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Missile Nerf Hit T2 A Little Hard?
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RangerGord
Rothschild's Sewage and Septic Sucking Services
The Possum Lodge
#1 - 2012-12-05 03:48:54 UTC
I knew the missile nerf was going to hurt a little (20% range, 10% dmg), but I did the calculations with my Nighthawk and my Tengu, it comes out to 40% range and 30% dmg nerf... so seems to me it went a little overboard. (T2 launchers and T2 missiles)

Either that or CCP doesn't want anyone using T2 Heavy Missiles anymore.

Yes I can get 'most' of the range back by switching to faction missiles, but i'm still 15-20% down in dmg for double to quadruple the cost in ammo. Did they go to far with this? I thought T2 stuff was supposed to be better and more worthwhile to skill up and use than regular... until now.

With the current T2 Heavy Missiles you have 2 options, a little more damage and way less range (Fury), or way less damage and way way way way less range (Precision). So what is the justification for using T2 Heavy Missiles at this point in time as compared to normal missiles?

WTS 50k Scourge Fury HM... WTB 50k Navy Scourge HM (half price please?)
Tarn Kugisa
Kugisa Dynamics
#2 - 2012-12-05 04:25:38 UTC
I would like to know the impact on Battleship weapon systems please (AKA real PvE ships)

Be polite. Be efficient. Have a plan to troll everyone you meet - KuroVolt
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#3 - 2012-12-05 14:47:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Shalua Rui
The question is, how are they balanced out with other missile types now? I just finished training specialized T2 missiles a couple of days ago, but even I can tell that they aren't really worth their money anymore... I mean, isn't faction stuff supposed to be not as good, overall, then T2 stuff... you know, harder to get but not as hard to skill for?

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Dave stark
#4 - 2012-12-05 20:44:36 UTC
yeah the damage nerf seems a bit harsh, the range nerf isn't as big of a problem though.
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#5 - 2012-12-06 09:25:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Lloyd Roses
Shalua Rui wrote:
I mean, isn't faction stuff supposed to be not as good, overall, then T2 stuff... ?


Actually, Missiles are still everything but bad. They still deliver good damage out to extreme ranges. It's just not broken anymore as it has been before. For the T2 missiles, all I know is that before the patch, people didn't use them against non-battleship rats, regarding pve. No big diference now.

Btw: railguns, beam lasers, artillery barely use T2 ammo, the faction is just better. Autocannons, using RF close range ammo all day over T2. Pulse lasers are used with scorch/navy multifrequency.

So if T2 missiles isn't the only type of missile you'll ever need, then deal with it. Drakes/Tengus still reach out to 50-80km depending on skills. That should be more than enough for a medium weapon system.

Phantom Buff: T2 missiles don't seem to increase your sig radius anymore.
Missile War
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-12-06 09:46:42 UTC
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Shalua Rui wrote:
I mean, isn't faction stuff supposed to be not as good, overall, then T2 stuff... ?


Actually, Missiles are still everything but bad. They still deliver good damage out to extreme ranges. It's just not broken anymore as it has been before. For the T2 missiles, all I know is that before the patch, people didn't use them against non-battleship rats, regarding pve. No big diference now.

Btw: railguns, beam lasers, artillery barely use T2 ammo, the faction is just better. Autocannons, using RF close range ammo all day over T2. Pulse lasers are used with scorch/navy multifrequency.

So if T2 missiles isn't the only type of missile you'll ever need, then deal with it. Drakes/Tengus still reach out to 50-80km depending on skills. That should be more than enough for a medium weapon system.

Phantom Buff: T2 missiles don't seem to increase your sig radius anymore.


I actually prefer to use hail and conflag over their faction counterpart...
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#7 - 2012-12-06 17:40:32 UTC
T2 or faction ammo depends highly on the situation, however I find myself ending up changing the distance quite a lot and regularly have tracking/range issues while trying to stay alive... they sure are wonderful in a lot of situations, but personally, I find myself (almost always) benefiting by Fusion over Hail and Multi over Conflag.

I got to admit that I use Quake over Fusion basically all day, but that's cause it's tracking ammo for a weapon system that reaches out further than the sensors of the matching ship :D

Back to the point: Not having THE BEST missile doesn't seem like flawed design at all. Precision rapes tacklebombers in whs now, so tengupilots are sure happy as **** again that they are now even harder to gank. Fury is awesome against large targets period. ONLY 50km range with ~400 dps (Tengu/Drake).... hmmm. (I know the number is a lot higher)
sten mattson
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#8 - 2012-12-06 19:46:04 UTC
Lloyd Roses wrote:


Actually, Missiles are still everything but bad. They still deliver good damage out to extreme ranges. It's just not broken anymore as it has been before. For the T2 missiles, all I know is that before the patch, people didn't use them against non-battleship rats, regarding pve. No big diference now.

Btw: railguns, beam lasers, artillery barely use T2 ammo, the faction is just better. Autocannons, using RF close range ammo all day over T2. Pulse lasers are used with scorch/navy multifrequency.

So if T2 missiles isn't the only type of missile you'll ever need, then deal with it. Drakes/Tengus still reach out to 50-80km depending on skills. That should be more than enough for a medium weapon system.

Phantom Buff: T2 missiles don't seem to increase your sig radius anymore.


i love it how people still compare HML to short range turrets

i can only speak for lazors , since i only fly amarr.

-to get best versatility with beams , you need both t2 crystals (aurora for range , gleam for damage and tracking) and a whole set of faction crystals in between. i personally use with beam omen/coercer/retribution , in order of range:

-Aurora
-navy standard
-navy xray
-navy multi
-gleam

thats 5 sets of ammo , all with a different purpose

now back to HML

you say they hit with less damage than short range weapon , but consider at what range you are doing that kind of damage!

concrete example:

-beam harbinger with aurora does 300 dps at 70k+15k (2 HS, one damage rig, 2 TE, all lvl V char on EFT)

-cal navy scourge HML drake does 332 dps at 62k (2 BCS , no range or damage rig, all lvl V char on EFT)

what can we learn from this? YES draeks do less damage with HMLs than a close range system , but does comparable damage than beam lazors , which is also a long range system!

for comparable range a pulse harbinger does 400 dps at 20k maximum.
nevermind the tracking issues too , just by MWDing for transversal on the barbinger, NVM the other issues with the ships themselves. just stop comparing long range missiles (HML) to short rage weaponry (Pulses , AC)!


EDIT: misread your post -_- , but the fact stands , stop comparing HMLs to short range weaponry! they do still decent damage at extreme ranges, just not as much as before

IMMA FIRING MA LAZAR!!!