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Thanatos, what's the point?
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Denuo Secus
#1 - 2012-11-26 20:26:22 UTC
Hi,

I'm about to skill carriers finally. Since I like small scale PvP and flexibility the Thanatos comes to mind. It can shield and armor rep + it has a bigger drone/fighter bay. Not sure about the damage bonus. Additional 125 DPS when using 5 fighters doesn't seem that much tbh.

When comparing the Thanatos with the tanky carriers I don't really see a benefit. Both, Archon and Chimera, have one thing I could imagine is most important for such a huge, immobile ship: staying power. The Thanatos seems weak in comparison.

So is the fighter damage bonus + the flexibility something worth in small scale PvP? Or maybe something else I fail to see? Slot layout maybe...not sure.

In short: I don't really see a role where the Thanatos stands out.

Thanks for any hint.
Mirel Dystoph
Perkone
Caldari State
#2 - 2012-11-26 20:38:57 UTC
It's quite good as meatshield.

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Kosetzu
The Black Crow Bandits
Northern Coalition.
#3 - 2012-11-26 20:59:42 UTC
It can rep both armor and shield. And easy to train for if you can already fly the Moros.
Lady Ayeipsia
BlueWaffe
#4 - 2012-11-26 21:01:51 UTC
One thing to.point out, a slave implant set works on a capital ship, greatly improving the ehp of an amarr or gallante armor tanked carrier. A crystal set does not change the boost rate of capital shield modules. The chimera is greatly hindered by this.

As for the thanatos, it is the 2nd most popular carrier. Amarr is prefered because of its tank. Caldari suffers because people dislike shield fleets (and there is no capitsl ancillary.shield booster) and every dislikes the minmatar line because the bonuses are lacking. So the thanatos easily falls in 2nd place.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-11-26 21:17:40 UTC
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:
As for the thanatos, it is the 2nd most popular carrier. Amarr is prefered because of its tank. Caldari suffers because people dislike shield fleets (and there is no capitsl ancillary.shield booster) and every dislikes the minmatar line because the bonuses are lacking. So the thanatos easily falls in 2nd place.


i highly disagree. i place the thanny dead last in usefulness, by a fair margin.
archon is the best carrier by a long shot.
then comes the chimera which is the shield archon equivalent, tho not quite as good.
3rd is the nid since it does get a rep bonus which is useful and cna do both armour and shield. however, given its epic fitting issues, terrible cap and tank, it doesnt come close to either of the previous carriers.
last is the thanny. with no rep bonus, no tank bonus and only slightly better fitting than a nid, it just isnt useful. historically it's the most flown carrier for PVE reasons as it gets a dps bonus but with sentries not being better for PVE than fighters due to drone damage amps, this is now also obsolete.

as mentioned above, the only reason to ever train a thanny is if youre primarily a dread pilot and train the moros cos it's the best dread and do not want to train another race's BS to 5.

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Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2012-11-26 21:21:49 UTC
Minmatar carrier is bad because of the fitting, not the bonuses.
Canabi
Destructive Influence
Northern Coalition.
#7 - 2012-11-26 22:26:15 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:
As for the thanatos, it is the 2nd most popular carrier. Amarr is prefered because of its tank. Caldari suffers because people dislike shield fleets (and there is no capitsl ancillary.shield booster) and every dislikes the minmatar line because the bonuses are lacking. So the thanatos easily falls in 2nd place.


i highly disagree. i place the thanny dead last in usefulness, by a fair margin.
archon is the best carrier by a long shot.
then comes the chimera which is the shield archon equivalent, tho not quite as good.
3rd is the nid since it does get a rep bonus which is useful and cna do both armour and shield. however, given its epic fitting issues, terrible cap and tank, it doesnt come close to either of the previous carriers.
last is the thanny. with no rep bonus, no tank bonus and only slightly better fitting than a nid, it just isnt useful. historically it's the most flown carrier for PVE reasons as it gets a dps bonus but with sentries not being better for PVE than fighters due to drone damage amps, this is now also obsolete.

as mentioned above, the only reason to ever train a thanny is if youre primarily a dread pilot and train the moros cos it's the best dread and do not want to train another race's BS to 5.



I liked watching your corp get molested by RnK in Clarion Call 3.
Thanny is a good ratting ship, though.
Byzan Zwyth
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-11-26 22:48:55 UTC
ok a bit of subject but maybe someone can enlighten me.

How is the moros the best dread? I've trained for it but never flown one, just came back to the game to find it's drone bay and Drone Bonus totally removed? that was what historically gave it a slight edge over the other dreads?

I totally admit I have looked at the other dreads to see what has changed. I kinda thought that with the drones gone the Rev would take the #1 spot.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#9 - 2012-11-26 23:33:57 UTC
Byzan Zwyth wrote:
ok a bit of subject but maybe someone can enlighten me.

How is the moros the best dread?

16k dps.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#10 - 2012-11-27 00:00:47 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
Byzan Zwyth wrote:
ok a bit of subject but maybe someone can enlighten me.

How is the moros the best dread?

16k dps.


Something about tracking as well...
Byzan Zwyth
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-11-27 00:31:51 UTC
yeah well you expect it to have the most damage with blasters and best tracking but the least range of the dreads, from memory you needed to use Iron amo to hit a POS, really it's the same argument for all weapon types.

damage, tracking, range, damage types/selection, AMO use, cap use

16kdps is only part of the picture.
Lady Spank
Get Out Nasty Face
#12 - 2012-11-27 01:40:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Lady Spank
Thanatos is useful for PVE, that is its only benefit. Even then it is only good for high end anoms.

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Gibbo3771
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
#13 - 2012-11-27 01:47:30 UTC
So from my experience.

Archon > Armor Triage
Nidhoggur > Pos Repping
Chimera > Shield Triage
Thanatos > Anoms

Never really seen them used for anything different, even seen 50 man sentry Archons used over Thanatos for the pure staying power of the ship. Last gang like this had a 1million EHP proteus as the FC that simple point the primary and everyone assigned drones, was quite a good tactic.
Klymer
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2012-11-27 04:10:43 UTC
Depending on how far away you are, this might be something important for you to consider.

From the dev blog HERE

Quote:
Changing skill requirements for capital ships from Racial Battleships 5 to 4, but introducing or increasing other skills to keep the same overall training time requirements
Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#15 - 2012-11-27 09:20:50 UTC
Dorian Wylde wrote:
Minmatar carrier is bad because of the fitting, not the bonuses.

And it's sheer utter lack of a tank...

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Denuo Secus
#16 - 2012-11-27 11:17:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Denuo Secus
Thanks for your replies. I really hoped I miss something. Regarding the PvE advantage of the Thanatos: I think every carrier works nice here now when using sentries and drone damage mods.

So let's see what CCP will do with the Thanatos when carriers will be reviewed. According to CCP Fozzie's amazing and forward-looking flowchart from his dev blog all ships will be reviewed.

I'd like an additional drone damage bonus on the Thanatos. The Nyx is damage king with fighters and fighter bombers. So why not the Thanatos with fighters and drones. More gank, less tank.
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber
#17 - 2012-11-27 17:38:53 UTC
Problem with the thanny is it is a logi ship trying to be a damage dealer. The Nyx is good because it is there to do damage, a little bit more DPS from a thanny is pretty irrelevant most of time. I'd agree Archon >>>Chimera >> Niddy > Thanatos outside of PVE.

The point about slaves is fairly irrelevant when talking about triage, it should be a matter of tanking DPS though reps and resist rather than eHP, of course slaves help but I wouldn't say they are better than having the GAs and capacitor hardwires for a triage carrier.
Eternal Error
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2012-11-27 18:55:09 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:
As for the thanatos, it is the 2nd most popular carrier. Amarr is prefered because of its tank. Caldari suffers because people dislike shield fleets (and there is no capitsl ancillary.shield booster) and every dislikes the minmatar line because the bonuses are lacking. So the thanatos easily falls in 2nd place.


i highly disagree. i place the thanny dead last in usefulness, by a fair margin.
archon is the best carrier by a long shot.
then comes the chimera which is the shield archon equivalent, tho not quite as good.
3rd is the nid since it does get a rep bonus which is useful and cna do both armour and shield. however, given its epic fitting issues, terrible cap and tank, it doesnt come close to either of the previous carriers.
last is the thanny. with no rep bonus, no tank bonus and only slightly better fitting than a nid, it just isnt useful. historically it's the most flown carrier for PVE reasons as it gets a dps bonus but with sentries not being better for PVE than fighters due to drone damage amps, this is now also obsolete.

as mentioned above, the only reason to ever train a thanny is if youre primarily a dread pilot and train the moros cos it's the best dread and do not want to train another race's BS to 5.
Basically came here to post this. You can also train to fly a thanny if you were thinking about flying a nyx. I am very bitter over my Gallente Carrier V.

TL;DR skill for an archon unless you're only interested in PvE
Lili Lu
#19 - 2012-11-27 20:04:48 UTC
Thanny is the best because then you can train into a Nyx which is totally awesome and kills everyth . . oh crudP
Alice Katsuko
Perkone
Caldari State
#20 - 2012-12-02 05:06:27 UTC
Prior to the introduction of drone damage mods, the Thanatos was considered the best PvE carrier due to its fighter damage bonus. Since it could also fit a decent armor tank, and could rep both shields and armor, it was also not unwelcome in PvP fleets and could be used for repping POS modules. Nowadays, sentries outperform fighters by a substantial margin; once CCP fixes the 'Sleeper' AI that will be introduced in a half-broken state in Retribution, fighters will probably become completely useless for PvE; fighters are very slow, while sentries can be recalled and re-deployed instantly if they draw aggro. Consequently, there's nothing the Thanatos can do that another carrier cannot do better, except in those rare instances where you need the additional fighter damage bonus.