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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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Good beginner's role to shoot for

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Zakkias Eli Faire
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-11-23 09:39:53 UTC
Hey all!

New to Eve, had a few questions.

I think ultimately I want to participate in PvP, but for now I wanted to get a good solid footing on the cash front, so I decided to skill for missions. This way, I can have a good, reliable cashflow to fallback on! To that end, I decided on Minmatar, but rather than focusing on Projectiles I went with Missiles for now, after reading that a few Minmatar ships will be changed to be more missile oriented.

Right now I am running a Breacher with Light Missile, been pretty effective in lvl 1s. After the new Destroyer comes out, I will have Destroyers at level 5 and ok support skills for missile, so I think I might try running a long-range/speed tanking setup for level 2 missions.

Eventually, I also read the Typhoon is changing to a Torpedo boat in one of the Dev blogs.

Anyhow, here are my questions;

1) Are missiles effective in PvP? I understand Rockets may have limited use because that puts you in Web range, but with something like the new Destroyer, which has +50% range, along with some range enhancing Rigs and good skills, I can see getting over 20km range with Rockets. Would a rocket Talwar be effective in beginner PvP?

2) If I join a Corp, can I at least help with running level 4 missions without a Battleship? I was thinking I might just work on my skills for Frigate through Cruiser sized ships, then worry about Battlecruisers and Battleships later.

3) Is Exploration actually any good for Isk farming? I am interested because it sounds fun and I love exploring, but I want to be able to progress Isk-wise as well.

Thanks!
Matthew97
#2 - 2012-11-23 09:43:30 UTC
Zakkias Eli Faire wrote:
Hey all!

New to Eve, had a few questions.

I think ultimately I want to participate in PvP, but for now I wanted to get a good solid footing on the cash front, so I decided to skill for missions. This way, I can have a good, reliable cashflow to fallback on! To that end, I decided on Minmatar, but rather than focusing on Projectiles I went with Missiles for now, after reading that a few Minmatar ships will be changed to be more missile oriented.

Right now I am running a Breacher with Light Missile, been pretty effective in lvl 1s. After the new Destroyer comes out, I will have Destroyers at level 5 and ok support skills for missile, so I think I might try running a long-range/speed tanking setup for level 2 missions.

Eventually, I also read the Typhoon is changing to a Torpedo boat in one of the Dev blogs.

Anyhow, here are my questions;

1) Are missiles effective in PvP? I understand Rockets may have limited use because that puts you in Web range, but with something like the new Destroyer, which has +50% range, along with some range enhancing Rigs and good skills, I can see getting over 20km range with Rockets. Would a rocket Talwar be effective in beginner PvP?

2) If I join a Corp, can I at least help with running level 4 missions without a Battleship? I was thinking I might just work on my skills for Frigate through Cruiser sized ships, then worry about Battlecruisers and Battleships later.

3) Is Exploration actually any good for Isk farming? I am interested because it sounds fun and I love exploring, but I want to be able to progress Isk-wise as well.

Thanks!


1. We'll have to see how the missile nerf in the upcoming expansion effects their use in PVP, I would prefer to use turrets due to the instant damage output other missiles personally.

2. It depends on the Corp really, some wouldn't have any issue with that but there are some that would want a certain ship type / fit to be used.

3. I haven't really tried exploration that much so Can't really comment.
Revara Ormand
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-11-23 09:46:31 UTC
2. you can help with lvl 4 in a battlecruiser as it has a tank good enough to warp out when getting agro
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#4 - 2012-11-23 10:41:40 UTC
1. Missiles are just fine for PvP and are getting a general buff in the coming expansion. They certainly have their own weaknesses, but every weapon system has them. You always have to try to cotrol the fight in a way, that as much of the fighting as possbile happens in your strong area and their weak area. This isn't going to change no matter what weapon system you use.

2. You can help in any ship, but the bigger issue is where do they want your help. Lvl 4 missions aren't exactly hard to do solo, so help isn't really required. The most obvious roles would be to salvage after the guy doing the mission, help killing the frigates or just bring more damage to help run the entire mission faster. It really depends how much help and teamwork your corp members are looking for.

3. Exploration is a competitive income source, but understand what it actually is. It's gambling with your time. There are very few guaranteed rewards in exploration and on their own they aren't worth all the trouble. It's all about speed and the luck of the random number generator. Speed because you compete with others over the sites, because the sites you're doing will be interrupted by others and because only the final loot drops are potentially worth anything, so you want to get to throw that loot dice as many times as possible. Sometimes you get lucky and wonder why every player in EVE isn't doing this. Sometimes you don't see anything worth a dime in days or are constantly interrupted by hunters(lowsec/nullsec).

You'll likely also spend a lot of your time scanning down sites instead of doing them and you'll have to travel a lot. You can have your one home base, but you won't be there much and you'll gather loot all over the place, since it's dangerous to carry it with you and a waste of time to take to your home base everytime you find something worthwhile. I think it's worth doing, but if you're going to go in to it, do it with your eyes open about what it is, that you're getting in to.
Louis deGuerre
The Dark Tribe
#5 - 2012-11-23 11:46:07 UTC
Heavy missiles, which see the most use with the popular Drake and Tengu, are getting a big nerf coming december.

Missiles will always hit if in range but actual damage depends on various things. Missiles can be intercepted before they hit. Missiles have travel time which will mean a bigger PVP disadvantage the longer the engagement range.
Missiles can do all damage types.

Turrets can miss, but damage is instant and can not be intercepted. Actual damage depends on various things.
The longer the range, the more turrets have the advantage over missiles in PVP.
Only projectile turrets can do all damage types.

It all depends on the situation, but very generally speaking turrets >> missiles in PVP and missiles >> turrets in PVE.
Zakkias Eli Faire
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2012-11-23 14:13:26 UTC
Interesting. Thanks for the replies everyone, very helpful! I think I will enjoy my stay in New Eden :)
ISD LackOfFaith
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#7 - 2012-11-23 23:41:35 UTC
Matthew97 wrote:
1. We'll have to see how the missile nerf in the upcoming expansion effects their use in PVP, I would prefer to use turrets due to the instant damage output other missiles personally.

Side-point: Missiles in general are mostly being buffed. All unguided missiles (rockets, HAMs, torps) are getting better, light missiles are getting a flat damage buff, and all ship penalties for T2 ammo in missiles are getting removed.

The only ones being nerfed are the long range heavy missiles, and even that's not too severe.

Cruise missiles aren't really changing, but I seem to recall CCP saying they'll get a more in-depth looking-at later.

ISD LackOfFaith

Captain

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to Eve Mail or anything other than the forums.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-11-24 01:31:45 UTC
ISD LackOfFaith wrote:
Matthew97 wrote:
1. We'll have to see how the missile nerf in the upcoming expansion effects their use in PVP, I would prefer to use turrets due to the instant damage output other missiles personally.

Side-point: Missiles in general are mostly being buffed. All unguided missiles (rockets, HAMs, torps) are getting better, light missiles are getting a flat damage buff, and all ship penalties for T2 ammo in missiles are getting removed.

The only ones being nerfed are the long range heavy missiles, and even that's not too severe.

Cruise missiles aren't really changing, but I seem to recall CCP saying they'll get a more in-depth looking-at later.


Then I will add:

Helping in level 4 missions will also have to be looked at.

The Mission NPC Rat AI will change with the expansion on the 4th. They can switch targets and if you are in a frigate in the pocket and you get a good amount of aggro (maybe some scramming frigates) you won't last very long.

But in general, if you join a corp with a good bunch of people, most won't mind if you tag along for a while to get your own standings up so you can run level 3 and 4's.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-11-24 01:39:39 UTC
If you need a role to shoot for, find miners and shoot at them.
ISD TYPE40
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2012-11-24 02:23:31 UTC
Forum Rules wrote:


24. Off-topic posting is not allowed.

Off-topic posts are not prohibited but should be posted within reason. Excessive off-topic posts that derail a thread may result in the thread being locked.



Post removed for a breach of the above rule - ISD Type40.

[b]ISD Type40 Lt. Commander Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]
SmilingVagrant
Doomheim
#11 - 2012-11-24 06:31:10 UTC
The first role you will shoot for, and the first that will introduce you to many of the advanced mechanics of PVP is light tackle.
Nor Tzestu
Dos Pollos Hermanos
Ghosts from the Abyss
#12 - 2012-11-24 21:47:47 UTC
SmilingVagrant wrote:
The first role you will shoot for, and the first that will introduce you to many of the advanced mechanics of PVP is light tackle.



TBH light tackle is pretty crap in the current meta. Your going to attempt to hold onto a target in an underskilled, badly fit t1 frig and your going to get instawtfbbq'd by most anything else. I've always found experienced pilots in well fit ships make for the best tackle. Fastest way to group PVP is to get into a BC and fit some meta 4 guns on the thing. In a couple weeks you can have a t2 shield and armor tank, the ability to launch some ECM drones, fit some neuts and some useful guns. You'll learn far more not dying everytime you attempt to get with in point range of anything worth fighting. To each his own though...
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-11-24 23:20:47 UTC
Nor Tzestu wrote:
SmilingVagrant wrote:
The first role you will shoot for, and the first that will introduce you to many of the advanced mechanics of PVP is light tackle.



TBH light tackle is pretty crap in the current meta. Your going to attempt to hold onto a target in an underskilled, badly fit t1 frig and your going to get instawtfbbq'd by most anything else. I've always found experienced pilots in well fit ships make for the best tackle. Fastest way to group PVP is to get into a BC and fit some meta 4 guns on the thing. In a couple weeks you can have a t2 shield and armor tank, the ability to launch some ECM drones, fit some neuts and some useful guns. You'll learn far more not dying everytime you attempt to get with in point range of anything worth fighting. To each his own though...


Yes, but until you have the skills for that BC + the income to support loosing those every now and then (and you will)...why not sacrifice some 3mil ISK frigates (yeah, sure you will be blown up almost instantly most of the times) to tackle and move with a fleet. Even if you die, the movement of fleets, the comms etc. you still learn from that.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
SmilingVagrant
Doomheim
#14 - 2012-11-25 00:12:34 UTC
Nor Tzestu wrote:
SmilingVagrant wrote:
The first role you will shoot for, and the first that will introduce you to many of the advanced mechanics of PVP is light tackle.



TBH light tackle is pretty crap in the current meta. Your going to attempt to hold onto a target in an underskilled, badly fit t1 frig and your going to get instawtfbbq'd by most anything else. I've always found experienced pilots in well fit ships make for the best tackle. Fastest way to group PVP is to get into a BC and fit some meta 4 guns on the thing. In a couple weeks you can have a t2 shield and armor tank, the ability to launch some ECM drones, fit some neuts and some useful guns. You'll learn far more not dying everytime you attempt to get with in point range of anything worth fighting. To each his own though...


This isn't really true at all. It all depends on what the other guy is flying. Having hopped into a T1 frig myself and tackled/webbed a Tornado for over 30 minutes as he slowboated down to a gate I can assure you, there is a place for T1 tackle in the game still.
Nor Tzestu
Dos Pollos Hermanos
Ghosts from the Abyss
#15 - 2012-11-25 22:05:09 UTC
SmilingVagrant wrote:
Nor Tzestu wrote:
SmilingVagrant wrote:
The first role you will shoot for, and the first that will introduce you to many of the advanced mechanics of PVP is light tackle.



TBH light tackle is pretty crap in the current meta. Your going to attempt to hold onto a target in an underskilled, badly fit t1 frig and your going to get instawtfbbq'd by most anything else. I've always found experienced pilots in well fit ships make for the best tackle. Fastest way to group PVP is to get into a BC and fit some meta 4 guns on the thing. In a couple weeks you can have a t2 shield and armor tank, the ability to launch some ECM drones, fit some neuts and some useful guns. You'll learn far more not dying everytime you attempt to get with in point range of anything worth fighting. To each his own though...


This isn't really true at all. It all depends on what the other guy is flying. Having hopped into a T1 frig myself and tackled/webbed a Tornado for over 30 minutes as he slowboated down to a gate I can assure you, there is a place for T1 tackle in the game still.



Sure you can. That's not my point though. I can tackle in slasher, done it plenty of times. Most fresh pilots can't though is my main issue. They won't recognize targets they should or shouldn't try to tackle, they won't have the skills to heat their way out of trouble etc. In the time spent to get decent skills to tackle they can be a in a meta fit BC that won't die in a fire if looked at the wrong way and is a far more useful skillset down the road. By all means tackle if you want. I just find the best tacklers/scouts have a ton of experience not just flying their ships but in target recognition, spotting traps, and knowing the ins and outs of safe spots etc. I don't think there is a wrong answer here I just think the faster you get into a BC the more useful you are in pvp and the more ISK making opportunities you have available to you.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-11-25 22:34:14 UTC
Nor Tzestu wrote:
SmilingVagrant wrote:
Nor Tzestu wrote:
SmilingVagrant wrote:
The first role you will shoot for, and the first that will introduce you to many of the advanced mechanics of PVP is light tackle.



TBH light tackle is pretty crap in the current meta. Your going to attempt to hold onto a target in an underskilled, badly fit t1 frig and your going to get instawtfbbq'd by most anything else. I've always found experienced pilots in well fit ships make for the best tackle. Fastest way to group PVP is to get into a BC and fit some meta 4 guns on the thing. In a couple weeks you can have a t2 shield and armor tank, the ability to launch some ECM drones, fit some neuts and some useful guns. You'll learn far more not dying everytime you attempt to get with in point range of anything worth fighting. To each his own though...


This isn't really true at all. It all depends on what the other guy is flying. Having hopped into a T1 frig myself and tackled/webbed a Tornado for over 30 minutes as he slowboated down to a gate I can assure you, there is a place for T1 tackle in the game still.



Sure you can. That's not my point though. I can tackle in slasher, done it plenty of times. Most fresh pilots can't though is my main issue. They won't recognize targets they should or shouldn't try to tackle, they won't have the skills to heat their way out of trouble etc. In the time spent to get decent skills to tackle they can be a in a meta fit BC that won't die in a fire if looked at the wrong way and is a far more useful skillset down the road. By all means tackle if you want. I just find the best tacklers/scouts have a ton of experience not just flying their ships but in target recognition, spotting traps, and knowing the ins and outs of safe spots etc. I don't think there is a wrong answer here I just think the faster you get into a BC the more useful you are in pvp and the more ISK making opportunities you have available to you.



And that's why this entire thing is about being tackle in a fleet with more experienced guys.

They CAN tell you who to tackle and who to run from...

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Lyric Lahnder
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2012-11-26 15:53:41 UTC
Zakkias Eli Faire wrote:
I decided on Minmatar, but rather than focusing on Projectiles I went with Missiles for now, after reading that a few Minmatar ships will be changed to be more missile oriented.


Dont forget the hound!

If you want to have fun with missiles try to skill up to a stealth bomber. There fantastic little ships and can be used in pvp for so many things. Scouting, Ewar, DPS, and bombing runs.

If you want to learn how to use yours or other ships to the max feel free to apply noir. Academy you can learn how to survive in null sec too.

Noir. and Noir Academy are recruiting apply at www.noirmercs.com I Noir Academy: 60 days old must be able to fly at least one tech II frigate. I Noir. Recruits: 4:1 k/d ratio and can fly tech II cruisers.