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For all the Drone users

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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#41 - 2012-12-05 14:02:56 UTC
cBOLTSON wrote:
Humm Im on the fence with this issue. Its great that AI is stronger now and yes they should shoot drones, but lets be honest here -

The idea is that NPC AI acts somewhat more like people, it would be a rare day that a FC calls a whole fleet to primary a single drone.


And the day a FC calls a single drone as primary, it'll be an Acolyte. Because it begins with "A" Lol

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De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#42 - 2012-12-05 14:03:48 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:


The thread title led me to believe I would be posting in another "oh nose my drones!" thread - but what you said a thousand times! Those poor little mission runners - suddenly, their predictable little missions aren't predictable anymore. Too bad they won't listen, though, because making excuses for their just being generally bad at EVE (hence why they run missions and don't like change) is all they're really good at.


So them liking a different style of play than you makes them bad at Eve? Conceited much?

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#43 - 2012-12-05 14:04:56 UTC
JC Anderson wrote:
Kitty Bear wrote:
[the only place where there is zero risk in eve is INSIDE a station
but that doesn't make nulsec sound as badass, so therefore nulsec dwellers declared that nulsec risk is riskier risk because it's riskier risk.



For some reason this reminded me of known knowns, and known unknowns, along with unknown knowns.


Let's discuss the unknown risks with this project.

Sadly, I actually had a manager say that in a meeting once.

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
destiny2
Decaying Rocky Odious Non Evil Stupid Inane Nobody
Looking for Trouble
#44 - 2012-12-05 14:32:42 UTC
AndromacheDarkstar wrote:
Just felt the need to point something out here, the reason you are losing drones from your drone boats is because the AI is actually acting intelligently. Its doing somthing PVP`ers would do when faced with a boat that does its DPS through drones and removing the threat. This provides a challenge, if you dont like challenging gameplay then eve is not for you and you are welcome to leave, the door is over there.

Alternatively you could think about how you play the game and maybe, just maybe try something new when running your 450th mission in a row in you drone boat you havent ever lost with the 1 set of drones you bought 3 years ago. Maybe pick up a ship with guns, get some friends in to share the reward, maybe use your drone boat for pvp.

Which brings me to the next point, drone boats are not dead, just dead to you. I still love drones in PVP. Your playing EVE ladies and gents. Man up



looseing light,heavy,med,sentry drones arent as bad as looseing some fighters lol.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#45 - 2012-12-05 15:27:45 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
The thread title led me to believe I would be posting in another "oh nose my drones!" thread - but what you said a thousand times! Those poor little mission runners - suddenly, their predictable little missions aren't predictable anymore. Too bad they won't listen, though, because making excuses for their just being generally bad at EVE (hence why they run missions and don't like change) is all they're really good at.


Uh-huh. I can't wait for CCP to make NPCs start shooting down missiles. New Eden will drown in your tears.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
BoBoZoBo
MGroup9
#46 - 2012-12-05 16:17:23 UTC  |  Edited by: BoBoZoBo
The reason they are loosing drones is because they are use to autopiloting their way through EVE isk making.

Situational awareness is the problem. The desire to actually be active in something is the problem.
Pay more attention to the battle-space. Problem solved.

Flying with a group helps.

Primary Test Subject • SmackTalker Elite
Lord Okinaba
Aliastra
#47 - 2012-12-05 16:50:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Lord Okinaba
AndromacheDarkstar wrote:
Just felt the need to point something out here, the reason you are losing drones from your drone boats is because the AI is actually acting intelligently. Its doing somthing PVP`ers would do when faced with a boat that does its DPS through drones and removing the threat. This provides a challenge, if you dont like challenging gameplay then eve is not for you and you are welcome to leave, the door is over there.

Alternatively you could think about how you play the game and maybe, just maybe try something new when running your 450th mission in a row in you drone boat you havent ever lost with the 1 set of drones you bought 3 years ago. Maybe pick up a ship with guns, get some friends in to share the reward, maybe use your drone boat for pvp.

Which brings me to the next point, drone boats are not dead, just dead to you. I still love drones in PVP. Your playing EVE ladies and gents. Man up


Oh right, so why do they still go after my drones when most of my DPS is coming from my turrets? Roll

There's nothing smart or intelligent about this new AI. Frigs have been programmed to attack drones at all cost, that's it.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. This update doesn't just effect drone boats it effects all boats which use drones of any kind, which is most of them.

Congratulation on making Drones for all boats, kamikaze drones.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#48 - 2012-12-05 16:56:43 UTC
AndromacheDarkstar wrote:
, the reason you are losing drones from your drone boats is because the AI is actually acting intelligently. Its doing somthing PVP`ers would do when faced with a boat that does its DPS through drones and removing the threat.


LOL!

I can't remember the last time an FC called my drones as primary. Come back with your theory when you actually learn to PVP.

Mr Epeen Cool
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#49 - 2012-12-05 16:57:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Katran Luftschreck
BoBoZoBo wrote:
The reason they are loosing drones is because they are use to autopiloting their way through EVE isk making.


You've just revealed just how much you really know about being a drone captain. Or rather how little.


BoBoZoBo wrote:
Situational awareness is the problem. The desire to actually be active in something is the problem.
Pay more attention to the battle-space. Problem solved.


No, problem is not solved and that is the problem. It no longer matters if you're paying attention or not. Drones are drawing aggro from 12+ ships at once and getting insta-killed in one salvo. Drone Durability 4, Battlecruisers 5, using Navy Drones in a Myrmidon and watching Navy Drones die in one second flat tells me that this crap is crap.


BoBoZoBo wrote:
Flying with a group helps.


Yes, now you can use your drones as aggro-fodder for your buddies while they rack up kills. I'd rather just fly a logi and save myself a few million ISK per mission in replacement expenses.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Alysa Taal
State War Academy
Caldari State
#50 - 2012-12-05 17:06:26 UTC
Just found that salvage drones are insta popped too, even before they salvage.

Only by frigs too.

Something tells me the npc frigs arent working right, its overkill, I heard someone say sleepers arent too high on the frigs? maybe this is the problem, the AI is new on the frigs and a little high?

Not crying yet, the problem will be found, if they say its working right (which would be hard to believe) then I will cry like my lolipop had been stolen!

:)
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#51 - 2012-12-05 17:10:37 UTC
Alysa Taal wrote:
Just found that salvage drones are insta popped too, even before they salvage.

Only by frigs too.

Something tells me the npc frigs arent working right, its overkill, I heard someone say sleepers arent too high on the frigs? maybe this is the problem, the AI is new on the frigs and a little high?

Not crying yet, the problem will be found, if they say its working right (which would be hard to believe) then I will cry like my lolipop had been stolen!

:)


Maybe so. I've had light drones popped almost as soon as I launched them despite the massive dps coming from my mach, the TP on the mach being active, remote reppping and dps from a second ship i was dual boxing ect ect. I could put them in fast enough.

It so irritating i've found other ways to deal with npc frigs. The same thing doesn't happen with sentries, I damn near can't get npcs to aggro sentries.
Abyssum Invocat
Yet Another Tax Haven
#52 - 2012-12-05 17:29:59 UTC
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
The thread title led me to believe I would be posting in another "oh nose my drones!" thread - but what you said a thousand times! Those poor little mission runners - suddenly, their predictable little missions aren't predictable anymore. Too bad they won't listen, though, because making excuses for their just being generally bad at EVE (hence why they run missions and don't like change) is all they're really good at.


Uh-huh. I can't wait for CCP to make NPCs start shooting down missiles. New Eden will drown in your tears.

They already do, it's called defender missiles.
Lord Okinaba
Aliastra
#53 - 2012-12-05 17:37:00 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:


It so irritating i've found other ways to deal with npc frigs. The same thing doesn't happen with sentries, I damn near can't get npcs to aggro sentries.


I'm finding this too. They're quite happy to watch my sentries go to work, but as soon as a light drone comes out they're all over it.

It's quite amusing that people are getting kicks out of drone boats apparently being dead, when true drone boats like the Dominix are probably the least affected by this new AI.


  • Drop sentries

  • Go make a cupper


AFKing in drone boats is just as viable than ever. Its the none dedicated drone boats with smaller bays and which rely on primarily small drones which are the most affected.
Konrad Kane
#54 - 2012-12-05 18:06:23 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
dexington wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
dexington wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
High sec PVE'ers moan about how they lose isk/hr from the AI changes, never admitting that they weren't really supposed to be able to make that much in the first place.


to be fair null sec pve'ers whine just as much about the fact the hi-sec'ers are making almost as much isk as they are for significantly less risk

Fixed.


are you trying to say the null-sec pvp'ers are bad at pve, and this is not really a game balance problem but l2p issues?

Try again.


Can you post your last lost mail while ratting, that'll help show everyone how risky Tenal is for ratters.
Skex Relbore
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#55 - 2012-12-05 18:32:51 UTC
This was a stupid change, not that this surprises me much. The idea that rats are shooting drones to better simulate a real PVP players is idiotic, Most PVPers don't even have drones on their overview so we sure as hell aren't focusing fire on them. Generally if any attention is paid to drones in PVP at all it's by fitting smart bombs on some ships to dust them off. Further for the most part the ships that really rely on Drones for damage tend to have sufficient spares that can be launched that you just end up wasting time shooting the drones that could be better spent shooting the ship launching them.

Now I get the want to make PVE more interesting and harder to do afk/semiafk but let's get real. The only reason for PVE content (At least missions and ratting) in this game is to inject currency into the economy and provide a way for people who don't want to play the markets or manufacture stuff to make a little isk to do the stuff that actually is interesting to do.

In the end this was a solution in search of a problem.

Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#56 - 2012-12-05 18:39:10 UTC
Skex Relbore wrote:
This was a stupid change, not that this surprises me much. The idea that rats are shooting drones to better simulate a real PVP players is idiotic, Most PVPers don't even have drones on their overview so we sure as hell aren't focusing fire on them. Generally if any attention is paid to drones in PVP at all it's by fitting smart bombs on some ships to dust them off. Further for the most part the ships that really rely on Drones for damage tend to have sufficient spares that can be launched that you just end up wasting time shooting the drones that could be better spent shooting the ship launching them.

Now I get the want to make PVE more interesting and harder to do afk/semiafk but let's get real. The only reason for PVE content (At least missions and ratting) in this game is to inject currency into the economy and provide a way for people who don't want to play the markets or manufacture stuff to make a little isk to do the stuff that actually is interesting to do.

In the end this was a solution in search of a problem.



I dunno about you but if I'm flying in a frig and I'm caught into an engagement, drones are gonna be pretty damn high on my list.

The Drake is a Lie
Skex Relbore
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#57 - 2012-12-05 18:44:18 UTC
Xercodo wrote:
Skex Relbore wrote:
This was a stupid change, not that this surprises me much. The idea that rats are shooting drones to better simulate a real PVP players is idiotic, Most PVPers don't even have drones on their overview so we sure as hell aren't focusing fire on them. Generally if any attention is paid to drones in PVP at all it's by fitting smart bombs on some ships to dust them off. Further for the most part the ships that really rely on Drones for damage tend to have sufficient spares that can be launched that you just end up wasting time shooting the drones that could be better spent shooting the ship launching them.

Now I get the want to make PVE more interesting and harder to do afk/semiafk but let's get real. The only reason for PVE content (At least missions and ratting) in this game is to inject currency into the economy and provide a way for people who don't want to play the markets or manufacture stuff to make a little isk to do the stuff that actually is interesting to do.

In the end this was a solution in search of a problem.



I dunno about you but if I'm flying in a frig and I'm caught into an engagement, drones are gonna be pretty damn high on my list.



Well that would certainly help to explain your killboard.
Villaseni
Doomheim
#58 - 2012-12-05 18:54:31 UTC
Just use a target painter on one rat...and your drones will never be aggro'd
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#59 - 2012-12-05 19:00:39 UTC
Villaseni wrote:
Just use a target painter on one rat...and your drones will never be aggro'd


Can you also give me 1 mid slot? Because I have to use 1 less hardener than any other race as is.

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Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#60 - 2012-12-05 19:08:00 UTC
Skex Relbore wrote:
Xercodo wrote:
Skex Relbore wrote:
This was a stupid change, not that this surprises me much. The idea that rats are shooting drones to better simulate a real PVP players is idiotic, Most PVPers don't even have drones on their overview so we sure as hell aren't focusing fire on them. Generally if any attention is paid to drones in PVP at all it's by fitting smart bombs on some ships to dust them off. Further for the most part the ships that really rely on Drones for damage tend to have sufficient spares that can be launched that you just end up wasting time shooting the drones that could be better spent shooting the ship launching them.

Now I get the want to make PVE more interesting and harder to do afk/semiafk but let's get real. The only reason for PVE content (At least missions and ratting) in this game is to inject currency into the economy and provide a way for people who don't want to play the markets or manufacture stuff to make a little isk to do the stuff that actually is interesting to do.

In the end this was a solution in search of a problem.



I dunno about you but if I'm flying in a frig and I'm caught into an engagement, drones are gonna be pretty damn high on my list.



Well that would certainly help to explain your killboard.


You mean the KB with 90% of my losses being PVE fits or lol fits? (Still no regrets about the Burn Jita bhaalgorn xD)

That and the last several losses I had I was either caught by gang of players or there were no drones to speak of worth going for. My tactic doesn't really explain my KB at all from that standpoint.

The Drake is a Lie