These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Market Discussions

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

New to the Market

Author
Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-12-07 20:55:08 UTC
Hello guys and gals

I have been getting really into mining recently, its so much fun mining up a bunch of ore and then making something with it.

But i am still unsure of what to make, or how to analysis the market to find something to sell at a profit. When i say profit i mean at a price higher than what it would be to just sell the ore/minerals.

Any tips or links you could give me would be great.

Thanks
Bridgette d'Iberville
Better Killing Through Chemistry
#2 - 2012-12-07 21:01:39 UTC
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/excel/

Not a joke post.

"I considered a career in griefing, but then realized that I would never achieve the level of tear generation that CCP manages to do each and every expansion."

Matalino
#3 - 2012-12-07 21:07:48 UTC
Sounds like you might be over thinking the wrong parts of the trading process. Just compare what your selling price is for the item with the selling price of the materials. There isn't much to analys in that respect. More thought might go into figuring out how prices change with location and time, and then figuring out how to profit from those price differences.
Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-12-07 21:09:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Teeku
Bridgette d'Iberville wrote:
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/excel/

Not a joke post.


Some good advice there, i have already started to make a few spread sheets for my ammo builds it really does help out.


Although i would suggest LibreOffice, its Opensource! (Linux, Mac, Windows)
http://www.libreoffice.org/download/

:=D
Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-12-07 21:10:27 UTC
Matalino wrote:
Sounds like you might be over thinking the wrong parts of the trading process. Just compare what your selling price is for the item with the selling price of the materials. There isn't much to analys in that respect. More thought might go into figuring out how prices change with location and time, and then figuring out how to profit from those price differences.


thanks, some interesting clues in there :=D
Ruvin
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2012-12-07 21:12:37 UTC
Teeku wrote:
Some good advice there, i have already started to make a few spread sheets for my ammo builds it really does help out.


Although i would suggest LibreOffice, its Opensource! (Linux, Mac, Windows)
http://www.libreoffice.org/download/

:=D




That was mind as a advice "excell" you can use even google one if you like :)

If youre new a tip : usually people while building stuff have almost perfect skills , so they get a profit where you could be in loss , just be carefull , maybe its more profitable just sell the raw minerals , while you get youre refining and manufacturing (core skills) higher :)

Opportunities multiply as they are seized.

Emma d'Acques
Doomheim
#7 - 2012-12-07 21:14:00 UTC
Start off with researching what sells and what not.
Browse the forums for popular ships and/or ships, and put up some tentative orders in the market to get a feel for this.

If you are serious about manufacturing for profits, start off by buying researched BPC's on contracts.
Producing from virgin BPO's will not give you any reasonable profits, you'll most likely end up making a loss with those.
Also, if you produce your items ine one station, and you sell at another, you have to factor in cost of hauling too.

I'm not totally useless, I can be used as a bad example.

Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-12-07 21:50:37 UTC
Ruvin wrote:
If youre new a tip : usually people while building stuff have almost perfect skills , so they get a profit where you could be in loss , just be carefull , maybe its more profitable just sell the raw minerals , while you get youre refining and manufacturing (core skills) higher :)



Now there is some great advice, thanks dude. I am already working on Refining and production efficiency, any other skills you would recommend?
Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-12-07 21:53:09 UTC
Emma d'Acques wrote:
Start off with researching what sells and what not.
Browse the forums for popular ships and/or ships, and put up some tentative orders in the market to get a feel for this.

If you are serious about manufacturing for profits, start off by buying researched BPC's on contracts.
Producing from virgin BPO's will not give you any reasonable profits, you'll most likely end up making a loss with those.
Also, if you produce your items ine one station, and you sell at another, you have to factor in cost of hauling too.



Ah i thought BPO would be the better options, I have been buying up quite a few of them recently.

I do vaguely remember something to do with BPCs and research or something similar to improve them for a short amount of runs. Do you know what this process is called?
Bridgette d'Iberville
Better Killing Through Chemistry
#10 - 2012-12-07 22:09:31 UTC
Teeku wrote:
[quote=Ruvin]Now there is some great advice, thanks dude. I am already working on Refining and production efficiency, any other skills you would recommend?

For Building Stuff:
Industry
Mass Production
Advanced Mass Production
Supply Chain Management

Rigging Skills (If you want to build rigs)

You can also invest in the Research related skills, but if you don't have regular access to a POS or research slots, you're probably better off going the BPC route until you can buy researched BPOs.

"I considered a career in griefing, but then realized that I would never achieve the level of tear generation that CCP manages to do each and every expansion."

Bridgette d'Iberville
Better Killing Through Chemistry
#11 - 2012-12-07 22:12:12 UTC
Teeku wrote:
[quote=Emma d'Acques]I do vaguely remember something to do with BPCs and research or something similar to improve them for a short amount of runs. Do you know what this process is called?

Sounds like Invention where by you create T2 BPCs from T1 BPCs. Very skill intensive, requires additional somewhat expensive materials, and also suffers from the slot problem (although invention slots are usually not that challenging to find). I'd get a handle on manufacturing (and selling, which we haven't even covered) before attempting invention.

"I considered a career in griefing, but then realized that I would never achieve the level of tear generation that CCP manages to do each and every expansion."

Emma d'Acques
Doomheim
#12 - 2012-12-07 23:12:03 UTC
Teeku wrote:

Ah i thought BPO would be the better options, I have been buying up quite a few of them recently.

I do vaguely remember something to do with BPCs and research or something similar to improve them for a short amount of runs. Do you know what this process is called?


Unresearched BPO's are not the better option on most occasion, as the amount of raw materials needed is larger than the amount needed on the researched BPC's, and skills haven't been taken into account yet.
In most cases, you'll soon realise there's not a loftof ISK to be made with that.

But the process you are referring to is simple research.
To do research, you need to acquire a slot for either ME (Material Efficiency) or PE (Production Efficiency).
This process costs money and, depending on BPO and current researched level, can take up anywhere from a few hours to days for 1 level of ME/PE.

On the matter of short amount of runs, that's BPC's.
Generally, BPC's available on contracts have been copied from researched BPO's. For these BPC's you'll have to use less raw minerals to build the item in question, and they'll more than likely take less time to build.
These BPC's will have a maximum run amount of X, where X stands for the amount of times you can use said BPC, where you can thus produce X amounts of that particular item/ship.

Even if you factor in the cost of BPC purchase, you'll quickly notice that producing from researched BPC's is more profitable than producing from unresearched BPO's.
This will all have to be factored in for deciding the amount at which you will sell said item/ship.

Another thing you might want to take into account is the difference between selling to buy orders, and setting your own sell orders.
Selling to buy orders might net you, for example, 100 ISK per unit sold, whereas setting up your own sell order might net you 120 ISK per unit sold.
However, getting

I'm not totally useless, I can be used as a bad example.

Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-12-07 23:36:27 UTC
Bridgette d'Iberville thanks so much for the advice and skill list. Its really given me a head start, and also some keywords to google

Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#14 - 2012-12-07 23:38:58 UTC
Emma d'Acques thank you as well, some solid in depth advice there.
Rainbow Moose
Perkone
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-12-08 14:14:27 UTC
If you want to start manufacturing for profit, then you must first get Production Efficiency V, no ifs, ands, or buts.

HOWEVER - (Caveat) - there are certain items that require so few materials that having PE5 actually does not help, such as items that require only 1 of mat A, 1 of mat B, and 4 of mat C. Finding these items, though, is up to you P

Most items though you will need PE5 for to expect any sort of profit. You can message me in game and I can give you more advice on how to set up a profitable T1 manufacturing operation with little capital. But for right now, get PE5, then Mass Production 5, then Advanced Mass Production 4. This will allow you to run 10 manufacturing lines at minimum production waste. After you get these, then you should worry about research, tier 2 production, etc etc.

Tier 1 manufacturing is all about market research. Find BPOs that you can afford, and calculate the ISK/hr/BPO for each item. Buy a few BPOs and start producing items. Also, when doing profit calculations make sure you understand how Taxes and Fees on the market work. (Accounting and Broker Relations help these) They can be a significant amount of your profit margin. Sometimes it is worth selling to a buy order at 12,000 isk rather than setting up a sell order at 12,250 isk due to taxes.
Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-12-08 18:53:04 UTC
Rainbow Moose thanks a lot, all this information is really helping. I have made a list of all the skills you suggested, and i will queue them up in my skill tree.

Also i will be logging into eve in a bit, i will add you to my friends list.

Thanks
Teeku
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2012-12-10 23:34:56 UTC
Some really great tips in here guys, thanks so much.

Does anyone else have anymore to add, maybe on the subject of what to actually build with my minerals or how to analyse the market to find out what to make?