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So i went....

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OkaskiKali
Aussie Carebear OverLords
#1 - 2012-12-11 13:46:30 UTC
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2012-12-11 13:47:58 UTC
what?

Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime.
Matt Ellis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-12-11 13:48:51 UTC
OkaskiKali wrote:
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?


Because the new AI makes sense. If you were the AI, and you were struggling to break the tank on the Drake you were shooting. If another ship warped in, you're telling me you wouldn't have a pop at it? It's called testing the waters. The old system was terrible.

Oh, and us Wormholers have been dealing with this for years now, having to jump people AND tank the sleepers in the sites. Its not broken, and doesnt need to be fixed.
CARB0N FIBER
Derailleurs
#4 - 2012-12-11 13:53:51 UTC
Against the rules to make negative comments about the wonderful gifts of CCP. Enjoy your ban.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2012-12-11 13:54:49 UTC
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?


Because the new AI makes sense. If you were the AI, and you were struggling to break the tank on the Drake you were shooting. If another ship warped in, you're telling me you wouldn't have a pop at it? It's called testing the waters. The old system was terrible.

Oh, and us Wormholers have been dealing with this for years now, having to jump people AND tank the sleepers in the sites. Its not broken, and doesnt need to be fixed.

That's ridiculous. You're telling me that if someone was slaughtering your gang and someone else warped in to kill that guy, you would switch to him?

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
OkaskiKali
Aussie Carebear OverLords
#6 - 2012-12-11 14:00:11 UTC  |  Edited by: OkaskiKali
Listen

point 1: some of you need to get some intelligence and think about what you write

point 2: the point of hunting ratters solo and to a degree in a gang is to catch them in belts and anoms and for that to happen you need fast stuff or cloakie. the new AI has killed this gaming stlye (and for those of you with no brain hunting ratters, and huting them solo in recons or in gang of small stuff)
Matt Ellis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-12-11 14:04:00 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?


Because the new AI makes sense. If you were the AI, and you were struggling to break the tank on the Drake you were shooting. If another ship warped in, you're telling me you wouldn't have a pop at it? It's called testing the waters. The old system was terrible.

Oh, and us Wormholers have been dealing with this for years now, having to jump people AND tank the sleepers in the sites. Its not broken, and doesnt need to be fixed.

That's ridiculous. You're telling me that if someone was slaughtering your gang and someone else warped in to kill that guy, you would switch to him?


I would, if i wasn't getting anywhere with the original target. You're not going to take out the guy shooting you anyway, so why not.. There is a high chance he would go for you aswell, no?

Sleepers look at everything as a threat. A new ship warps in, they know nothing about it, until they try shooting it. Same as in PvP really. A new potentially hostile ship enters the field, and the FC can call to primary that target.

I really don't see what is so bad about the AI switching target.. Yes, you can't leave your drones out forever. Yes you can't warp bombers in and expect to live. Thats what balancing is!

Think a little more about what ship you use, and you'll be fine. Clearly the ship you lot are warping in is designed to have an easy win against the target, rather than actually fight it out. Cheap kills are no longer cheap kills. Put some thought into it, and adjust...
HVAC Repairman
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2012-12-11 14:04:30 UTC
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:
what?

He's complaining that the new AI will switch to new targets, and it makes ganking in anomalies 'harder' because rat DPS will switch over to you

Follow me on twitter
Joseph Dreadloch
Dread Space Inc.
#9 - 2012-12-11 14:04:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Joseph Dreadloch
This is the one thing in Retribution I'm unhappy about. If you're hunting people running anomalies or plexes you are now forced to blob.


Stuff like this is much more difficult now.
Matt Ellis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-12-11 14:05:36 UTC
OkaskiKali wrote:
Listen

point 1: some of you need to get some intelligence and think about what you write

point 2: the point of hunting ratters solo and to a degree in a gang is to catch them in belts and anoms and for that to happen you need fast stuff or cloakie. the new AI has killed this gaming stlye (and for those of you with no brain hunting ratters, and huting them solo in recons or in gang of small stuff)


I can easily jump in on multiple drakes ratting in a WH site, get full aggro off them and sleepers, and win... In a Cloaky Tengu. And thats Omnifit. If you thought about what rats are in the site, im sure you could minimise the damage you take from them...
OkaskiKali
Aussie Carebear OverLords
#11 - 2012-12-11 14:07:23 UTC
Matt Ellis wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?


Because the new AI makes sense. If you were the AI, and you were struggling to break the tank on the Drake you were shooting. If another ship warped in, you're telling me you wouldn't have a pop at it? It's called testing the waters. The old system was terrible.

Oh, and us Wormholers have been dealing with this for years now, having to jump people AND tank the sleepers in the sites. Its not broken, and doesnt need to be fixed.

That's ridiculous. You're telling me that if someone was slaughtering your gang and someone else warped in to kill that guy, you would switch to him?


I would, if i wasn't getting anywhere with the original target. You're not going to take out the guy shooting you anyway, so why not.. There is a high chance he would go for you aswell, no?

Sleepers look at everything as a threat. A new ship warps in, they know nothing about it, until they try shooting it. Same as in PvP really. A new potentially hostile ship enters the field, and the FC can call to primary that target.

I really don't see what is so bad about the AI switching target.. Yes, you can't leave your drones out forever. Yes you can't warp bombers in and expect to live. Thats what balancing is!

Think a little more about what ship you use, and you'll be fine. Clearly the ship you lot are warping in is designed to have an easy win against the target, rather than actually fight it out. Cheap kills are no longer cheap kills. Put some thought into it, and adjust...


disagree - null sec is someones territory so the ships you use depend on that - most of the time i use a cloakie arazu since it means i can get about with better odds of getting around and finding stuff to kill... the new AI renders this style dead.
OkaskiKali
Aussie Carebear OverLords
#12 - 2012-12-11 14:08:39 UTC
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
Listen

point 1: some of you need to get some intelligence and think about what you write

point 2: the point of hunting ratters solo and to a degree in a gang is to catch them in belts and anoms and for that to happen you need fast stuff or cloakie. the new AI has killed this gaming stlye (and for those of you with no brain hunting ratters, and huting them solo in recons or in gang of small stuff)


I can easily jump in on multiple drakes ratting in a WH site, get full aggro off them and sleepers, and win... In a Cloaky Tengu. And thats Omnifit. If you thought about what rats are in the site, im sure you could minimise the damage you take from them...


I dont use tengu since i tend to prefer fighting in blob areas hence the reason for using recons.
OkaskiKali
Aussie Carebear OverLords
#13 - 2012-12-11 14:11:22 UTC
Joseph Dreadloch wrote:
This is the one thing in Retribution I'm unhappy about. If you're hunting people running anomalies or plexes you are now forced to blob.


Stuff like this is much more difficult now.



^This and thanks for understanding my point.
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-12-11 14:12:48 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?


Because the new AI makes sense. If you were the AI, and you were struggling to break the tank on the Drake you were shooting. If another ship warped in, you're telling me you wouldn't have a pop at it? It's called testing the waters. The old system was terrible.

Oh, and us Wormholers have been dealing with this for years now, having to jump people AND tank the sleepers in the sites. Its not broken, and doesnt need to be fixed.

That's ridiculous. You're telling me that if someone was slaughtering your gang and someone else warped in to kill that guy, you would switch to him?


The enemy of my enemy is not my friend. He's the guy that's going to try and kill me next. This is Eve, and that's the mentality.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Matt Ellis
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-12-11 14:13:56 UTC
OkaskiKali wrote:
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
Listen

point 1: some of you need to get some intelligence and think about what you write

point 2: the point of hunting ratters solo and to a degree in a gang is to catch them in belts and anoms and for that to happen you need fast stuff or cloakie. the new AI has killed this gaming stlye (and for those of you with no brain hunting ratters, and huting them solo in recons or in gang of small stuff)


I can easily jump in on multiple drakes ratting in a WH site, get full aggro off them and sleepers, and win... In a Cloaky Tengu. And thats Omnifit. If you thought about what rats are in the site, im sure you could minimise the damage you take from them...


I dont use tengu since i tend to prefer fighting in blob areas hence the reason for using recons.


So basically, you want CCP to revert the changes because, if i may... you can't(more, "i don't want to") adjust your playstyle. From one standpoint, the old AI was thick! And in no way represented a proper fight!

CCP aren't going to revert back the target-switching, so you might as well try to adjust. If not, can i have you arazu?
Doddy
Excidium.
#16 - 2012-12-11 14:19:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Doddy
Matt Ellis wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?


Because the new AI makes sense. If you were the AI, and you were struggling to break the tank on the Drake you were shooting. If another ship warped in, you're telling me you wouldn't have a pop at it? It's called testing the waters. The old system was terrible.

Oh, and us Wormholers have been dealing with this for years now, having to jump people AND tank the sleepers in the sites. Its not broken, and doesnt need to be fixed.

That's ridiculous. You're telling me that if someone was slaughtering your gang and someone else warped in to kill that guy, you would switch to him?


I would, if i wasn't getting anywhere with the original target. You're not going to take out the guy shooting you anyway, so why not.. There is a high chance he would go for you aswell, no?

.


Despite the other guy tackling and shooting your target therefore making it possible to break the tank? You would stop shooting the now tackled and likely breaking hostile target and shoot the unknown capability new arrival neutral? Your logic is terrible and no one sensible thinks that way.

I personally have no problem with rats having the POSSIBILITY of changing onto the new target, or even following ship sizes (the frig rats attacking a bomber while the bs keep shooting the marauder for example). The problem is that the rats will ALWAYS go for the pvper over the npcer, simply because a point counts as ewar.
OkaskiKali
Aussie Carebear OverLords
#17 - 2012-12-11 14:21:21 UTC
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
Listen

point 1: some of you need to get some intelligence and think about what you write

point 2: the point of hunting ratters solo and to a degree in a gang is to catch them in belts and anoms and for that to happen you need fast stuff or cloakie. the new AI has killed this gaming stlye (and for those of you with no brain hunting ratters, and huting them solo in recons or in gang of small stuff)


I can easily jump in on multiple drakes ratting in a WH site, get full aggro off them and sleepers, and win... In a Cloaky Tengu. And thats Omnifit. If you thought about what rats are in the site, im sure you could minimise the damage you take from them...


I dont use tengu since i tend to prefer fighting in blob areas hence the reason for using recons.


So basically, you want CCP to revert the changes because, if i may... you can't(more, "i don't want to") adjust your playstyle. From one standpoint, the old AI was thick! And in no way represented a proper fight!

CCP aren't going to revert back the target-switching, so you might as well try to adjust. If not, can i have you arazu?


And there it is - typical response of troll...can i has your stuff...please i'd give it to a homeless person before you got it..

on another note tell me where i say it needs to revert back... I think i say, oh actuall i did say for you dear that "hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style? "

killing ratters is already a tough game style its just become 100 times harder... and before you Worm hole players come on here complaining that you guys have it tough - thats you game style you chose to play that way, i choose to hunt in null sec becuase of its relative "time to chest beating" once a ratter is found is fairly quick.
Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#18 - 2012-12-11 14:21:23 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Matt Ellis wrote:
OkaskiKali wrote:
hunting ratters in a cloakie and discovered the new AI sucks....

Hunting is dead...

Somehow need to balance this right here. Ratting is already a printing machine and much of null sec isnt worth it.

It used to be great fun being able to kill drakes in a rapier, Battleships in an arazu why ccp kill this gaming style?


Because the new AI makes sense. If you were the AI, and you were struggling to break the tank on the Drake you were shooting. If another ship warped in, you're telling me you wouldn't have a pop at it? It's called testing the waters. The old system was terrible.

Oh, and us Wormholers have been dealing with this for years now, having to jump people AND tank the sleepers in the sites. Its not broken, and doesnt need to be fixed.

That's ridiculous. You're telling me that if someone was slaughtering your gang and someone else warped in to kill that guy, you would switch to him?

Would it be better if the NPC's warped away if they were losing?

Then PvE would be more like PVP and everyone would have to bring a tackle along in order to kill an NPC, instead of them just being a little more intelligent about who they shoot.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2012-12-11 14:24:05 UTC
Matt Ellis wrote:
I would, if i wasn't getting anywhere with the original target. You're not going to take out the guy shooting you anyway, so why not.. There is a high chance he would go for you aswell, no?

So you don't think you would ever take advantage of the added DPS at all?

Matt Ellis wrote:
Sleepers look at everything as a threat. A new ship warps in, they know nothing about it, until they try shooting it. Same as in PvP really. A new potentially hostile ship enters the field, and the FC can call to primary that target.

Except FCs are generally more intelligent than switching targets to something just because it entered the field. Threat analysis is more sophisticated than "ZOMG NEW TARGET NEW TARGET." It's not terribly difficult to program "don't shoot something new that warps in unless it's either the first thing to appear, it starts aggressing you, or it starts aiding the person who's already there attacking you, or has been sitting there for 2 minutes doing absolutely nothing at all".

Matt Ellis wrote:
I really don't see what is so bad about the AI switching target.. Yes, you can't leave your drones out forever. Yes you can't warp bombers in and expect to live. Thats what balancing is!

Except not all aspects of balancing are good.

Matt Ellis wrote:
Think a little more about what ship you use, and you'll be fine. Clearly the ship you lot are warping in is designed to have an easy win against the target, rather than actually fight it out. Cheap kills are no longer cheap kills. Put some thought into it, and adjust...

Confirming that warping in a stealth bomber on a ratter is an easy win and can't easily be popped by that ratter if he were actually paying attention.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Natsett Amuinn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#20 - 2012-12-11 14:24:06 UTC
OkaskiKali wrote:


disagree - null sec is someones territory so the ships you use depend on that - most of the time i use a cloakie arazu since it means i can get about with better odds of getting around and finding stuff to kill... the new AI renders this style dead.

"I have to fly what I'm told to fly to do PvE, and not what I want to fly"

Now there's a BS responce if ever there was one.
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