Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Then compare zealot with range rigs and tracking enhancers.
You'll get even more range like 180km.

When this nerf hits, zelot will be 1000x better than tengu.

I don't know why are you people comparing tengu or drake with RIGS leave rigs alone and compare range with only skills and hull bonuses.

Ok, lets do that. What kind of tank can you get out of that beam Zealot you created? Also how much DPS are you getting at that range?

What's the point of your ship then ? A helios would kill it...

Bouh, could you please fix your attitude... i bet i'm not the only one getting tired of it. You have some valid points but could there be less ridiculing way to convey your thoughts?

Things have been debated here a lot, and then people come, bringing arguments already debated 50 pages ago. I know it's not so easy to go in such a thread, but what's the point comming here if it is to ignore everything said before ?

Perhaps I shouldn't answers all these people saying insanities like caldari are worth nothing whereas they are the second most used race in the game and it's certainly not because of people stupidity but more probably because of their (sometimes over)effectiveness. If only people coming didn't had these insanity in mind, like caldari having two ships worth flying, may be I would be less sarcastic, but we see these since page ONE !

In the case of Spc One, the debate relate to the innate differences between missiles and turrets (turrets don't have a hard range limit), ignore everything missiles can do (like fitting rig to extend their range by ~50% and apply full dps at their max range and still leave fitting for tank), and talk about irreal situation and ships (like a 180km sniping zealot insta poping an helios with beams, in the era of 150km on grig warp and tier3 BC).

All these have been discussed in the previous 50 pages, and in the previous pages too. So I admit I'm a bit sarcastic, but I wouldn't have this oportunity if people were actually reading the thread to avoid posting the same insanities we see since the first page.

How about 210km with T1 cruiser?

[Caracal, 210km HM]

Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script
Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script
Sensor Booster II
Sensor Booster II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile

Medium Rocket Fuel Cache Partition II
Medium Hydraulic Bay Thrusters II
Medium Hydraulic Bay Thrusters I


Zainou 'Deadeye' Missile Projection MP-705
Zainou 'Deadeye' Rapid Launch RL-1005

Don't want to use T2 rigs? Fine, it still has 193km range.

Last time I checked missiles are only weapon with true selectable damage type.

Drones have selectable damage types.

Missiles have a flight time and are destructible though, just as drones... they are missiles after all so it makes sense. So of course they would need some sort of ability to balance things. But the thing was that this "ability" wasn't very useful since many ships had damage bonuses only for kinetic damage types. Luckily this seems to be finally changing.

Also when you complain about the missiles still being able to do very minimal damage to frigates, while guns have tracking problems consider that the guns are able to insta pop that frigate if he makes a piloting error etc this is a fact even though many claims that good pilot wont ever let that happen but i beg to disagree, anything can happen.
Also missiles always hit them but usually frigates have the speed advantage to escape or have his/her friends arrive before being worried about that small damage taken.

These are all traits to 2 completely different weapon systems and they shouldn't be too similar to each other and have their various advantages and disadvantages. Instead of warheads maybe some missile types could carry something else... being a long range platform and used mostly by Caldari it could spark some interest to long range pvp again, no guns would be able to do that and it would give missiles more specialization and reason to train. But this can also cause problems when trying to balance them.

The way we are currently going and with future (TE, TC, TD affecting missiles) it looks like that while we are balancing these systems we are just making them more similar to each other and i don't like this at all.

I'm pretty sure he like most of us here know about those new ship balancings and this indeed is the right direction to go, but right now in the game most have just bonus for kinetic damage. And with the ship balancing that is 2 T1 ships fixed while all the rest will likely have to wait their turn for a long time.

Oh, and he likely mistaked Harpy for Hawk which has bonus for kinetic damage only.

Your last argument is kind of funny :)

That is the advantage of the missiles in addition to their long reach, should they not have it? If you want to have freely choosable damage type then go with missiles but you have delayed damage projection and likely sig radius problems with some situations. Or then choose the appropriate gun type that deals most of the wanted damage type and pick your targets.

Also with the 10 second reload time while in battle is rarely worth it unless you are sure what is the opponents weakest resist.

Try to see missiles as completely different weapon system and not just compare it straight to guns.