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Dev Blog: Bounties, Kill Rights, New Modules and War in Retribution

First post First post
Author
Callic Veratar
#21 - 2012-11-21 17:41:53 UTC
I've found a couple loopholes in here that may need addressing:

Quote:
When you have a bounty placed on you, the notification you get sent now also includes the name of the character that placed the bounty on you.


Why would you send the name of the person placing the bounty? It's only going to provoke the target and it's not going to have any effect because I can just create an alt or trial account, transfer cash, and place a bounty from an untraceable pilot. Cut out the middleman and don't send the name.

Quote:
You can also revert your choices here and cancel the availability of your kill rights, using the same menu. Currently there are no restrictions on how fast or frequently you can cancel kill right availability or make them available again.


If someone buys my kill rights, activating the flag, and then I immediately withdraw them, what happens? Is the suspect flag withdrawn? Does it stay active but disable the kill right payout? This is a very exploitable edge case that wasn't addressed in the blog.
Iam Widdershins
Victory or Whatever
#22 - 2012-11-21 17:42:46 UTC
agrajag119 wrote:
Salvage drones - you specifically call out "your own wrecks". will this include fleet members or corp members as well. I know nuetral wrecks were mentioned too, but this sounds like a corner case that might get missed.


They already stated that this would basically differentiate based on the color of the wrecks; drones will auto-salvage white and blue wrecks but leave yellow alone. This means that fleet members' wrecks will be perfectly available.

Lobbying for your right to delete your signature

CCP Paradox
#23 - 2012-11-21 17:44:23 UTC
Callic Veratar wrote:
I've found a couple loopholes in here that may need addressing:

Quote:
When you have a bounty placed on you, the notification you get sent now also includes the name of the character that placed the bounty on you.


Why would you send the name of the person placing the bounty? It's only going to provoke the target and it's not going to have any effect because I can just create an alt or trial account, transfer cash, and place a bounty from an untraceable pilot. Cut out the middleman and don't send the name.

Quote:
You can also revert your choices here and cancel the availability of your kill rights, using the same menu. Currently there are no restrictions on how fast or frequently you can cancel kill right availability or make them available again.


If someone buys my kill rights, activating the flag, and then I immediately withdraw them, what happens? Is the suspect flag withdrawn? Does it stay active but disable the kill right payout? This is a very exploitable edge case that wasn't addressed in the blog.


The suspect flag is not withdrawn. But once the timer runs out, and all Limited Engagements run out nobody will be able to activate the Kill Right again until you choose who to assign to next.

CCP Paradox | EVE QA | Team Phenomenon

Space Magician

CCP Paradox
#24 - 2012-11-21 17:45:07 UTC
Iam Widdershins wrote:
agrajag119 wrote:
Salvage drones - you specifically call out "your own wrecks". will this include fleet members or corp members as well. I know nuetral wrecks were mentioned too, but this sounds like a corner case that might get missed.


They already stated that this would basically differentiate based on the color of the wrecks; drones will auto-salvage white and blue wrecks but leave yellow alone. This means that fleet members' wrecks will be perfectly available.


But you can target a Yellow wreck manually and then tell your drones to salvage it, if you choose to go down that dark, dark path.

CCP Paradox | EVE QA | Team Phenomenon

Space Magician

CCP SoniClover
C C P
C C P Alliance
#25 - 2012-11-21 17:45:34 UTC
Callic Veratar wrote:

If someone buys my kill rights, activating the flag, and then I immediately withdraw them, what happens? Is the suspect flag withdrawn? Does it stay active but disable the kill right payout? This is a very exploitable edge case that wasn't addressed in the blog.


If the kill right has been activated, making it unavailable won't change anything - the flag stays on and the kill right can still be used up.
Some Rando
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2012-11-21 17:47:33 UTC
CCP Paradox wrote:
Some Rando wrote:
Quick question: Do killrights assigned to corps or individuals have to be activated, or does that only apply to everyone killrights? I feel like it is a needless step to activate a killright assigned specifically to me or my corp before I start shooting.

Anyone in the Corp that it is assigned to can Activate the Kill Right. (Note that this is on the same grid in space with the player.)
Try assigning the Kill right to The Scope Blink

That wasn't what I was asking. Having to activate a killright available to everyone is understandable, but I feel that activating a killright that is assigned to me or my corp is a wasted and needless UI step, and it should work like, say, a normal killiright would (or being in a war, for instance).

For that matter, if I have a killright against someone because they killed me, do I have to activate it? If so, that would be pretty silly.

Lastly, do I give up my killright when I assign it to someone else?

CCP has no sense of humour.

CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#27 - 2012-11-21 17:48:58 UTC
Some Rando wrote:
CCP Paradox wrote:
Some Rando wrote:
Quick question: Do killrights assigned to corps or individuals have to be activated, or does that only apply to everyone killrights? I feel like it is a needless step to activate a killright assigned specifically to me or my corp before I start shooting.

Anyone in the Corp that it is assigned to can Activate the Kill Right. (Note that this is on the same grid in space with the player.)
Try assigning the Kill right to The Scope Blink

That wasn't what I was asking. Having to activate a killright available to everyone is understandable, but I feel that activating a killright that is assigned to me or my corp is a wasted and needless UI step, and it should work like, say, a normal killiright would (or being in a war, for instance).

For that matter, if I have a killright against someone because they killed me, do I have to activate it? If so, that would be pretty silly.

Lastly, do I give up my killright when I assign it to someone else?


normal kill rights also work in this way, you have to activate it.

you might want to choose the moment when you want to make that person a suspect to everybody!

no you don't give up your own kill right when you make it available to others

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis

Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#28 - 2012-11-21 17:50:40 UTC
How come the Drone Interfacing skill doesn't affect Salvage Drones in any way? It affects both combat drones and mining drones, so this is an odd oversight.
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#29 - 2012-11-21 17:51:40 UTC
Also, why do you make it known to the target who placed the bounty? People are just going to use disposable or secrets alts to place bounties anyway. It's a silly mechanic.
CCP Paradox
#30 - 2012-11-21 17:51:45 UTC
Some Rando wrote:
CCP Paradox wrote:
Some Rando wrote:
Quick question: Do killrights assigned to corps or individuals have to be activated, or does that only apply to everyone killrights? I feel like it is a needless step to activate a killright assigned specifically to me or my corp before I start shooting.

Anyone in the Corp that it is assigned to can Activate the Kill Right. (Note that this is on the same grid in space with the player.)
Try assigning the Kill right to The Scope Blink

That wasn't what I was asking. Having to activate a killright available to everyone is understandable, but I feel that activating a killright that is assigned to me or my corp is a wasted and needless UI step, and it should work like, say, a normal killiright would (or being in a war, for instance).

For that matter, if I have a killright against someone because they killed me, do I have to activate it? If so, that would be pretty silly.

Lastly, do I give up my killright when I assign it to someone else?


They work very different than before. We are flagging the target with a Suspect flag through the new Crimwatch V2 system.
So in that respect, the 15 minute flag that gets slapped on your target must be activated manually, when you see that target in space.

CCP Paradox | EVE QA | Team Phenomenon

Space Magician

Some Rando
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2012-11-21 17:52:17 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
normal kill rights also work in this way, you have to activate it.

Cry

CCP has no sense of humour.

CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#32 - 2012-11-21 17:54:17 UTC
Salpad wrote:
Also, why do you make it known to the target who placed the bounty? People are just going to use disposable or secrets alts to place bounties anyway. It's a silly mechanic.


from our initial feedback we got that some people wanted the name there and others not, for those who want to make it known like "yo I don't like you, I'm placing a bounty on you" can just do it with their own dude... others can use alts or a corporation specializing in placing bounties for others Blink

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis

Harbingour
EVE Corporation 690846961
#33 - 2012-11-21 17:55:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Harbingour
DEV BLOG wrote:
"It will not be possible to place bounties on NPC characters (like agents) or corporations (but you can place a bounty on a player character in a NPC corporation), nor on CCP developers or ISD people."

SadSadAwwww I wasso much looking forward to collect on CCP Soundwave's 2 trillion in bounies LolLolLol

\o/ I am very appreciative of the reduction on putting bounties on Alliances though & it sounds like good fairer amount. ( although a 0.1 ISK bounty minimum would be bestBig smile )
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#34 - 2012-11-21 17:56:47 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
from our initial feedback we got that some people wanted the name there and others not, for those who want to make it known like "yo I don't like you, I'm placing a bounty on you" can just do it with their own dude... others can use alts or a corporation specializing in placing bounties for others Blink

…so, how long until Vengeance Inc™ — Your Friendly Bounty Anonymizing Corp is formed? Any bets? P
Spurty
#35 - 2012-11-21 17:56:48 UTC
thanks for the clarification, namely:

" Having a bounty on you will never by itself make you a legal target anywhere."

Phew

There are good ships,

And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

Built by CCP

Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#36 - 2012-11-21 17:58:39 UTC
If you want the very best in bounty placement, you should really use PunkturisCorp. They specialize in quality bounty placement.

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog

Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
Wild Geese.
#37 - 2012-11-21 17:58:53 UTC
Many thanks again to the team for listening to our feedback and doubling their efforts to deploy selective kill right sales, its a drastically needed tool to ensure that this bounty hunting system doesnt have the exploits the previous edition suffered from! Cool

I still think reducing the capacity of ASB's only ensures that people will default to the dual-ASB tank, as it simply weakens the use of a solo ASB setup too much. As I've said internally, the problem isn't with single boosted setups near as much as the alternating dual booster fits, I'd much rather see a limit on the number of ASB's one can fit, and maintain their current capacity - than nerf them in this manner (especially since it impacts the smaller sizes more than larger sizes as there is currently no Navy cap booster 25's or 50's.) I really hope the team keeps an open mind here and continues to listen to the community, ASB's have a LOT of potential and are a lot of fun, I just think the path currently being taken to nerf them cuts way down on the number of ships that can use them to begin with by eating up more slots for a second booster.

....not to mention Fozzie's tiericide efforts when it comes to command links will further hurt ASB tanks, I hope this pending double nerf is considered - because it would be a shame for these to become obsolete when compared to traditional active booster / cap booster setups.

The rest of the module changes are pretty sensible, reactive armor hardeners in particular should really start to shine given the new speed of their adaptation.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

Harbingour
EVE Corporation 690846961
#38 - 2012-11-21 18:00:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Harbingour
CCP Punkturis wrote:
Salpad wrote:
Also, why do you make it known to the target who placed the bounty? People are just going to use disposable or secrets alts to place bounties anyway. It's a silly mechanic.


from our initial feedback we got that some people wanted the name there and others not, for those who want to make it known like "yo I don't like you, I'm placing a bounty on you" can just do it with their own dude... others can use alts or a corporation specializing in placing bounties for others Blink



Here's a scenerio I have not seen addressed yet ( if I missed it in the Blogs please correct me ): If an alt places a bounty on another pilot & recycles ( terminates) that disposable alt does the bounty still stick? Also if the bounties persist bio'ing: will recycling alts after each bounty was placed multiable times be a bannable offence like disposing of alts to escape SEC Status penalties?
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#39 - 2012-11-21 18:01:34 UTC
Spurty wrote:
thanks for the clarification, namely:

" Having a bounty on you will never by itself make you a legal target anywhere."

Phew
Note, though, that it will make you a more likely target. A freighter pilot with a sufficient bounty on his head will readily pay out 300M ISK for the ship alone (to say nothing about the inevitable lost cargo), and that goes a long way towards making it a “free kill”. Jump Freighters will similarly be able to pay out enough ISK to pay for the lost ships in a gank, even if not a single piece of loot drops, if the bounty is high enough.
Versuvius Marii
Browncoats of Persephone
#40 - 2012-11-21 18:02:24 UTC
Gneeznow wrote:
Btw this 'available to all' on the killrights, does this mean it's available to view and buy by anyone?

Edit: also now that sec hits are front loading, what kind of sec hit do you get when you destroy a ship? the full hit you now get when you 'gank' someone who doesn't fire back, or the 10~ smaller hit you get when they fire back at you?

Also
Quote:
The aggressor now has the option to retract a war that has been made mutual by the defender. This ends the war in 24 hours. The other option here was to give the aggressor a chance to accept or refuse making the war mutual, but we felt the retraction was a cleaner and simpler solution.


bye bye dec shield?

Were Goons one of the ones perma-locked into war? Roll [/tinfoil]

The Gaming MoD - retro to modern, console to MMO, I blog about it if it's a game and I'm interested in it. Yes, I play games other than Eve and I don't care if you think I'm wrong.