These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Warning if undocking with cargo worth alot?

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#41 - 2012-11-22 00:03:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Qin Tawate wrote:


I think, you care for your buddies. You can not deny that. Otherwise you would not post and even try to argue for them. I care, too.

I think after Goons took over 0.0 CCP should not also give them the chance to shoot fish in a barrel in High Sec.

Lets make a RL analogy. I know, some guys will troll me, that I do a terrible crime. It goes as follows: Would the USA allow terrorists to attack in the Green zone of Bagdad? Well, it happened a couple of times, but they did everything to stop it. They stopped the attacks (there is always an exception). What does CCP to stop this? nothing. Everything remains the same and there is a big silence. Obviously this is not High Sec as it is called.

Then you can ask yourself, why you have a High Sec or a Green Zone? Why not make everything a honest free fire zone?

Yesterday we talked about the fact, that it is now saver to use a jumpfreighter in Low Sec than a regular freightr in High Sec.

Why? Because 0.0 is so stale and stagnant and Goons want to have fun. Eve became too small for Goons. That is the truth. You can see it everywhere.


Real world analogies don't translate to Eve very well but if you insist on using them, why do governments allow crime in cities? people & banks get robbed , cars get stolen, homicides & violence happens.

Hisec is not meant to be safe, concord, unlike a real police force, are there to punish transgressors not protect the population.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Qin Tawate
Doomheim
#42 - 2012-11-22 00:36:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Qin Tawate
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:

Real world analogies don't translate to Eve very well but if you insist on using them, why do governments allow crime in cities? people & banks get robbed , cars get stolen, homicides & violence happen.

Hisec is not meant to be safe, concord, unlike a real police force, are there to punish transgressors not protect the population.


oh I think, like a certain Mittani blogger, RL analogies work pretty good. Yours for example makes no sense. High Sec is not meant to be safe? Cities are not meant to be safe? You ask the question in a different way. I am very sure, you would be really pissed, if in the city, you live in, crime rate would be high and the robbers tell you - assuming you no robber, you know Blink - it is supposed to be this way. Propably they would also tell you how wonderful unregulated market and social darwinism is.
Lady Spank
Get Out Nasty Face
#43 - 2012-11-22 00:46:34 UTC
Dont be a moron. In cities, crime is often rife. It's undesirable but the authorities cannot stamp it out completely.

(ಠ_ృ) ~ It Takes a Million Years to Become Diamonds So Lets Just Burn Like Coal Until the Sky's Black ~ (ಠ_ృ)
Qin Tawate
Doomheim
#44 - 2012-11-22 00:49:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Qin Tawate
Lady Spank wrote:
Dont be a moron. In cities, crime is often rife. It's undesirable but the authorities cannot stamp it out completely.


I dont know in what city you live, but in the city I live, I do not need to worry about some Goon hords trying to steal my stuff. If you think a high crime rate is normal and high security, then you have pretty low standards - and a gun hopefully. Now fit a gun on your freighter.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#45 - 2012-11-22 01:02:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Qin Tawate wrote:


oh I think, like a certain Mittani blogger, RL analogies work pretty good. Yours for example makes no sense. High Sec is not meant to be safe? Cities are not meant to be safe? You ask the question in a different way. I am very sure, you would be really pissed, if in the city, you live in, crime rate would be high and the robbers tell you - assuming you no robber, you know Blink - it is supposed to be this way. Propably they would also tell you how wonderful unregulated market and social darwinism is.


I'll rephrase it then, hisec is akin to a frontier town in the historical wild west, in a frontier town law enforcement consisted of criminals being hung or run out of town, citizens were expected to be able to protect themselves, normally at the end of a gun or a posse. In Eve law enforcement consists of Concord destroying the criminals ships, the inhabitants of hisec are expected to protect themselves, by not being stupid, at the end of several guns or by declaring war (posses may emerge with CW2).

The tools are either in place already or are coming soon, it's just that some people are too unimaginative to use them. Hisec is relatively safe, but not completely, if it was then I'm sure that a sizeable proportion of hisec players would leave to go to lo or null, not that we'd be welcome, or leave the game completely leaving only the true carebears that want to play in complete safety in hisec. Eve is not a fluffy lala world, it was never meant to be and I hope it never is. It's a dark and violent game set on the frontier of another universe, by their very nature frontiers tend to be somewhat lawless, with basic law enforcement only existing in the civilised areas.

@ Lady Spank, thanks for being so succinct, you got what I was getting at.

Qin Tawate wrote:

I dont know in what city you live, but in the city I live, I do not need to worry about some Goon hords trying to steal my stuff. If you think a high crime rate is normal and high security, then you have pretty low standards - and a gun hopefully. Now fit a gun on your freighter.


You've obviously never set foot in London, New York, Amsterdam, Paris, Madrid, Washington DC, Johannesburg, or any other major city, just because the statistics say that crime is falling doesn't make it so. Governments manipulate the figures by changing the criteria so that they look effective.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#46 - 2012-11-22 01:04:52 UTC
I live in a dangerous area (America), but I can tell you this whole drawing analogies between RL and EVE is complete nonsense, RL police would completely stamp out crime if they could, while CCP could, but knows that would be terrible for the entire game. So yeah, working as intended.

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2012-11-22 01:07:13 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Hello,

People are probably gonna hate me for this suggestion, but maybe there should be a warning when undocking with cargo that is worth much more than the actual ship. It would be good for newbies, because i bet they will leave the game if they get surprise ganked while carrying all of their hard earned stuff with insufficent tank or planning


This would be a really simple feature that is not unlike the "are you sure you want to enter lowsec" warnings that pilots get the first time they try to jump into low - every pilot has the option to select the box that says "don't show me this again", and it wouldn't affect anyone adversely. Everyone thinks this would be an exercise in new-player hand-holding, and indeed it would probably be more encouraging for new players to know that they're learning things like "be careful what you carry" via the in-game mechanics instead of learning it the hard way and never wanting to log on again.

However, What it would really do is take away freighter pilots' excuses to whine ever again - if there are in-game warnings delivered to them that they've chosen to ignore, then in doing so they have inherently chosen to take full responsibility for their transit. If they lose their ship and cargo, after being warned, then they can't complain.

I think a lot of people on this thread are overreacting to this suggestion, if not acting like complete children. It seems no one is capable of constructive criticism these days - that doesn't mean that you have to agree with every suggestion made, it just means that if you don't agree, explain what's wrong with the idea in clear & concise prose INSTEAD of abusing, insulting or otherwise belittling the person who thought of it.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#48 - 2012-11-22 01:15:06 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
robbyx wrote:
So what are the new rules ?...ive been on a long break and i used to make my iskies freighting goods around hi-sec on my indy toon to fund my null-sec adventures......back then capital freighters werent worth the gank effort...but now ive been told gankers go for any freighter with anything valuable in it, even empty ones just for the killmails.

It seems to me that there is zero risk in ganking, apart from sec status which gankers dont care about anyway, so wheres the risk versus reward for ganking now ?....and again what are the "new" freighter pilot rules ?


Don't autopilot, don't carry more than a billion or so, definitely don't carry multiple plex, plastic wrap your shinies by putting them into courier contracts from an alt, if you have an alt on another account in the same corp use it to multiweb you so you get into warp quicker, avoid choke points if you can, especially on the Amarr Jita run.



By default the freighter is a 1.6 billion ISK kill mail. They sell for that.
Fill a freighter with any given capital part, they run a 4 billion ISK kill.

This is not about ISK. If they score a profitable kill, it's a bonus and acts as a validation certificate. Goons have trillions of ISK. CCP can verify this. Goons are beyond ISK in EVE.

This is the systematic destruction of EVE. You will all chuckle and dismiss this. So will CCP. "It can't be done" you say, "they are just playing the bad guy" CCP will say.

Killing EVE doesn't require it to be taken off line. Killing EVE requires that they get subscriptions back to 2005 levels. With 2012 debt, 2005 subscription levels mean lay offs, it means a slowing of development, it means EVE is no longer a competitive MMO and for all intent and purpose it is dead.

D
E
A
D

Dead.

Why would they do this you ask?
Something to do.

The biggest threat is the threat you never see.

I'll come back one day and say, I told you so. Until then I will get trolled on a forum.
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#49 - 2012-11-22 01:28:39 UTC
^^^ stuff like this is what sells me on joining the goons. They strike fear into the hearts of the carebears.
Mallak? Do I give my :tenbux: to you? What about the 500 mil? :D

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
Some Rando
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#50 - 2012-11-22 01:31:34 UTC
Ocih wrote:
This is not about ISK. If they score a profitable kill, it's a bonus and acts as a validation certificate. Goons have trillions of ISK. CCP can verify this. Goons are beyond ISK in EVE.

This is the systematic destruction of EVE. You will all chuckle and dismiss this. So will CCP. "It can't be done" you say, "they are just playing the bad guy" CCP will say.

It requires the finest quality tin foil to come up with something as batshit crazy as this. IMO, EVE is one of the few games that Goons truly enjoy. Why destroy it?

CCP has no sense of humour.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#51 - 2012-11-22 01:32:06 UTC
Galaxy Pig wrote:
^^^ stuff like this is what sells me on joining the goons. They strike fear into the hearts of the carebears.
Mallak? Do I give my :tenbux: to you? What about the 500 mil? :D


I think you should get a bumper discount Lol

@Ocih, would you like to buy a new tinfoil hat? yours seems to be malfunctioning P

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#52 - 2012-11-22 01:49:38 UTC
Ocih wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
robbyx wrote:
So what are the new rules ?...ive been on a long break and i used to make my iskies freighting goods around hi-sec on my indy toon to fund my null-sec adventures......back then capital freighters werent worth the gank effort...but now ive been told gankers go for any freighter with anything valuable in it, even empty ones just for the killmails.

It seems to me that there is zero risk in ganking, apart from sec status which gankers dont care about anyway, so wheres the risk versus reward for ganking now ?....and again what are the "new" freighter pilot rules ?


Don't autopilot, don't carry more than a billion or so, definitely don't carry multiple plex, plastic wrap your shinies by putting them into courier contracts from an alt, if you have an alt on another account in the same corp use it to multiweb you so you get into warp quicker, avoid choke points if you can, especially on the Amarr Jita run.



By default the freighter is a 1.6 billion ISK kill mail. They sell for that.
Fill a freighter with any given capital part, they run a 4 billion ISK kill.

This is not about ISK. If they score a profitable kill, it's a bonus and acts as a validation certificate. Goons have trillions of ISK. CCP can verify this. Goons are beyond ISK in EVE.

This is the systematic destruction of EVE. You will all chuckle and dismiss this. So will CCP. "It can't be done" you say, "they are just playing the bad guy" CCP will say.

Killing EVE doesn't require it to be taken off line. Killing EVE requires that they get subscriptions back to 2005 levels. With 2012 debt, 2005 subscription levels mean lay offs, it means a slowing of development, it means EVE is no longer a competitive MMO and for all intent and purpose it is dead.

D
E
A
D

Dead.

Why would they do this you ask?
Something to do.

The biggest threat is the threat you never see.

I'll come back one day and say, I told you so. Until then I will get trolled on a forum.


Except you're entirely wrong. We don't want to kill EVE, we just want to make you upset. It's working.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Sevgei Ertekin
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2012-11-22 01:52:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Sevgei Ertekin
Make insta-undocks off big market stations and don't autopilot. Pretty hard. Carry expensive items (or stuff you actually care about) in a "non-hauler" perhaps? Common sense usually dictates that in the first month or so.
Yuri Wayfare
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
#54 - 2012-11-22 01:58:51 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Hello,

People are probably gonna hate me for this suggestion, but maybe there should be a warning when undocking with cargo that is worth much more than the actual ship. It would be good for newbies, because i bet they will leave the game if they get surprise ganked while carrying all of their hard earned stuff with insufficent tank or planning


No hate, bro. I like newbies. I like them a lot. And not in the sense of "they shooty so I kill them", but in the sense of "if they shoot me I let them live." Sure, I'll leave them a nice repair bill to think about, but I don't generally blow up the ships of players under a month old. Unless they **** me off. Or if I'm on a dry spell. Or if I'm drunk. But that's a different story altogether.

Why a month? Because that's when I made my first kill. If I can do it, anyone can.

That said, anyone flying faction/deadspace bling or having shinies in the cargo is fair game to me regardless of age, and I extend that morality (ack! cough!) to my suicide ganking brethren (not that they need it). You could be two days into the game, but if you have amassed *shines*, you're either an alt or the happy owner of a credit card that's a size too big for you. Either way, I'll be happy to show you the error of your ways.

"Suddenly, trash pickers! HUNDREDS of winos going through your recyclables." -Piugattuk

Be careful what you wish for.
Lance Rossiter
CHAINS Corp
#55 - 2012-11-22 02:21:16 UTC
I don't think it merits a warning - there's no obscure rules involved or any realistic possibility of doing it blindly or by accident. Sure, flying with valuable cargo is a risk, but it's always one you take consciously.
Holy One
Privat Party
#56 - 2012-11-22 02:45:05 UTC
WARNING: WE HAVE DETERMINED YOU ARE PROBABLY TOO STUPID TO LAST LONG IN THIS GAME
ABORT/RETRY/BUY PLEX

:)
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#57 - 2012-11-22 02:53:26 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:


Except you're entirely wrong. We don't want to kill EVE, we just want to make you upset. It's working.


I wouldn't go that far. Confused at most. And my assessment on motives could be off. You might think you are doing EVE a favor. When you haven't stopped think that old EVE was just never popular enough to stay afloat. End result will be the same.
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#58 - 2012-11-22 03:11:56 UTC
As you can see, it did in fact float, as we are all still playing it.

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
Psusennes
Cherry-Garcia
#59 - 2012-11-22 03:15:12 UTC
Souisa wrote:
Hello,

People are probably gonna hate me for this suggestion, but maybe there should be a warning when undocking with cargo that is worth much more than the actual ship. It would be good for newbies, because i bet they will leave the game if they get surprise ganked while carrying all of their hard earned stuff with insufficent tank or planning



How about this instead you and those you wish to protect go play a different game ty
Avitar
No Laws Apply
Unforgiving.
#60 - 2012-11-22 04:16:26 UTC
I like this idea Big smile