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It was a little surprising and quite disappointing to not see Moon Goo forwarded by CSM to CCP IMO.

First post
Author
Shepard Book
Underground Stargate
#1 - 2012-11-20 02:11:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Shepard Book
I am speaking to the urgent list given by the CSM to CCP recently. The main defense has always been it is a fight motivator. IMO you have one group controlling the majority of 0.0 blocks ATM. No one can stand against the numbers when you look at the number of goons and the former pet and now just friends test... I think everyone knows if one is in trouble they would call on the other 3rd of 0.0 for help. This has been talked about for a long time even before those two blocks got good at diplomacy... Does the CSM really not see what is happening to 0.0 or is there another answer?

The last patch to address this gave others the means to get several moons to equal a portion of 1 tech moon in alchemy. IMO, It is a joke.

Farms and fields would seem an idea in the right direction by giving the isk to the members (making them earn it) of corps which could be taxed by the Corps and then the Alliances. This could still work in the favor of the biggest blob but taking moon goo out of moons and into belts or something else. This would at least give others a better chance. I am not sure why the people that are supposed to be looking out for what is good for the game as a whole do not want to turn off the isk faucet. Any constructive thoughts on this are welcome.
Frying Doom
#2 - 2012-11-20 02:44:10 UTC
Shepard Book wrote:
I am speaking to the urgent list given by the CSM to CCP recently. The main defense has always been it is a fight motivator. IMO you have one group controlling the majority of 0.0 blocks ATM. No one can stand against the numbers when you look at the number of goons and the former pet and now just friends test... I think everyone knows if one is in trouble they would call on the other 3rd of 0.0 for help. This has been talked about for a long time even before those two blocks got good at diplomacy... Does the CSM really not see what is happening to 0.0 or is there another answer?

The last patch to address this gave others the means to get several moons to equal a portion of 1 tech moon in alchemy. IMO, It is a joke.

Farms and fields would seem an idea in the right direction by giving the isk to the members (making them earn it) of corps which could be taxed by the Corps and then the Alliances. This could still work in the favor of the biggest blob but taking moon goo out of moons and into belts or something else. This would at least give others a better chance. I am not sure why the people that are supposed to be looking out for what is good for the game as a whole do not want to turn off the isk faucet. Any constructive thoughts on this are welcome.

Just scrapping moon goo completely is a step in the right direction

Hell just make them NPC goods till they get ring mining up and running, all the current setup is doing is making an alliance so rich it will never be removed externally as it can throw unlimited ships at any opponent and not care.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Veilo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2012-11-20 02:47:52 UTC
Hey,

Can we get 3 terrible posts in a row ?

Yes we can!

Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-11-20 02:50:14 UTC
YO CCP FIX MOON GOO*

*Technetium**

**Goons***

*** **** Goons

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["

Alekseyev Karrde
Noir.
Shadow Cartel
#5 - 2012-11-20 03:23:24 UTC
Re-balance of T2 production to remove bottlenecks and create more numerous and more distributed conflict drivers?
In document.

Allow players to get moon goo through active player activity (ie ring mining) instead of/in addition to the current passive+top down method?
In document.

Thank you for taking time to (not) read the elements of your elaborate Goons-run-EVE conspiracy.

Alek the Kidnapper, Hero of the CSM

Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-11-20 03:26:26 UTC
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
Thank you for taking time to (not) read the elements of your elaborate Goons-run-EVE conspiracy.

Damn. I see you're right back to being an ass-hole.

Do we get to see Aleks the sweetheart again in the run-up to the CSM8 election?
Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-11-20 03:57:36 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Damn. I see you're right back to being an ass-hole.


You say that as if the so-stupid-its-probably-a-troll OP deserved anything less.

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["

None ofthe Above
#8 - 2012-11-20 05:50:39 UTC  |  Edited by: None ofthe Above
There was no urgent list.

Reread the document.

They outlined a strategy and then picked a couple of example projects and wrote about how to apply the strategy in each case.

People who are upset about their issues not being talked about, don't understand the purpose of the document.

It was NOT work on these things because they are more important than everything else.

I direct you to this section:

Quote:
Examples for Consideration
The following examples, in alphabetical order, are included to provide concrete illustrations of a pillar-based approach in practice. These examples center on themes and concepts widely considered by existing subscribers as significantly broken and would likely need to be spread out over two expansions/12 months. Each area is a significant problem taking money out of CCP’s pocket through lost or missed subscriptions. They are not wish-lists, but rather illustrations of how new features and iteration can be weaved into powerful, themed expansions with broad demographic appeal.


Its all very fine to use it as a spring board for more conversation but please stop pulling your hair out. That never did me any good.

The only end-game content in EVE Online is the crap that makes you rage quit.

Frying Doom
#9 - 2012-11-20 08:59:32 UTC
Poetic Stanziel wrote:
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
Thank you for taking time to (not) read the elements of your elaborate Goons-run-EVE conspiracy.

Damn. I see you're right back to being an ass-hole.

Do we get to see Aleks the sweetheart again in the run-up to the CSM8 election?

Actually I just thought the document he was referring to was great.

A great waste of time with once again the top 2 replies out of 3 being on wasting the games resources on 20% of the population.

So many resources have been used on Null over the years and frankly I doubt the other 80% of the game could give a rats for Null being there are so many things that effect the majority of the game that need fixing.

But that brings us back to being the Council of Minority Stellar Management. Some of the CSM (normally the most vocal ones) prove time and again they are only interested in the minority that vote not the game as a whole. Well that is politicians I suppose.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Shepard Book
Underground Stargate
#10 - 2012-11-20 11:08:46 UTC
Alekseyev Karrde wrote:
Re-balance of T2 production to remove bottlenecks and create more numerous and more distributed conflict drivers?
In document.

Allow players to get moon goo through active player activity (ie ring mining) instead of/in addition to the current passive+top down method?
In document.

Thank you for taking time to (not) read the elements of your elaborate Goons-run-EVE conspiracy.


I actually read the document a couple times. I read where it was suggested to put moon minerals in belts but I did not see it taken out of moons in the document.

If I really wanted to make it a goon conspiracy it would have been worded different. It seems that some want it to stay in moons still and I do not agree with it because right now the bigger blob usually wins with current Sov Mechanics. On top of that I believe more power should be given to the majority of players rather than fatcat CEOs.

I was actually trying to reinforce the idea that Sov mechanics are not a healthy thing at this time. I appreciate that you value all opinions and thanks for the constructive reply though...
Shepard Book
Underground Stargate
#11 - 2012-11-20 11:09:33 UTC
Veilo wrote:
Hey,

Can we get 3 terrible posts in a row ?

Yes we can!



Can you be a sheep? I will let you answer that.
Lykouleon
Noble Sentiments
Second Empire.
#12 - 2012-11-20 15:37:12 UTC
Re-balancing of everything that involves moongoo, even remotely, is going to take time, effort, and preparation. The worst thing that CCP could do would be going into changing moongoo without addressing every other aspect of the game that it effects and how the shock of moongoo being changed will affect everyone's game. That process is going to take more than a typical patch cycle. I wouldn't even begin to expect a full road map or full-on iteration until at least a year from now. If CCP did it hap-hazardly, we'd probably end up with a completely broken game.

And, of course, I will bring up age-old fact that if Highsec wants a good representative on the CSM, they need to put down the cheetos bag and vote. That is how ~democracy~ rolls. You don't vote and someone gets in that you don't like, it's 100% your fault and you have no room to complain. Deal with it or move to spaceship-Canada.

Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER so I can hit them with my sword

Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2012-11-20 16:27:36 UTC
IT'S ALL ABOUT NULLSEC THOUGH*

* nobody in highsec ever uses POS, PI, does T2 production, or will ever use the CREST API system. Ever. Totally just nullsec stuff, right Frying ******* Doom?

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#14 - 2012-11-20 19:22:58 UTC
From my perspective the real solution is to make those materials mine-able as part of the mining revamp. The materials to mine to get things like tech should be in all regions with abundance based on system true sec.

Do that and all the isk printing goes away. Problem solved! (well changed at least! Big smile)

So based on what CCP shared there is a long term solution on the table.

Issler
No More Heroes
Boomer Humor
Snuffed Out
#15 - 2012-11-20 19:55:02 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
So many resources have been used on Null over the years and frankly I doubt the other 80% of the game could give a rats for Null being there


You guys take great joy in talking about the size of our blob and how many thousands of players we have in our alliance; then you wanna take a dump on your biggest customers. Do you have any idea the amount of goods that get shipped to 0.0 from highsec? You want that business to vanish? We do- we wanna make our own stuff and quit buying yours.

.

Imports Plus
Doomheim
#16 - 2012-11-20 20:00:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Imports Plus
Imagine an EVE where 0.0 is stagnated to oblivion and becomes completely deserted. No wars, no campaigns, no one gets conquered, no more blobs, no supercaps, just....nothing.

Meanwhile, in highsec- everyone is happily mining minerals and ice in a safe and secure society. They build things, they research things, they farm their isk in L4 missions, but no one seems to buy anything. 60b officer fit nightmares roam the belts, but no one seems to buy anything because nothing is getting destroyed? Do people actually lose their Golems to L4 missions?

Highsec needs 0.0 and needs massive conflict in 0.0 all you miners and traders and WH dudes and mission runners need to take a wider view of all these balance situations.
Frying Doom
#17 - 2012-11-20 21:08:33 UTC
No More Heroes wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
So many resources have been used on Null over the years and frankly I doubt the other 80% of the game could give a rats for Null being there


You guys take great joy in talking about the size of our blob and how many thousands of players we have in our alliance; then you wanna take a dump on your biggest customers. Do you have any idea the amount of goods that get shipped to 0.0 from highsec? You want that business to vanish? We do- we wanna make our own stuff and quit buying yours.

You are 20% of the population, why should more than 20% of the resources be spent fixing it, as so much has been wasted so far?

As to building your own stuff I am for this as I believe all NPC stations should be dropped to 35% max refining and POS structures and outpost should be able to achieve 100% with skills, same as manufacturing capabilities but these can already be achieved with POS but outposts could do with better amounts of slots.

In another words, player built structures should be a lot better than what NPC's can offer.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#18 - 2012-11-21 00:08:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Issler Dainze
Imports Plus wrote:
Imagine an EVE where 0.0 is stagnated to oblivion and becomes completely deserted. No wars, no campaigns, no one gets conquered, no more blobs, no supercaps, just....nothing.

Meanwhile, in highsec- everyone is happily mining minerals and ice in a safe and secure society. They build things, they research things, they farm their isk in L4 missions, but no one seems to buy anything. 60b officer fit nightmares roam the belts, but no one seems to buy anything because nothing is getting detroyed? Do people actually lose their Golems to L4 missions?

Highsec needs 0.0 and needs massive conflict in 0.0 all you miners and traders and WH dudes and mission runners need to take a wider view of all these balance situations.


or CCP introduces L5 missions that regularly destroy everything and mysterious space anomalies that swallow mining fleets whole? And low sec becomes an awesome place to make drugs and smuggle! I'm not saying null isn't important but for every "we can't live without null being the most important part of Eve' i can come up with alternative futures focused on PvE and better PvP in low sec experience that would also provide rewarding game experiences to a large player base.

Any vision of Eve that is based on some idea that everyone will eventually get "cool" and want to move out to null is ignoring the reality of the broad range of players that populate Eve today.

What makes Eve as awesome as it can be is that there are a RANGE of play styles supported and the basic concept of risk and reward in proper balance. I don't see how the dead null, no risk high sec you suggested would ever come to be. If CCP really tries to take us in that direction I would not want to be a statue in Jita!!

By they way I've been playing Eve since before there was T2 or any capitals and it was more fun in my opinion than the eve we have today. Sign me up for a new server with the 2005 code base! Blink

So null is important, and so is high sec, WHs, and please please please can we some day see low sec become relevant again!

Wanted to add this very spot on link to what truly is important to realize about how to keep Eve improving.. refusing to fall trap to the big lie.

Issler

P.S. A lot of null is totally deserted and always has been.
SmilingVagrant
Doomheim
#19 - 2012-11-21 05:16:40 UTC  |  Edited by: SmilingVagrant
Frying Doom wrote:
No More Heroes wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
So many resources have been used on Null over the years and frankly I doubt the other 80% of the game could give a rats for Null being there


You guys take great joy in talking about the size of our blob and how many thousands of players we have in our alliance; then you wanna take a dump on your biggest customers. Do you have any idea the amount of goods that get shipped to 0.0 from highsec? You want that business to vanish? We do- we wanna make our own stuff and quit buying yours.

You are 20% of the population, why should more than 20% of the resources be spent fixing it, as so much has been wasted so far?

As to building your own stuff I am for this as I believe all NPC stations should be dropped to 35% max refining and POS structures and outpost should be able to achieve 100% with skills, same as manufacturing capabilities but these can already be achieved with POS but outposts could do with better amounts of slots.

In another words, player built structures should be a lot better than what NPC's can offer.


Oh the 20% argument that's been shot down over and over again is rearing it's ugly head again.

Hi: I'm a nullsec person. 4 of my 2 characters are floating in highsec right now, one generally dwells in lowsec, and they are all being used to support my nullsec dude.
Frying Doom
#20 - 2012-11-21 07:58:03 UTC
SmilingVagrant wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
No More Heroes wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
So many resources have been used on Null over the years and frankly I doubt the other 80% of the game could give a rats for Null being there


You guys take great joy in talking about the size of our blob and how many thousands of players we have in our alliance; then you wanna take a dump on your biggest customers. Do you have any idea the amount of goods that get shipped to 0.0 from highsec? You want that business to vanish? We do- we wanna make our own stuff and quit buying yours.

You are 20% of the population, why should more than 20% of the resources be spent fixing it, as so much has been wasted so far?

As to building your own stuff I am for this as I believe all NPC stations should be dropped to 35% max refining and POS structures and outpost should be able to achieve 100% with skills, same as manufacturing capabilities but these can already be achieved with POS but outposts could do with better amounts of slots.

In another words, player built structures should be a lot better than what NPC's can offer.


Oh the 20% argument that's been shot down over and over again is rearing it's ugly head again.

Hi: I'm a nullsec person. 4 of my 2 characters are floating in highsec right now, one generally dwells in lowsec, and they are all being used to support my nullsec dude.

So therefore you are part of the reason that Null does not deserve as much funding, if you supported Null sec by having your alts there this would not be a problem. You can not expect that you only partly use Null like so many others and then reap the benifits as if all your characters where there.

And what of all the high sec people with PvP characters in NUll?

Oh and strangely all my alts support ME Lol

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

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