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Define Carebear

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Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-11-11 02:09:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
I see this term get thrown around a lot, more often as a pejorative for players that play the game a certain way - I'm not sure I understand what that certain way is, though, so I would appreciate it if someone explained. I know I'm going to get a few people who just say "carebears are the scum of highsec" and that's it, but that's not a definition, is it. I *don't* want to know WHY they're scum - or why they're NOT scum... in fact, I'd rather a definition, properly delivered without bias, not include the word scum at all. An explanation would be nice, not more accusations, pejoratives and condemnations. I just want to know what it means, not how you feel about it - although I'm sure some of you will tell me anyway.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
stoicfaux
#2 - 2012-11-11 02:19:05 UTC  |  Edited by: stoicfaux
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I want to know WHY they're scum - or why they're NOT scum...

Hoo-boy. What country do you live in that has zero to one political parties? It's a time honored tactic dating back to the Garden of Eden to unify your group of people by demonizing another group, thus giving your group a purpose and a reason to take action.

Close seconds for why carebears are scum are: "bullying is fun," 'they don't fight back," "hiding my insecurity behind internet anonymity," and "really bored."

edit: To be clear, "carebears" don't exist per se. "Hating carebears" does exist.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-11-11 02:24:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
stoicfaux wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I want to know WHY they're scum - or why they're NOT scum...

Hoo-boy. What country do you live in that has zero to one political parties? It's a time honored tactic dating back to the Garden of Eden to unify your group of people by demonizing another group, thus giving your group a purpose and a reason to take action.

Close seconds for why carebears are scum are: "bullying is fun," 'they don't fight back," "hiding my insecurity behind internet anonymity," and "really bored."

edit: To be clear, "carebears" don't exist per se. "Hating carebears" does exist.


Not a definition of a carebear. This tells me why they are "demonised" which I already knew, but it doesn't tell me what one is.

Someone else?

FYI: I live in Australia, and I know politicians like to behave like scorned children who didn't get to play in the sandpit, but why anyone else would want to emulate them... I'll never know.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Clystan
Binaerie Heavy Industries
#4 - 2012-11-11 02:26:03 UTC
A bear is a four legged creature that roams the woods eating berries and meat and defecating. It also finds honey and eats that. It has very thick skin and can fish for salmon like a champ. Momma bears are tough and protect their young to the death. Bears are featured in Goldilocks.

Caring is the act of giving a sh*t.

So, caring about your poo and appearing in fairy tales is the definition of Carebear.

I think.
White Quake
Doomheim
#5 - 2012-11-11 02:28:06 UTC
A care bear is a player who plays eve how he/she wants

It is a term used by pilots who believe that all pilots should play how they do

It is a term used by pvpers to describe pilots who do not want to pvp 24/7
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-11-11 02:29:44 UTC
Clystan wrote:

So, caring about your poo and appearing in fairy tales is the definition of Carebear.

I think.



I don't know what a player's faecal matter has to do with it, so I'm going to assume nothing.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2012-11-11 02:30:39 UTC
White Quake wrote:
A care bear is a player who plays eve how he/she wants

It is a term used by pilots who believe that all pilots should play how they do

It is a term used by pvpers to describe pilots who do not want to pvp 24/7


Well then I want to hear from the pvpers why where the term came from, not someone who has a clear personal problem against them.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
stoicfaux
#8 - 2012-11-11 02:31:11 UTC  |  Edited by: stoicfaux
Remiel Pollard wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I want to know WHY they're scum - or why they're NOT scum...

Hoo-boy. What country do you live in that has zero to one political parties? It's a time honored tactic dating back to the Garden of Eden to unify your group of people by demonizing another group, thus giving your group a purpose and a reason to take action.

Close seconds for why carebears are scum are: "bullying is fun," 'they don't fight back," "hiding my insecurity behind internet anonymity," and "really bored."

edit: To be clear, "carebears" don't exist per se. "Hating carebears" does exist.


Not a definition of a carebear. This tells me why they are "demonised" but it doesn't tell me what one is.

Someone else?

Sigh. There is no such thing as a carebear. However, hating carebears does exist. I can't be much clearer than that.

Real World Example:
If you ask certain people what a [N-word] is, they will say it's a person of color. If you ask a person of color if they're a [N-word], they will tell you no, they're not a [N-word]. Ergo, the [N-word] isn't a noun/object/person. Instead the N-word is the belief that [N-words] exist. someone is inherently inferior based solely on cosmetic differences.

People believe in carebears, but carebears do not exist per se.

See also: US voter ID laws to prevent non-existent voter fraud, tough US anti-immigration laws to protect our jerbs, and US "unskewed" polls.


edit: Okay, I managed to confuse myself, so maybe it's not as clear as I think it to be.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-11-11 02:32:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
stoicfaux wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:
[quote=Remiel Pollard]I want to know WHY they're scum - or why they're NOT scum...

Hoo-boy. What country do you live in that has zero to one political parties? It's a time honored tactic dating back to the Garden of Eden to unify your group of people by demonizing another group, thus giving your group a purpose and a reason to take action.

Close seconds for why carebears are scum are: "bullying is fun," 'they don't fight back," "hiding my insecurity behind internet anonymity," and "really bored."

edit: To be clear, "carebears" don't exist per se. "Hating carebears" does exist.


Not a definition of a carebear. This tells me why they are "demonised" but it doesn't tell me what one is.


I think you are missing my point - how do you know who to "hate" on if you can't define them? Unicorns don't exist either, but they can be defined. So, define this player type that is so oft referred to in the pejorative as a carebear - the term carebear means nothing to me as it stands. So I really don't know who you're hating on. If you're just hating on mythical creatures, then you've got your own problems.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
stoicfaux
#10 - 2012-11-11 02:37:41 UTC  |  Edited by: stoicfaux
Remiel Pollard wrote:

how do you know who to "hate" on if you can't define them?

Exactly! Now you understand how it works.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2012-11-11 02:40:08 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:

how do you know who to "hate" on if you can't define them?

Exactly! Now you understand how it works.


No, I don't. I'll simplify it for you. Do try to keep up.

WHAT is a carebear? What kind of player is a carebear? What is it that they do to earn this term?

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-11-11 02:40:39 UTC
carebear = anyone who actively avoids PVP
not really rocket science

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2012-11-11 02:41:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Jack Miton wrote:
carebear = anyone who actively avoids PVP


THANK you. NOW we're getting somewhere. Does anyone else have something intelligent to offer like this guy?

EDIT: Rocket science is actually really easy, these days. That figure of speech is so outdated - now quantum and particle physics, cosmology, and biochemistry.... that's real science. Rocket science is mostly just a lot of maths.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#14 - 2012-11-11 02:47:03 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
I see this term get thrown around a lot, more often as a pejorative for players that play the game a certain way - I'm not sure I understand what that certain way is, though, so I would appreciate it if someone explained. I know I'm going to get a few people who just say "carebears are the scum of highsec" and that's it, but that's not a definition, is it. I want to know WHY they're scum - or why they're NOT scum... in fact, I'd rather a definition, properly delivered without bias, not include the word scum at all. An explanation would be nice, not more accusations, pejoratives and condemnations. I just want to know what it means, not how you feel about it - although I'm sure some of you will tell me anyway.





The best definition I can think of is this:


Use a RL example, think of two workers.

One is in the private sector, non union, self-employed, a contractor of sorts, who has to cut his own deals, do his own negotiations and contracts, and take responsibility for his decisions. If he underestimates a job, he has to eat it. He has to deal with his own reputation and his rewards rely on that and a job well done. His own efficiency and cost-effectiveness is crucial.

The other is a government or gov-contractor in a Union job who expects a given number of hours every week, a pay scale no matter how little work done and no matter how inefficient, and is next to impossible to fire. They are apt to strike when the don't "get their way" in union contracts, usually manifesting in demanding more pay for the same work even when they have not become more efficient to justify a greater share of gross over net. They will watch the clock all day and do everything to get someone else to do more work. They will stay in the same job, year after year, counting the days to retirement and a big fat unsustainable pension.


Which one is the "carebear"?


Bring back DEEEEP Space!
stoicfaux
#15 - 2012-11-11 02:48:34 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
carebear = anyone who actively avoids PVP
not really rocket science

Except that anyone who participates in the Eve market engages in market PvP. Which makes 99.999+% of Eve players non-carebears.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-11-11 02:49:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Flurk Hellbron
If i don't like mining ---> miners are "carebears"
If I don't like missioning ----> missioners are "carebears"
If I hate low sec ----> low sec dwellers are "carebears"
If I don't wanna go into wormholes -------> those that "live" there are "carebears"

Those people who use the term carebear, use it agains players that play the game in a way the users don't wanna play the game.
So, as mentioned before, "carebears" don't exist in general. It is a term someone use to point out they don't like a playing style of another player. It's what you make of it. Or better, it's those who are called that way by the user.

Define "devil" or "angel"....? Them are also what definition urself give to it.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2012-11-11 02:50:18 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
carebear = anyone who actively avoids PVP
not really rocket science

Except that anyone who participates in the Eve market engages in market PvP. Which makes 99.999+% of Eve players non-carebears.



We both knows he means PvP ship-to-ship combat - let's not fiddle with semantics here.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#18 - 2012-11-11 02:52:24 UTC
Phytoplankton.

Highsec is owned by players now. Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory. All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey The Code. Mining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2012-11-11 02:52:55 UTC
Flurk Hellbron wrote:
If i don't like mining ---> miners are "carebears"
If I don't like missioning ----> missioners are "carebears"
If I hate low sec ----> low sec dwellers are "carebears"
If I don't wanna go into wormholes -------> those that "live" there are "carebears"

Those people who use the term carebear, use it agains players that play the game in a way the users don't wanna play the game.
So, as mentioned before, "carebears" don't exist in general. It is a term someone use to point out they don't like a playing style of another player. It's what you make of it. Or better, it's those who are called that way by the user.

Define "devil" or "angel"....? Them are also what definition urself give to it.


No, a definition is clear-cut and not subjective. All that means is a lot of people are using the term wrong, and should use something else. "Devils" and "Angels" are well defined, and even have thesaurus entries.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Nexus Day
Lustrevik Trade and Travel Bureau
#20 - 2012-11-11 02:52:59 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
carebear = anyone who actively avoids PVP


THANK you. NOW we're getting somewhere. Does anyone else have something intelligent to offer like this guy?

EDIT: Rocket science is actually really easy, these days. That figure of speech is so outdated - now quantum and particle physics, cosmology, and biochemistry.... that's real science. Rocket science is mostly just a lot of maths.

Ah the old shout until you hear the answer you want tactic.

And here I thought you wanted opinions.
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