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Few weeks after Retribution.

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Tarvos Telesto
Blood Fanatics
#101 - 2012-12-07 04:41:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarvos Telesto
CCP Punkturis wrote:


I'm excited to see how the system evolves over the next few weeks. I've been have so much fun watching the most wanted and top bounty hunters lists since Tuesday Big smile


People in top bounty list are people who set bounty on your self using alts - main, just to boost own ego or somthing like this, like before patch.

I remember guy with top bounty with over 100 or 200bil isk on own head , he was in my wach list like more than one year, ( i dont even dream to pod him) and what interesing he never log in sicne years for longer than 10min long, probably only to swich skills :) most of them are nonactive characters who never undock etc, except few people who want some risk... In general people in EvE are smart, people in EvE wont pay x bil isk for random player just for lulz, except some hardcore cases.

Im sorry but this is painful fact.

EvE isn't game, its style of living.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#102 - 2012-12-07 04:45:27 UTC
Simvastatin Montelukast wrote:
Bounties need to be placed on piwates. I have been placing them on everybody who flys though the system...
Where are the noob systems? Sounds like fun to make them wanted.


Why fun ? You must hate the game for wanting to grief someone just starting out and making them even possible leave. Pathetic.

Besides, CCP has apparently taken care of that issue as of this morning.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Tarvos Telesto
Blood Fanatics
#103 - 2012-12-07 04:59:44 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Simvastatin Montelukast wrote:
Bounties need to be placed on piwates. I have been placing them on everybody who flys though the system...
Where are the noob systems? Sounds like fun to make them wanted.


Why fun ? You must hate the game for wanting to grief someone just starting out and making them even possible leave. Pathetic.

Besides, CCP has apparently taken care of that issue as of this morning.


At last newbis are immune to bounty for 14 day long , but maybe this guy was ironic...

EvE isn't game, its style of living.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#104 - 2012-12-07 05:01:42 UTC
Tarvos Telesto wrote:
but maybe this guy was ironic...


I don't think so.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Tarvos Telesto
Blood Fanatics
#105 - 2012-12-07 05:14:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarvos Telesto
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:
but maybe this guy was ironic...


I don't think so.


In my opinion even character older than 14 day long is still newbi, meny people who are new in game become at last confused while they see bounty... This wont make them more unsafe, because with positive sec status they safe like before patch, but this give them mark - stamp, and here we go, what the point of giving "mothers, familys, presidents, doctors, professors and criminals exact same look" (skull in overview, and bounty below character picture) that why i create this thread.

Again.

Bounty on criminals, yes! cool stuf.
Bounty Hunters opportunity, yes, very cool stuf.
Bounty money distribution cool!
Killrights buy-sell cool!

Bounty on everyone (skulls everywhere on overview) unrealistic and wired look...

EvE isn't game, its style of living.
xpl0de
Caldari State
#106 - 2012-12-07 05:48:16 UTC  |  Edited by: xpl0de
Tarvos Telesto wrote:

Bounty on everyone (skulls everywhere on overview) unrealistic and wired look...

Qft. Bounties on everyone is a terribad idea and now there is no difference between the criminals and all the miner, trader, and industrialist players. The only ones rooting for the new splash are all the carebear scrubs who cant go out and earn a real bounty on their own. They should atleast reinstate the security status minimum.

-10.0 since the Womb
Tarvos Telesto
Blood Fanatics
#107 - 2012-12-07 05:50:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarvos Telesto
xpl0de wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:

Bounty on everyone (skulls everywhere on overview) unrealistic and wired look...

Qft. Bounties on everyone is a terribad idea and now there is no difference between the criminals and all the miner, trader, and industrialist players. The only ones rooting for the new splash are all the carebear scrubs who cant go out and earn a real bounty on their own.


That why pirates become same like carebars, who got real bounty?Roll Like you see this bounty on everyone are bad for two group. Now define carebear and pirate hehe.

EvE isn't game, its style of living.
Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#108 - 2012-12-07 05:52:20 UTC
Singulis Pacifica wrote:
Darek Castigatus wrote:

Rant.


You obviously didn't read my post well enough for you to understand that this is not a point of concern. I'm fully aware of what the bounty hunter system does and does not do, which I why I made several posts in the dev blog when it was added.

Fact of the matter is: the current system makes no sense for most of the bounties added to players. A few million ISK on me will mean zilch. The main point is... what is the use of a bounty if it is never removed, nor intended for the receiver to be hunted across New Eden?


They are doing it to get under your skin. Clearly it's working. The novelty will wear off I promise.

But look at it this way: what if someone with 5.0 sec status pisses you off to the point where you'd be happy to pay 500 mil to see his life made miserable for a while? How do you justify to the coding of EVE online that this bastard deserves a bounty and not any of the other 5.0 players out there? This is why the change was great, people like me who had low sec status (-9.9) going into Retribution know that my sec status is only an indicator of how aggressive I am in low sec, nothing else. When I deal in contracts, market orders or ransom negotiations I will do whatever I promise to and I don't scam. There are tons of players out there who will not honor ransoms or other arrangements and many of them are sec status > -2.0 (ie. not eligible for bounties previously). The fact that you don't have to catch pods to get bounties also means it gets paid out turning bounty hunting into a potential career path that was not really available before. I made 10 mil on launch day fighting shadow cartel pilots, under the old system I would have gotten nothing since we caught no pods.

Most people are posting about how they are putting up 100k ISK on everyone in high sec just to get hate mail and it's working and let's be honest as has been said before bounty =/= killright and suicide ganking voids insurance. You'll need a bounty MUCH higher than that before it starts to be an driving force behind a suicide gank. What is it that bothers you about the "WANTED" sign exactly? It sounds to me like people are upset about that label but I can't conceive of why you would care, it makes no difference to you on a day-to-day basis at all unless your bounty gets really high. So can someone please explain to me why you could have a rational reason for this to bother you. How does it negatively impact you outside of your own discomfort which is as far as I can tell is completely phantom pain.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.
Tarvos Telesto
Blood Fanatics
#109 - 2012-12-07 06:08:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarvos Telesto
Waiting for new EvE storyline espetialy about our super corrupt Concord, they are some kind of law in New eden, and they alow everyone to set bounty - mark on everyone at once Lol

EvE isn't game, its style of living.
Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#110 - 2012-12-07 06:10:03 UTC
xpl0de wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:

Bounty on everyone (skulls everywhere on overview) unrealistic and wired look...

Qft. Bounties on everyone is a terribad idea and now there is no difference between the criminals and all the miner, trader, and industrialist players. The only ones rooting for the new splash are all the carebear scrubs who cant go out and earn a real bounty on their own. They should atleast reinstate the security status minimum.


Everyone who plays this game is a criminal. If you're not shooting people you are supplying or assisting in supplying the guns. It's not a matter of whether or not your hands are dirty it's a question of degree.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.
xpl0de
Caldari State
#111 - 2012-12-07 06:53:57 UTC
Valleria Darkmoon wrote:
xpl0de wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:

Bounty on everyone (skulls everywhere on overview) unrealistic and wired look...

Qft. Bounties on everyone is a terribad idea and now there is no difference between the criminals and all the miner, trader, and industrialist players. The only ones rooting for the new splash are all the carebear scrubs who cant go out and earn a real bounty on their own. They should atleast reinstate the security status minimum.


Everyone who plays this game is a criminal. If you're not shooting people you are supplying or assisting in supplying the guns. It's not a matter of whether or not your hands are dirty it's a question of degree.

Thats a good point. But with the new system u blur the degree, atleast visually to an extent. The masses look the same. A bounty means even less than before by becoming so widespread.

-10.0 since the Womb
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#112 - 2012-12-07 07:43:30 UTC
Widespread bounties are a positive thing. They're giving people who previously never bothered to learn an incentive to find out how they work.

Also the people saying bounties should "expire" aren't explaining what problem this will solve.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#113 - 2012-12-07 08:09:58 UTC
xpl0de wrote:
Tarvos Telesto wrote:

Bounty on everyone (skulls everywhere on overview) unrealistic and wired look...

Qft. Bounties on everyone is a terribad idea and now there is no difference between the criminals and all the miner, trader, and industrialist players. The only ones rooting for the new splash are all the carebear scrubs who cant go out and earn a real bounty on their own. They should atleast reinstate the security status minimum.


The whole point of bounties is to inflict revenge or punishment when the law won't
O

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Xen Solarus
Furious Destruction and Salvage
#114 - 2012-12-07 08:36:45 UTC
Malcanis wrote:

The whole point of bounties is to inflict revenge or punishment when the law won't
O


I agree if that were the case. The majority of bounties have nothing to do with revenge or punishment. Soon people will be slapping bounties of people for the sole reason that they don't yet have a bounty. People who haven't killed a single player, or those with max sec status are just as wanted as the most hardened criminal scum!

Soon people that aren't wanted will be a rare thing! I always imagined bounty hunting to be something of a profession, where people could focus on going out into new eden, tracking down the scum for the bounty on their head. Now its just the matter of shooting anyone, and BAM, collected some bounty. Kinda kills the profession.

Post with your main, like a BOSS!

And no, i don't live in highsec.  As if that would make your opinion any less wrong.  
Shayden
#115 - 2012-12-07 09:54:02 UTC
Yes EVE is not a safe place to stay and you should always be on your guard, but the new bounty system is more being used as a gimmick, a lol factor on many ppl who didnt do nothing but be the target of someone having a bad day or think they is funny etc.

Is this the way we want to go? you didnt like someones point in chat channel, BOUNTY, i dont like how your ship is fitted BOUNTY, i dont like your name BOUNTY, i mean come on, even the most hardcore bounty hunters must agree that seing so many lame bounties on ppl now will just make their job less fun as now a bounty will lose its real meaning.

I predict its gonna be used as a troll weapon more than an actual i want you dead for your actions option.
Singulis Pacifica
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#116 - 2012-12-07 10:06:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Singulis Pacifica
CCP Punkturis wrote:


and what has happened? people have bounties.. and what? are hisec people being ganked because of it?


After all my posts, you still don't understand why I am openly debating with you, don't you?
Ok, patience is a virtue, so let's try this again.

A bounty: a premium or reward (taken from dictionary.com)
This we can both agree on. But now, what is the meaning of the word?

A bounty is given when an action has taken place that merits it. Right?
Now let's add this to your current version of the bounty hunter system. There are lots of people who use the system the way you and I hope it works out. Some people annoy other people and now, they can be targetted by adding a nice bounty on his or her head and the aim is that this person will lose a ship or two from that point forward. This is exactly working as intended and I congratulate you on achieving this goal with the new system.

But now the practical implementation if you will. Currently, the minimum bounty to be put on individual players is 100k ISK. This amount is roughly equal to a simple Lvl 1 distribution mission (payout+bonus). As such, the value of a bounty like this is virtually nil. Yet, a bounty is still used here. However, now the meaning of a bounty is completely void. The "bounty" is added, but without the true intention that this person is going to be targetted across New Eden. The initiator of the bounty did not add the bounty on a target because he or she annoyed him, it is the direct opposite: The person that added the bounty does this to annoy the person receiving it.

Now, this is why the current system is meaningless. It works for what it is intended to do. Congratulations. But it is also used for the direct opposite purpose. And this is very hard to combat as people will always try to cut corners or otherwise, use a concept in a different way you intended. The only aspect you needed to do to make sure that the bounty hunter system holds true to its word and meaning is if you added a timer on a bounty. In due time a bounty would deteriorate. Therefore, people putting meaningless bounties left and right would no longer get a kick out of it as they know it's not going to last forever. Then the novelty of adding meaningless bounties will die down. But in its current form, everyone will eventually end up with one sooner or later. After all, what is the true value of 100k ISK?

I hope you now finally understand why I am debating with you. It's not about what you did. You did a very good job, after all. But it's about what you didn't do. It's about taking a concept, but forgetting to add boundaries to ensure the true meaning of the concept remains intact.
lollerwaffle
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#117 - 2012-12-07 10:10:38 UTC
What's with all the QQ about the new bounty system? Haven't had time to test it out in game yet, but it seems a lot of people are getting worked up over nothing?

On the other hand, a threshold for when the 'wanted' sign appears would be preferable if the proliferation of such signs carries on over the coming years

ps. A huge 'WANTED' sign looks pretty badass and should be reserved for more deserving people.
lollerwaffle
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#118 - 2012-12-07 10:34:27 UTC
Singulis Pacifica wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:


and what has happened? people have bounties.. and what? are hisec people being ganked because of it?


After all my posts, you still don't understand why I am openly debating with you, don't you?
Ok, patience is a virtue, so let's try this again.

A bounty: a premium or reward (taken from dictionary.com)
This we can both agree on. But now, what is the meaning of the word?

A bounty is given when an action has taken place that merits it. Right?
Now let's add this to your current version of the bounty hunter system. There are lots of people who use the system the way you and I hope it works out. Some people annoy other people and now, they can be targetted by adding a nice bounty on his or her head and the aim is that this person will lose a ship or two from that point forward. This is exactly working as intended and I congratulate you on achieving this goal with the new system.

But now the practical implementation if you will. Currently, the minimum bounty to be put on individual players is 100k ISK. This amount is roughly equal to a simple Lvl 1 distribution mission (payout+bonus). As such, the value of a bounty like this is virtually nil. Yet, a bounty is still used here. However, now the meaning of a bounty is completely void. The "bounty" is added, but without the true intention that this person is going to be targetted across New Eden. The initiator of the bounty did not add the bounty on a target because he or she annoyed him, it is the direct opposite: The person that added the bounty does this to annoy the person receiving it.

Now, this is why the current system is meaningless. It works for what it is intended to do. Congratulations. But it is also used for the direct opposite purpose. And this is very hard to combat as people will always try to curb corners or otherwise, use a concept in a different way you intended. The only aspect you needed to do to make sure that the bounty hunter system holds true to its word and meaning is if you added a timer on a bounty. In due time a bounty would deteriorate. Therefore, people putting meaningless bounties left and right would no longer get a kick out of it as they know it's not going to last forever. Then the novelty of adding meaningless bounties will die down. But in its curent form, everyone will eventually end up with one sooner or later. After all, what is the true value of 100k ISK?

I hope you now finally understand why I am debating with you. It's not about what you did. You did a very good job, after all. But it's about what you didn't do. It's about taking a concept, but forgetting to add boundaries to ensure the true meaning of the concept remains intact.




TBH, my opinion is that the 100k ISK bounty REALLY REALLY is no big deal. After a while, people are most likely to no bother with miniscule bounties for random reasons as the novelty has worn off. On the other hand, someone who is a **** in general could have multiple 100k ISK bounties placed on him over time, meaning he gradually becomes a more worthwhile target for bounty hunters.

However, as for the current random 100k ISK 'bountied' characters, I reckon there will be little to no effect in the long run, or even once the dust has settled.

I dunno much about the bounty hunting profession, but I would imagine the thought process of a bounty hunter would go like this:
1. Is the target a legal target (if in hi-sec)?
2. Is the bounty worth the sec hit?
3. Yes to both, or at least to 2
4. Shoot
5. ???
6. Profit

I seriously don't imagine bounty hunters worth their salt would waste time and sec status on newbie pilots with 100k ISK bounties, in high sec, in a frigate.

Adding arbitrary boundaries does not make bounties any more significant. If I had a bounty of 200m ISK placed on me, making me a somewhat viable target, then I could very easily remain docked and play on alts until the bounty expired, however long it takes.
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#119 - 2012-12-07 10:38:34 UTC
So the Weekend is coming and I have not played since before patchday...
I hope by now the miners in systems nearby have a nice bounty on them and fly T2 exhumers so it is actually worth ganking them for more than just the fun of it.

Any reviews on how this is working out for gankers since the patch went live?

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP
Singulis Pacifica
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#120 - 2012-12-07 10:57:25 UTC
lollerwaffle wrote:


Adding arbitrary boundaries does not make bounties any more significant. If I had a bounty of 200m ISK placed on me, making me a somewhat viable target, then I could very easily remain docked and play on alts until the bounty expired, however long it takes.



That is why for it to truely work a bounty would need to deteriorate in say 3 months or 6. Possibly even a year?. If the concept exists that a bounty deteriorates, perhaps weekly, but as a tiny percentage, then and only then, will the current system work perfectly. People with money to burn can still do stupid stuff. It's their freedom to do so and I wouldn't want to take it away from them. But it's also a sign that bounties, if you add them, need a little thought as they are not going to last forever.