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Extremely discouraged from EVE, please lend a hand?

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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#41 - 2012-12-11 10:54:01 UTC
Lady Hestia wrote:
@ Andski, I learned that from someone in the corp after the fact, and now I do understand it. I just didn't remember L2's involving so much damage.

@Remiel Pollard, I understand a good deal about fittings, but I suppose not a huge amount. Keep in mind, those fits usually come with guides as well. A friend also said that the AI simply attacks the person who is the easiest to hurt- who has the weakest tank. It seemed like it, as when ever we did L4's the AI would always target me exclusively (with me in a BS and him in a Tengu).

@Raskonalkov, Not all of those points are in mining. I have more than Level 5 Drones and Level 5 Gunnery.

@Thiassi Uth'Matar, I will post my Maelstrom's fit at the bottom of this post. I don't see why it's so hard for me to tank, really.

@Surfin's PlunderBunny, It's a pain to have my drones shot at so easily, but I find that it's not all -too- hard to keep them alive.

@Maggie Evenstar, I'd love to fleet with you! Contact in EVE is hard for me, but I know that's generally how it is done around here. I will send you a message.

@Krixtal Icefluxor, I take a lot of time off in frustration. A lot of time goes by where I am unsubbed and skills cannot be trained. Also, I'd love to buy a Hulk. When can I expect the funds from you, my friend?



Latest Maelstrom fit: (disregard the AB and specific hardeners, those change.)

[Maelstrom, Maelstrom Current]

Gyrostabilizer II
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II

X-Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Kinetic Deflection Field I
Kinetic Deflection Field I
Heavy Capacitor Booster II
100MN Afterburner II

800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L
800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L
800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L
800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L
800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L
800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L
800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L
800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hammerhead I x5


That's a reasonable fit, you should be able to do most level 4s in that.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Mund Richard
#42 - 2012-12-11 12:08:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Mund Richard
Malcanis wrote:
Lady Hestia wrote:

800mm Heavy 'Scout' Repeating Artillery I, Titanium Sabot L

That's a reasonable fit, you should be able to do most level 4s in that.
As soon as the ammo is fixed, like some mentioned before.
Loosing what, 35%? of your dps for +20% tracking is rarely worth it. You already have a good tracking gun, and two tracking enhancers.
Frigs should be preferably "kited"/killed by drones, the rest you should be able to have enough tracking on just by flying well and keeping that AB running.

Not quite sure about the RF Gyro, but if you have the isk, and can afford to loose them...
DC would be nice, but with shields the benefit is rather the huge hull buffer you get, the added resists in shields are low (though still nothing to sneeze at). Oh, and we are still assuming you are fighting Guristas exclusively with those resist mods.

"We want PvE activities to require active participation and mirror PvP more closely." Stacking penalty for NPC EWAR then? Lock range under 9km from over 100 in a BS is not fun. Nor is two NPC web drones making me crawl 10m/s. PvP SW-900 x5: 75m/s.
Lady Hestia
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#43 - 2012-12-11 19:55:24 UTC
Hi again. With some direction I've picked up plenty of skills to improve my fits right off the bat, such as T2 Gallente drones.

The resistances are made to interchange depending on the enemy, of course.

My tank seems much better now, so now I wonder about weapons. I cannot use T2 weapons yet in any form.
Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#44 - 2012-12-11 20:14:14 UTC
Lady Hestia wrote:
Hi again. With some direction I've picked up plenty of skills to improve my fits right off the bat, such as T2 Gallente drones.

The resistances are made to interchange depending on the enemy, of course.

My tank seems much better now, so now I wonder about weapons. I cannot use T2 weapons yet in any form.


Your meta 4 guns should be good enough. Only problem is that you can't use Barrage with it, wich would further increase your range. Range is important for PvE.
Do not expect your Mael to be capstable... you will need very good skills to achieve cap stability. And even then... most ships you will fly later won't be capstable, I think it is very good to learn good cap management when you are used to fly a ship that is not capstable. Aim for about 5-8 minutes cap, the rest is up to your micromanagement.
As a rule of thumb Autocannon ships tank with their guns, so aim for a good falloff range (trajectory analysis skill should at least be at 4 ).
2 Tracking enhancers + Falloff rigs will turn your Mael into a monster that kills a lot of stuff before it can do serious damage to you, so your increased dps will indirectly help you tank.
And yeah, although technically there is no real reason not to use faction modules, it just doesn't feel right for me. Get everything to tech 2, then improve with faction modules if you want to boost some stats even further.

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#45 - 2012-12-11 20:41:49 UTC
Lady Hestia wrote:
Hi again. With some direction I've picked up plenty of skills to improve my fits right off the bat, such as T2 Gallente drones.

The resistances are made to interchange depending on the enemy, of course.

My tank seems much better now, so now I wonder about weapons. I cannot use T2 weapons yet in any form.


T2 weapons are a big step up, but they're a large SP investment. However I would still encourage you to make that investment. Projectiles are as good a weapon as any for your first specilisation to T2, because they're so versatile. There are very few combat roles you can't fulfill with 1 type of projectile or another.

It's worth remembering that the quicker you kill each rat, the less opportunity it will have to do damage to you (this is the "DPS tanking" concept".

PS it occurs to me to ask at what level you have Minmatar Battleship?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Teseer
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#46 - 2012-12-11 21:58:38 UTC
Oh man, nice to hear I'm not the only one. I've been desperately trying to get involved and into Eve since I made my character in 2007. For a reference of how much I've actually played, I'm sitting at 27.7mil skill points.

I think I found my source of trouble, however. I opened my contact list and realized all but 3 of my 35 or so contacts were trial accounts I've had friends make and never activated. I'd spent a majority of the time playing this game explaining the first two weeks. Over and Over and Over. I only really have fun in Video Games if I can convince my IRL friends to play, so after I teach the next one the basics, he'd quit and eventually I would too.

Err, aside aside; I was about in the same boat as you when I came back last time I came back. Nothing dies when you shoot it, everything kills you when it shoots you, your cap seems to be made of sparklers and nothing fits on your ship.

I finally just buckled down and went for the fundamentals. First was Cap, next was Fitting, then Guns, then Drones. Gotta take the Karate Kid approach.

Currently, I'm having a direction issue. With my constant Un/Re-subbing, I never really met many people who played and thus never got into low/null-sec and PvP.
Well, that's my goal now. I'm leaning toward faction warfare, at the moment.
Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#47 - 2012-12-11 22:02:28 UTC
Lady Hestia wrote:
Hi everyone,

I've been playing EVE on and off for a long time. Quite a few years. I started out mining, then continued to mine, had other accounts to do missions, etc, then I maxed out all of my mining, refining, etc.

Then, at some point I decided that two of my accounts would have battleships, and I'd run L4's with them. When I tried to do that, I found that neither ship could survive long enough in L4's to complete the mission before it expired. I spent some time training skills, a few months, and when I returned the results were not much different.

I even spent some time in Red vs Blue only to find the disorganized outfit to be a complete waste of time.



I stopped playing for a while, and now that I have come back, a friend who is not that bright is trying to get me to join a big corp he is in. We're going to null sec to do operations there, but so much has already ****ed me up already.

My friend insisted I sell my hulk because I wouldn't need it, as I was going to fight rats in null sec. I protested, but eventually caved and agreed. Then him and I tried to do L4's and I constantly had to leave just like I always did, and even after playing with my fits, it still seems impossible. Now, other people are telling me I should have not sold my hulk so I can mine stuff in null sec.

I feel like a jack ass because everything I like to do has been so difficult. Now with the new PVE AI, I have such a hard time getting anything done.

I am now aware that the Algos (new Gallentean destroyer) is better at PVP than PVE, but when I bought one and fitted it and went into a L2 mission (working on standings with a specific corp), I nearly died on the first salvo of weapons.

I was so angry at my massive failure, while I was previously so excited about buying the Algos, a ship I really like.


I don't know what to do, really. When I started playing years ago I was always worried that you needed years worth of skills to do anything in this game, and people always reassured me. And yet, I am not so sure.

At 16Mil SP I don't feel like my difficulty is justified. I use PYFA, EVEMON, even Battleclinic to find fits, and yet somehow my game is so difficult.

What advice can you guys lend to me? Naturally, I am happy to answer any questions you guys might have.


poor basterd do what other people say. Stick in high sec mine till you have bill of isk then go back in zero sec have fun with OTHER people stop playing pve in zero sec. This is increas the fun at level 2000+ for sure. End of discussion. If you already do what other people say then do what i say. This help belive me everyone have his turning point in this game. Even in real life you need to change something or get borred old and die fast...
ISD Suvetar
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#48 - 2012-12-12 00:53:13 UTC
Hi,

I've removed some more hurtful posts and the retorts thereof.

Trolling and personal attacks are unwelcome and forbidden by the rules; if it happens again then we will be forced to take formal action against those posters.

Look, if you disagree with someone then do so constructively without making a personal inference, debate is a healthy wonderful thing when it's not dragged down into schoolyard name calling.

Please don't force us to take action again.

[b]ISD Suvetar Captain/Commando Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#49 - 2012-12-12 02:03:00 UTC
Andski wrote:
Lady Hestia wrote:
At 16Mil SP I don't feel like my difficulty is justified. I use PYFA, EVEMON, even Battleclinic to find fits, and yet somehow my game is so difficult.


Any fitting you find on Battleclinic is useless unless you understand why it accomplishes (or fails to accomplish) its supposed objective.


I tried to tell them that, but do you think they'd believe me? Lol There is the best fit, and the other best fit and everything else is crap as far as they're concerned. Tell them intent of use, how to use, which fleet composition it's intended for, and they'll just show you their multy-plus best fit and say you're doing it wrong. Never mind that their recommended fit is completely useless outside of one or two applications, usually involving a fleet of anywhere from 10-500.

Anyway, their ships die fast; don't use them unless you know what they do with them and do the same. I'm sure they work well in the right application..

Not sure if you'll be able to fit this exactly, but I found it able to do level 2's myself. No specific resists on it, but it did fairly well. You just have to get in practive of cycling your Reps and cap booster so you can maintain it. I'm sure you'd die fast sitting still though, so definitely not good for that, but intended to speed tank and have the option of pulling range to mitigate damage when you need to.

Algos

Light Neutron Blaster II
Light Neutron Blaster II
Light Neutron Blaster II
Light Neutron Blaster II
Light Neutron Blaster II

1MN Afterburner II
Small F-RX Prototype Capacitor Boost
F-12 Nonlinear Tracking Processor

Small Armor Repairer II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II

Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Caldari Navy Plutonium Charge S
Navy Cap Booster 100

Small Anti-Explosive Pump
Small Anti-Kinetic Pump I
Small Anti-Thermic Pump I

Hammerhead 3
Hobgoblin I 3
Hornet I 3
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Jessica Danikov
Network Danikov
#50 - 2012-12-12 02:19:42 UTC
A slightly different tack from the more specific advice people are giving in this thread-

Join a corporation that works for you.

I never got into this game until I found a good corporation that fitted me well. EVE is only really fun when it has that meta-game to it, a social circle, a group, with aims and goals and collaboration and all that goodness. A good corp and help you learn and grow and foster you as a pilot, and you can give back, support your corpies, and have fun in the process.

Sounds like you're not in a corp that you mesh well currently- given your friend is in it, I can see how it might be a difficult decision for you to leave and look elsewhere for something else, but it's worse to think of you suffering and ruining an otherwise fun game by feeling tied to that organisation. Nullsec isn't for everyone and has been particularly harsh as of late... you might have more luck getting into it a few patches down the line, but for now it is rather more hostile to new players that it usually is.
Lady Hestia
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#51 - 2012-12-14 00:06:10 UTC
One of you awesome people suggested that I spam L2's until I get to L4's (since this character cannot initiate L4's on her own).

That person suggested I use an anti-frigate Stabber to do the job, and I have to say, this is really fun. I feel like I learn about combat better this way instead of floating inside of a Drake, mauling things (which I've done before).

Now that I feel better about the game, I am thinking about PVP. May anyone care to suggest a good way to start PVP that isn't RvB? Is faction warfare difficult to get into? I feel like I'd have fun cruising in a cheaply fit anti-frigate (pvp, not pve) Stabber or something.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#52 - 2012-12-14 00:15:47 UTC
Lady Hestia wrote:
One of you awesome people suggested that I spam L2's until I get to L4's (since this character cannot initiate L4's on her own).

That person suggested I use an anti-frigate Stabber to do the job, and I have to say, this is really fun. I feel like I learn about combat better this way instead of floating inside of a Drake, mauling things (which I've done before).

Now that I feel better about the game, I am thinking about PVP. May anyone care to suggest a good way to start PVP that isn't RvB? Is faction warfare difficult to get into? I feel like I'd have fun cruising in a cheaply fit anti-frigate (pvp, not pve) Stabber or something.



Try EVE University for a few weeks or something and see how it goes. At least you will learn some proper technique before diving in to Faction Warfare. Smile

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Alexstrazaas
Doomheim
#53 - 2012-12-14 01:17:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Alexstrazaas
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Andski wrote:
Lady Hestia wrote:
At 16Mil SP I don't feel like my difficulty is justified. I use PYFA, EVEMON, even Battleclinic to find fits, and yet somehow my game is so difficult.


Any fitting you find on Battleclinic is useless unless you understand why it accomplishes (or fails to accomplish) its supposed objective.


Additionally, don't fly level 2 missions solo with a destroyer - dessies are damage dealers, not damage takers. You need to be tanked if you're going solo. Use a cruiser or a battlecruiser. Try the Vexor, good drone boat. The Talos will make life very easy for you.



LIE LIE LIE

i been doing lvl 2's in the dragoon and i do fine, granted i do have 20 mil SP, but i have low armor skills*lol i only flew caldari ship's for ever* and i am active armor tanking them while dpsing and salavging with drones afterwords. and i am cap stable with everything on except my lazors i have to turn off every now in then cause it's a very close cap stable

i do make sure i have 2 hardener''s for the mission though, then have one armor repairer and a afterburner so i speed tank alot of the damage to sinc ei have no armor mod's slowing me down and i got decent missle skills, awsume gunnery skills *for hybreds but working on lazors atm for the dragoon and drones to

i have not died once done several, dragoon is very solid for 2's imo if you can fit the right stuff, sure i can do 4's in my Rohk but 2's are much more fun.

my fit is like this

3 lazors *standard atm*
3 rockets tech 2 with long range ammo

afterburner t2
targetpainter

drone damage mod t2
2 hardeners mission specific t2
1 armor rep *using a special one but it's only a little better then tech 2* but i am sure tech 2 is fine if you have high armor skills since mine suck ballz

3 CCC for rig's

i got about 13k range for weapons and orbit stuff with afterburners at 10km to speed tank the cruiser's and frigs i always target first, drone's i think got 40k range off the top of my head *don't qoute me*

drone dps is like 90
missle is like 45
lazor is like 45

speed is about 600 m/s

AND THE BEST PART IS HOLDING SALAVGE DRONES AND SCOUTS FOR ONE TRIP!!!!!
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#54 - 2012-12-14 02:36:38 UTC
Lady Hestia wrote:
I am now aware that the Algos (new Gallentean destroyer) is better at PVP than PVE, but when I bought one and fitted it and went into a L2 mission (working on standings with a specific corp), I nearly died on the first salvo of weapons.


We'll be adding this to our catalog some time next month...

RAEC Kaiken
Destroyer: Corax Class
High: 7 x Rocket Launcher I
Medium: 1 x EM Ward Amplifier I, 1 x Thermic Dissipation Amplifier I, 2 x Medium Shield Extender I
Low: 1 x Micro Auxiliary Power Core I, 1 x Power Diagnostic System I
Rigs: 1 x Small Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I, 1 x Small Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer I, 1 x Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Ammo: Lots of rockets.

I've tested this, by the way, and yes it stomps L2 very easily. The range is crap, and it's rather slow, but once in range it will be the enemy rats that are dying in one salvo, not you. The shield tank on it is rather obnoxiously high for it's class, which is why you needn't be worrying about speed or range - you can soak up incoming fire and laugh at them, then methodically pop them off one by one as their shots bounce off your shields like raindrops.

Now the vets can laugh all they want at all the T1 stuff, but it's cheap & easy to mass produce and even a two week old character can completely dominate L2 missions with it. If you feel like upgrading to T2 stuff be my guest - but you won't really have to. We'll probably retail them to various newbie training groups for around two million with all the extras. Again, perfectly friendly even to two week old pilots.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#55 - 2012-12-14 02:43:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
I do not recommend new players to use the new Dessies like the Corax as they are glass cannons and a lot has to be learned first to work around that part of fitting.

Please don't set up new players for fail. Please.

The Cormorant works just fine for Level II's.




edit: Honestly, this thread has been a disaster.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#56 - 2012-12-14 02:44:30 UTC
Andski wrote:
Lady Hestia wrote:
At 16Mil SP I don't feel like my difficulty is justified. I use PYFA, EVEMON, even Battleclinic to find fits, and yet somehow my game is so difficult.


Any fitting you find on Battleclinic is useless unless you understand why it accomplishes (or fails to accomplish) its supposed objective.


And when you understand the objective and how it is built towards it, you can nearly always do better than a Battleclinic fit on your own (they tend to use overpriced modules they don't need for a 2% boost in effectiveness or are just straight bad).
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