Jita Park Speakers Corner

I endorse this product and/or document.

I'm looking forward to a productive discussion about 2013 goals for EVE from a player perspective as we go into the summit. We're all looking forward to different features, different objectives - but I think a lot of us share the sentiment that we've had a good run on purely iterative expansions and ready to tackle some of the core issues in the coming year, and without fear of engaging in big projects just as 0.0 Sovereignty, the economy, and POS's.

I do find it inciting and enthralling that CCP and the CSM are starting to recognize that the newbies, veterans, and bitter-vets, all have important considerations.

It is important to not only retain older players, but also to garner the interest of new ones. Hopefully with the appropriate balancing of these mindsets (rather than on the stereotypical 0.0 versus industry, versus pirate, versus wormhole, etc) that a greater balance is achieved. Hopefully we shall continue to see positive and constructive criticisms and changes to this game.

I am sure we can all agree that progress is important- eve can never simply 'exist.' Stagnation equals death.

Nerfing the reprocess thing should be the #1 top priority. ♥

Only have time to skim it but my gut-check impression is that this isn't bad. I've got some issues with it. For example, compression nerfs should not happen until after framework is in place for local production. All too often, CCP nerfs something, promises a buff to offset, and that buff never comes. I'm also not a fan of the group mining thing either, but that's more because I'm skeptical about CCP being able to implement it and also deliver other revamps nullsec needs in a timely manner, as opposed to devoting 100% of dev time to "group mining", releasing it as a jesus feature, and forgetting about it.

Further elaboration will have to come later, I'm on my way out the door...

The point, I think, is to be more transparent and open about what the CSM is discussing with CCP.

No, this was done and submitted over a weekend. It is, as stated, a condensed version of many ideas that are discussed daily.



It's an FYI / transparency thing to the community to show the mindset of the CSM leading up to the December summit and let folks know what we are talking to CCP about.

This is what the CSM are elected to do. The contents of that document should be summation of everything they have learned of the player community's wishes for EVE's future throughout their term and everything leading up to it that got them elected. It is purpose of the CSM to listen and then speak on our behalf.

The transparency is that we are able to read it before the summit begins, so by all means feedback away.

So I'm not a complete *******, here's some feedback.

It's mostly ok, as far as wish lists go. The real problem comes with the "nerf then proposed buff" cycle that corestwo hit on, that CCP tends to nerf first and figure things out later, and people get stuck with the consequences. The Drone Regions are a fine example of that - the nerf removed the drone alloys, which was needed, but the "buff" to bring the Drone Regions in line with the rest of conquerable space just hasn't happened, and the dwellers have suffered because of it (and potential conquerors go out the window).

An example in the doc of where this happens is the Mineral Compression section. The emphasis of it is on breaking compression to entice this sudden, new wave of miners to mine and sell locally, rather than mine and import to Jita for better rates, which a scant closing sentence to "revisiting" station upgrades. In this scenario, the revision to station upgrades (i.e. make them actually worth anything at all) is the most important part of the situation. Right now, anyone who mines in null exports their wares, as there's no real market for it in null, due to industry and building being nearly impossible to do on any scale. A large reason for this is the dearth of industrial facilities in null, and it creates a feedback loop - new miners may look to sell locally, realize there's no market, and then export (or just mine in highsec altogether, with the far smaller differences between highsec ores and nullsec ores isk/m3 wise), while new builders will consider setting up, realize there's no market for minerals along with terrible facilities, and just produce in Empire.

The way your paragraph on the topic is constructed, it sells mineral compression as a barrier to competition in null, rather than a result of null being completely unsuitable to the type of resource extraction that can happen in highsec. Mineral compression exists because mining in null simply cannot supply the lowend mineral demand in its current form. Only once that's actually been rectified, be it by changing ore structures in null/changing contents of grav sites and/or buffing the hell out of null's industrial capacity, can compression seriously be considered for removal. It's a means to an end and you've represented it as an actual barrier, when it isn't.

This may seem nitpicky, but remember that this document isn't just laying out facts to CCP, it's trying to sell them that what's presented is the way to go, and your presentation of core issues (or the lack thereof) leaves a LOT to be desired. You've proposed ideas, but completely failed to emphasize that the order of implementing said ideas is the real key, not just that they get implemented eventually.

So yeah, that's why it would have been a hell of a lot better to share this (or even a draft of this) with the players before submitting this to CCP.

It is weird that WIS is not mentioned at all.

Would be nice to see iteration or no iteration plan on it.