is there really more than one person being that unfathomably dumb?


English please.

Skydell wrote:
I understand why the OP is frustrated. I have the leadership group of skills all trained. Spec's to 4, everything else to 5. Throw in a T2 hard wire and put me in a battle cruiser it sticks a big fucken bulls eye on my forehead. Titans are the new Command Ships. I don't know what they plan to do with the T2 battle Cruisers but they won't be leading fleets in Alpha blobs Online.


But when a blob is fighting a smaller gang, they can comfortably have a command ship and not have to worry about it dying.

Wheres the solution to that?
CATPAIN KIRK
State War Academy
Caldari State
#170 - 2012-12-12 23:52:57 UTC
Diesel47 wrote:


English please.



Thanks for the Confirmation :).
Sheynan
Lighting the blight
#171 - 2012-12-13 00:00:22 UTC
If you are really worried about your designated commandship getting alpha'd or primaried then you should maybe consider bringing either a better commandship with either more tank (Damnation) or kiting ability (Sleipnir) or just more of them, as you do with every ship in a sizable fleet.

Other than that you could just boost from a non-obvious commandship, like a Drake (or even an Archon if you're fighting with caps anyway).


Of course you'd run into first world problems like:
"But then I will have 18,3% less bonuses :( "
"But then I have to bring 3 Drakes to cover all Shield links and can't have Loki and Legion boosts ontop in my Drake fleet :("

But other than that, you'd be fine.
ERin Erkkinen
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#172 - 2012-12-13 00:05:07 UTC
no you will not get sp back when they change the way "OGB" work you skills still there just have to risk the ship to do it deal with or in the word off CCP Guard "HTFU"
Gangname Style
Doomheim
#173 - 2012-12-13 00:07:51 UTC
ERin Erkkinen wrote:
no you will not get sp back when they change the way "OGB" work you skills still there just have to risk the ship to do it deal with or in the word off CCP Guard "HTFU"


Wondering why people who oppose OGBs don't just "HTFU" instead of whining for removal. Lol
Superterrier
#174 - 2012-12-13 00:17:07 UTC
Gangname Style wrote:


Wondering why people who oppose OGBs don't just "HTFU" instead of whining for removal. Lol



Probably because common sense forces most people to conclude it's a broken game mechanic...
ashley Eoner
#175 - 2012-12-13 00:21:27 UTC
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:
Why do people think rorquals are in trouble? The dev blog said "warfare links" it did not mention "mining foreman links".

Given that the rorq only gets a bonus to mining foreman links, the code must be there to diffetentiate the various links. Couldn't this change truly impact only the warfare links, leaving mining foreman ones alone?

Or am I too optimistic.
I noticed that too. I also think you're being too optimistic but one can only hope that our interpretation is correct.
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#176 - 2012-12-13 00:36:03 UTC
Gangname Style wrote:
Mara Rinn wrote:
Gangname Style wrote:
Did they straight up remove nanofibers? Do you dedicate months of training to fit a nanofiber?


No they did not remove nanofibers, they changed the way nanofibers worked.

CCP will not be removing gang links or leadership skills, they will be changing these work.

Now back to your point which was what, exactly? That you understand why there will be no skill reimbursement when CCP changes the way particular skills work? Your leadership skills will still work. Your gang links will still work. It's just that the way they work will be changed: first and foremost, I expect that gang links will no longer be able to boost from inside POS shields (there are at least two obvious ways of addressing that, BTW).


So essentially my (and many other players) OGB alts will become worthless for what they trained to do.

Its laughable that people are suggesting to fly a paper-thin tank ongrid and expect it to work.

Its laughable that people suggest flying a command ship aswell as your main on the same battlefield and not fail horribly.

There is no denying that these alts are becoming useless.


CCP has said that when the removal comes, the t3's will come with a rebalance to allow them to be on grid.

If thats not what you want...well tough **** really, you train a skill with the full knowledge that it can be completely changed at any time at the developers whim.

Basically you're not getting any skill points back, you should probably come to accept that fact or just move on to another game.

Hope I've been helpful.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
SMT008
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#177 - 2012-12-13 00:44:53 UTC
Guys, guys.

100MN Command T3s.

On-grid, still almost invulnerable. Oh, and won't appear on killmails like Falcons. Just like now.

However, I'll keep thinking that removing off-grid boosting isn't a good solution. Prevent boosting from inside a POS forcefield (Or even within xxxx KMs of the nearest forcefield), this I can agree to.

But removing the only thing that allowed me to fight bigger gangs solo, I don't like that much.
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#178 - 2012-12-13 00:48:03 UTC
SMT008 wrote:

But removing the only thing that allowed me to fight bigger gangs solo, I don't like that much.


Show me the Dev blog where they were removing piloting skill and talent...

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Tamiya Sarossa
Resistance is Character Forming
#179 - 2012-12-13 00:52:18 UTC
As someone who will happily abuse off-grid boosts until they're thankfully nerfed, I can say that I've already got plenty of 2-link on-grid fits with plenty of tank and speed planned. Had to drop that 3rd link, fitting compromises sure are hard sometimes, aren't they?

Though some of them even have ewar or deal DPS too, which is nice! Should be a lot more fun to fly. I might even fit a ganglink to a BC, god forbid.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#180 - 2012-12-13 00:52:48 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
So wait, my interceptor should automatically lose skirmish bonuses as soon as I warp after an enemy I want to tackle for my gang?
Seems pretty dumb to me.
Better fix: disallow activation of gang links in warp, disallow activation of gang links within a certain distance of POS shields, and bloom signature radius by several hundred percent while gang links are active (alternatively reduce cut sensor strength and scan res by 90% or thereabouts, would probably be a better solution to avoid boosters taking ridiculous amounts of damage from capital weapons).
The result: making OGB vulnerable and really easy to find.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)