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Ideal ships for L4's

Author
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2012-12-10 03:00:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Caleidascope
Cambarus wrote:
You should still probably link your fit, since it sounds bad and you would benefit from having some more experienced players help you fix it.

the original fit was 7 cruise launchers, 3 bcu, 1 x-large shield booster, 2 shield boost amplifiers, the rest to taste. bad... another lol

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Ragnarok Knight
ROGUE - DRONES
#22 - 2012-12-10 03:11:23 UTC
The BEST mission running ship USED to be the dominix. but now drones get killed. so now it is the WORST

The best now are ammar battleships, due to the high-tanking. Ease of cap-stability, light drone capabilities, and the efficiency of not having to use expensive ammunition so thus making more isk-per-hour.


.....or you could stop doing mission running.....
Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#23 - 2012-12-10 03:25:33 UTC
Meh, best mission ship is still the Machariel.
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#24 - 2012-12-10 03:33:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Cambarus
Ragnarok Knight wrote:
The BEST mission running ship USED to be the dominix. but now drones get killed. so now it is the WORST

The best now are ammar battleships, due to the high-tanking. Ease of cap-stability, light drone capabilities, and the efficiency of not having to use expensive ammunition so thus making more isk-per-hour.


.....or you could stop doing mission running.....

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. Drones pulling aggro isn't an issue with sentry drones (which is what a domi should be using) and the DPS output from a well fit domi is absurd, I actually think it's the best damage projection of any ship in the game.
(EDIT: subcaps I mean)
EDIT 2: I can actually squeeze about 20 more dps out of a vindi, (1405 DPS with rails vs 1426)
MrTiddle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2012-12-10 08:18:24 UTC
Ragnarok Knight wrote:
The BEST mission running ship USED to be the dominix. but now drones get killed. so now it is the WORST

The best now are ammar battleships, due to the high-tanking. Ease of cap-stability, light drone capabilities, and the efficiency of not having to use expensive ammunition so thus making more isk-per-hour.


.....or you could stop doing mission running.....



any solid reasons to call Domi the WORST other than drones get killed?

no matter what ship you have as soon as the drones launched they'll be killed. And Domi has double bonuses both hybrids/drones. So thechnically you can fit T2 Neutrons + mag stabbs and still have enough DPS plus throw cheap T1 drones so wouldn't worry about you loose it.

Anyway Domi is still one of the best machines to run missions with.

Boudacca Sangrere
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#26 - 2012-12-10 08:53:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Boudacca Sangrere
I just played around with some fits and I think CCP has actually given us a (not "the", but just "a") tool to handle the new rat AI:

Behold the Large Micro Jump Drive

Sample fit:

Navy Scorpion

High Slots:

Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Auto Targeting System I

Mid Slots:

Gist B-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amp.
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Rat specific hardener (damage type 1)
Rat specific hardener (damage type 1)
Rat specific hardener (damage type 2)
Rat specific hardener (damage type 2)
Large Micro Jump Drive

Low Slots:

Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II

Rigs:

Large Warhead Flare
Large Warhead Rigor
Large Warhead Rigor

Drones:

5 x Hobgoblin II
5 x Hammerhead II

Basically, you are utilizing the strenght of the cruise missile - range. Upon landing on grid, (depending on rat spawn distance), you turn around and fire up the Micro Warp Drive, then snipe as ships come, rinse and repeat if needed. TP helps targeting frigs. Drones are there to help if needed as well. I know this is slightly overtanked, but I rather overtank then buy new : P (at least until I get fully used to the new AI).

I have no experience with Gallente ships, but I recon that this trick should work just as well with a Navy Domi and Sentries...

B.
Nicolai Xperte
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2012-12-10 10:21:35 UTC
Boudacca Sangrere wrote:
I just played around with some fits and I think CCP has actually given us a (not "the", but just "a") tool to handle the new rat AI:

Behold the Large Micro Jump Drive

Sample fit:

Navy Scorpion

High Slots:

Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Auto Targeting System I

Mid Slots:

Gist B-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amp.
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Rat specific hardener (damage type 1)
Rat specific hardener (damage type 1)
Rat specific hardener (damage type 2)
Rat specific hardener (damage type 2)
Large Micro Jump Drive

Low Slots:

Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II

Rigs:

Large Warhead Flare
Large Warhead Rigor
Large Warhead Rigor

Drones:

5 x Hobgoblin II
5 x Hammerhead II

Basically, you are utilizing the strenght of the cruise missile - range. Upon landing on grid, (depending on rat spawn distance), you turn around and fire up the Micro Warp Drive, then snipe as ships come, rinse and repeat if needed. TP helps targeting frigs. Drones are there to help if needed as well. I know this is slightly overtanked, but I rather overtank then buy new : P (at least until I get fully used to the new AI).

I have no experience with Gallente ships, but I recon that this trick should work just as well with a Navy Domi and Sentries...

B.


That's alot of work just to kill some frigs esp with cruise missiles, with the new drone mechanics at work you should primary frigs right away with your drones let them get close so that your drones are within instant return range and you should be just fine. We will need to adapt to using that extra drop down menu to show drone status (S/A/H) and pay attn to when frigs drop locks to switch to your drones 'cause I don't think CCP will change or alter the game mechanics of this just yet. On the other hand I wish they would do something about the Sansha TD's that's a true pain in the arse. Oh btw I did try Medium Drones and the frigs still target them so be advised.

I don't always bring out my Absolution.

But when I do it makes the Blue's rage, lol.

Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#28 - 2012-12-10 10:32:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniel Plain
i have yet to lose more than three drones in a mission after the patch. i have run WC, sanshas vengeance, sanshas blockade, silence the informant and gurista assault, most of them several times. either i am incredibly lucky or people who are crying about missions are full of crap.

I should buy an Ishtar.

Nicolai Xperte
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2012-12-10 10:44:09 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
i have yet to lose more than three drones in a mission after the patch. i have run WC, sanshas vengeance, sanshas blockade, silence the informant and gurista assault, most of them several times. either i am incredibly lucky or people who are crying about missions are full of crap.


I did a Stop the Thief deployed drones and they instantly popped about 3 but you know how many non-scram frigs are in that mission a lot so I left em alone Big smile

I don't always bring out my Absolution.

But when I do it makes the Blue's rage, lol.

Souxie Alduin
Anarchy in the Eve
#30 - 2012-12-10 14:38:48 UTC
Personally I have had a lot of fun with a Vindicator (Yes, I know it's a loot pinata, and no, I don't fly it with this characterSmile):

8x 425mm Railgun II (Void for extra oomph. Javelin for extra tracking. Fed Navy AM for everything else.)

100MN experimental AB
3x Cap Recharger II
Sensor Booster II w/ scripts

Damage Control II
1600 rolled tungsten
Fed. Navy Large armor rep
2x Corelum C-type EANM (or similar)
3x Fed. Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer

4 Sentries
5 light drones

2x Large Cap. Control Ciruit
1x Large Anti-Explosive Pump

Dps is about 1100 w/ drones, 850 without

Cap lasts 5 minutes with everything running, almost stable w/out (by the time you run out everything should be dead, or you're doing something wrong).

Need to be a bit careful with aggro management in some missions, and it's useless in any missions with sensor damps (Rattlesnake or Navy Domi for those).
Mavnas
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2012-12-10 22:00:06 UTC
Oh man... that micro jump drive would be quite interesting on my Tach Apoc. I'm not sure it needs a tank at all anymore?
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#32 - 2012-12-11 00:08:44 UTC
Souxie Alduin wrote:
Personally I have had a lot of fun with a Vindicator (Yes, I know it's a loot pinata, and no, I don't fly it with this characterSmile):

8x 425mm Railgun II (Void for extra oomph. Javelin for extra tracking. Fed Navy AM for everything else.)

100MN experimental AB
3x Cap Recharger II
Sensor Booster II w/ scripts

Damage Control II
1600 rolled tungsten
Fed. Navy Large armor rep
2x Corelum C-type EANM (or similar)
3x Fed. Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer

4 Sentries
5 light drones

2x Large Cap. Control Ciruit
1x Large Anti-Explosive Pump

Dps is about 1100 w/ drones, 850 without

Cap lasts 5 minutes with everything running, almost stable w/out (by the time you run out everything should be dead, or you're doing something wrong).

Need to be a bit careful with aggro management in some missions, and it's useless in any missions with sensor damps (Rattlesnake or Navy Domi for those).



Not sure why you would want to put a plate on a mission ship, I would just put a mission specific hardner or EANM. Also use a cap booster and use the freed up mids for a web and tracking, same with the cap rigs... I find I barely even have to cap inject, and I run a mwd occasionally.

To the OP.. depends on what skills you have trained at the moment. Raven\CNR\Navy scorp are really good for missioning if you have missile skills.. if you have turret, specifically hybrid skills, I would suggest the vindi or navy mega, never tried the standard mega, but I guess it would work. If you have fairly low skill points just carry on with what you doing.. I used a raven then tengu and stayed with them till I got to round 40mil SP before I cross trained.
Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#33 - 2012-12-11 00:30:48 UTC
My Domi still works for me.....yeah, I lose more t1 lights now...but so what? They are cheap as popcorn.

Everything in EVE is a trap.

And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:)

You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.

Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.

Ivar Estidal
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#34 - 2012-12-11 10:27:17 UTC
From what I've heard you can PVE with a Rokh, but i wouldn't recommend it. The Raven is apparently a solid mission ship.
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#35 - 2012-12-11 13:59:55 UTC
Cambarus wrote:
You should still probably link your fit, since it sounds bad and you would benefit from having some more experienced players help you fix it.


He sounds like a troll - surely no CNR pilot is THAT bad?
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#36 - 2012-12-11 14:03:58 UTC
Ivar Estidal wrote:
From what I've heard you can PVE with a Rokh, but i wouldn't recommend it. The Raven is apparently a solid mission ship.


People constantly underestimate the rokh. it's range bonus gives it unparralelled projection (read: REAL DPS).

Take it out of EFT and into a mission.
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#37 - 2012-12-11 23:58:27 UTC
Maeltstome wrote:
Ivar Estidal wrote:
From what I've heard you can PVE with a Rokh, but i wouldn't recommend it. The Raven is apparently a solid mission ship.


People constantly underestimate the rokh. it's range bonus gives it unparralelled projection (read: REAL DPS).

Take it out of EFT and into a mission.

The problem with the rokh in pve is the philosophy of hybrids and how well they don't mesh:
The base range on blasters is just too small to really benefit from the 50% bonus(and too much of blaster range comes from falloff) and rails have so much range to begin with you'll rarely ever NEED that range bonus to hit things in missions. To put it clearly:
A blaster rokh will not outdamage a blaster / sentry domi, at any range, and one with rails will only do extra damage past ~90km because the domi can't lock that far. The navy domi is pretty much the king of pve for hybrid users (as well as the vindi, though I would argue the domi's higher versatility makes it more useful)

It's also worth noting that pve ships are all about damage projection. You can survive in a l4 mission with a laughably small tank, and the only real way to measure the effectiveness of a pve ship is how much isk it brings in, which is determined mostly by how well it applies damage at the ranges required of it. Basically any kind of mission ship that relies on range to stay alive is going to do poorly, because you trade range for damage, and the conversion rate tends to be much worse than dropping a bit of damage for a little more tank.

I would say that hands down the most common mistake people make in pve is assuming they need more tank than they do. Once you learn how to fly and get the SP/ fits to back it up most lvl 4s can be done with almost no tank at all.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#38 - 2012-12-12 09:56:27 UTC
Cambarus wrote:
Maeltstome wrote:
Ivar Estidal wrote:
From what I've heard you can PVE with a Rokh, but i wouldn't recommend it. The Raven is apparently a solid mission ship.


People constantly underestimate the rokh. it's range bonus gives it unparralelled projection (read: REAL DPS).

Take it out of EFT and into a mission.

The problem with the rokh in pve is the philosophy of hybrids and how well they don't mesh:
The base range on blasters is just too small to really benefit from the 50% bonus(and too much of blaster range comes from falloff) and rails have so much range to begin with you'll rarely ever NEED that range bonus to hit things in missions. To put it clearly:
A blaster rokh will not outdamage a blaster / sentry domi, at any range, and one with rails will only do extra damage past ~90km because the domi can't lock that far. The navy domi is pretty much the king of pve for hybrid users (as well as the vindi, though I would argue the domi's higher versatility makes it more useful)

It's also worth noting that pve ships are all about damage projection. You can survive in a l4 mission with a laughably small tank, and the only real way to measure the effectiveness of a pve ship is how much isk it brings in, which is determined mostly by how well it applies damage at the ranges required of it. Basically any kind of mission ship that relies on range to stay alive is going to do poorly, because you trade range for damage, and the conversion rate tends to be much worse than dropping a bit of damage for a little more tank.

I would say that hands down the most common mistake people make in pve is assuming they need more tank than they do. Once you learn how to fly and get the SP/ fits to back it up most lvl 4s can be done with almost no tank at all.


agreed. especially with the part where blasters have too little range and railguns have 'too much' (as in: it would be better if they had less range but better dps and tracking instead).

I should buy an Ishtar.

Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#39 - 2012-12-12 21:55:49 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:


agreed. especially with the part where blasters have too little range and railguns have 'too much' (as in: it would be better if they had less range but better dps and tracking instead).

I would say that this is a rokh problem moreso than a hybrid problem, because my rail domi puts out more dps than my pulse nightmare, which is just insane.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#40 - 2012-12-13 02:27:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
any battleship you can fly with 1000dps

instant damage is best

nightmare is great, though it's not very tanky(but uses lasers which are virtually ammo-free) 1bil hull
rattlesnake is tanky-est but it has low dps and it sucks when npc's eat your drones 550mil hull
golem with light drones is nice if you take advantage of the shield boost bonus and run an aggressive repping setup
-but- golems should use torps and the range is limited on torps 1 bil hull

i would stay away from armor-- I don't say that just because we are caldari, but because shields regen on their own

those ships--nightmare, rattlesnake, and golem have 7 mid slots
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