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Crime & Punishment

 
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Dec Shield - End of the Second Era

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The Zerg Overmind
Rule Reversal
#361 - 2012-11-06 20:40:02 UTC
Reticle wrote:
The Zerg Overmind wrote:
TEST has just taken on 9 mutual wardecs of their choosing:

Manifest Destiny.
C0VEN
One.
The Marmite Collective
The Hollow Men
Lonetrek Salvage and Scrap
The Skunkworks
Kicking Smurfs
Spatial Distortions

They obtained these wars from Dec Shield and brought them back to their alliance. TEST is however NOT trapped. TEST are the defending side in these wars. So if the wars don't work out for them they can selective unmutual and drop them. I am surprised that they would willingly choose to have mutual wars with so many highsec griefers though. It will be quite interesting for the chosen 9 :P

How did they do this? How did they manage to selectively choose the wars? I don't understand the mechanics.

A corp joins Dec Shield, then leaves. They then set all the wars they don't want to unmutual, wait a week for them to drop off. Then they're left with only mutual wars against people they want to fight, and then they apply with that corp to their alliance. And 24hrs later that alliance has the wars of their choosing.

Anyone is welcome to join Dec Shield and do the same to selectively poach wars they want from our epic stockpile of them :P

Burn Highsec Griefers
Tora Bushido
The Marmite Mercenaries
BLACKFLAG.
#362 - 2012-11-06 22:46:34 UTC
Yeh, same here. If you have a corp......send me a mail, join alliance and leave. Tadaa .... many wars for at least a week Twisted

DELETE THE WEAK, ADAPT OR DIE !

Meta Gaming Level VII, Psycho Warfare Level X, Smack Talk Level VII.
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#363 - 2012-11-06 23:47:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
The Zerg Overmind wrote:

A corp joins Dec Shield, then leaves. They then set all the wars they don't want to unmutual, wait a week for them to drop off. Then they're left with only mutual wars against people they want to fight, and then they apply with that corp to their alliance. And 24hrs later that alliance has the wars of their choosing.

Anyone is welcome to join Dec Shield and do the same to selectively poach wars they want from our epic stockpile of them :P

OMG !! O_O

Perfect explanation for what i wanted to know !

So i can hop in and out and i have 11k more targets to shoot at.


That's not a bug, that's a feature !
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#364 - 2012-11-07 18:53:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Bugsy VanHalen
Karah Serrigan wrote:
The Zerg Overmind wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
The Zerg Overmind wrote:
Any corporations that drop out of C0VEN I believe will remain in permanent outgoing wardecs, and never be able to join an alliance again (corps with outgoing wars can't join alliances).

What the ****, are you for real? Is that the way it actually works? I'm not into alliance stuff, so I don't have firsthand experience, but is this the way it works now?

How is this even a thing? :\

I'm pretty sure that's how it works, but I haven't explicitly tested it yet. The more ways I carve it, the more ways I find our victims are screwed.

If this is really how it works i see no future for your business because there is no way this wont be taken as an exploit and fixed.

This is how it works. I am glad to see others also feel it is an exploit. There is another thread where a small corp Romanian Renegades I believe it is (a Corp founded in 2003) has been hit hard by this "fixed" mechanic.

They joined a faction wars alliance with the intention of getting into faction wars PVP. The alliance they joined then war deced a corp of their own faction. RR did not agree with this war dec and left the alliance. They had no say in whether or not the war was declared. The alliance leader does not need consent from the member corps to declare war. Yet they inherited the aggressor flag even when leaving the alliance because they did not support the war. When they left the alliance the deced corp made the war mutual and they are now locked in a mutual war and can not join another alliance. They were not really the aggressor and were against the war, but inherited the aggressor flag as the war was started by their before they left.

They do not want to disband this corp as it has a long history. They have been together since the beginning of EVE. Yet that is there only means of shedding this war they did not start due to broken aggressor flag mechanics.

I support Dec shield for forcing this flaw into the public eye. Only a few weeks since this patch went live and they have there first SOV holding alliance locked into mutual war. If this happens to an Alliance with a member sitting on the CSM you can be sure it will be fixed.
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#365 - 2012-11-07 18:58:51 UTC
Tora Bushido wrote:
Yeh, same here. If you have a corp......send me a mail, join alliance and leave. Tadaa .... many wars for at least a week Twisted

As long as you make those wars mutual before they notice and retract them I believe they will become permanent wars. This is where the exploit comes in. Only the defender has the power to end the war. Even if your corp gets the wars through this broken mechanic.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#366 - 2012-11-07 23:18:10 UTC
Im wondering how much of this is really an exploit or different from "working as intended". Zerg talks about burning high sec griefers, burning corps, burning alliances. Maybe its all as planned.

Maybe that is why the expansion was called Inferno.

Im thinking all of this drama, hilarity and spreading of wars is exactly what CCP wanted to see. Greifers burning! Corps burning! Wars spreading like fire! Inferno success!

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
Catalyst XI
Catalytic Holdings
#367 - 2012-11-07 23:48:46 UTC
^ i believe its called "war aids".......
Nir Trild
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#368 - 2012-11-08 04:29:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Nir Trild
Vincent Athena wrote:
Im wondering how much of this is really an exploit or different from "working as intended". Zerg talks about burning high sec griefers, burning corps, burning alliances. Maybe its all as planned.

Maybe that is why the expansion was called Inferno.

Im thinking all of this drama, hilarity and spreading of wars is exactly what CCP wanted to see. Greifers burning! Corps burning! Wars spreading like fire! Inferno success!



lol no.

then would been every (nearly) other feature of inferno a trap ...or even a lie!

Because the surrender mechanic, which should work for sure now is pointless like the whole new ally system...or kicking allies out of a war as soon as it would make mutual.

Because you can (backup) copys of your war.

And because a war should be something between TWO entitys ccp says: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Wars

I like to quote the following
Musiaba Schenoly wrote:

...
Mercs and new ally-system are not needed anymore, gj! Evil

Just copy your war!

Perhaps make it mutual and transfer it - to a dead corp or a fake alliance like dec shield - wherever you like!

And the evil evil evil highsec griefers - ccp may ban 'em, hello kitty will prevail! - are stucked in an infinite war.

Who needs a working sandbox, if you can trap them like that?

You wd someone with something more than an one-man-and-his-alt corp? Fail!

Forever no highsec logistics, no incursions with organized fleets anymore.
You want to join a new alliance? Oh sry - its gamemechanically impossible! Because you have an MUTUAL outgoing war to someone, who get it from someone - who copied it from someone you never have seen or known! What you are complaining? You will get some notifications every day!

An alliance with dec shields wars tries to recruit you and you haven't already outgoing wars?
You could have such a fine and long war history (one or two wars may result in no kills and no losses, or even more than one or two? But don't care you are a fine pvp-corp) - just join!
Ofc it will be your last alliance!

Oh, what about joining any other alliance?
You should be true - it could be your last again!
Although they aren't already in dec shields wars:
They got problems with you and want to make you never ever join another alliance?
Np, they could dec an alt-corp, which makes the war mutual to boot you then, the alt-corp could set the resulting war mutual to the booted corp and surrender to the alliance!
( https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2099149#post2099149)

And ALL this is NOT griefplay?
Don't care what the initiator of dec shield may tell us here https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1957430 !


But nvm! everything works like intended: Big smile
It may be the isk-sink everybody demands - finally, yay!

Because everytime you decced someone or want something to do like discribed, the solution is soo easy (dunno who adviseed it anymore but makes sense in this context)

you can always disband the corporation and reform a new one.

Ofc that wouldn't be corp-hopping to avoid wars, what was already addressed in the past somehow.

That all may seem a little bit complicated or even strange, but perhaps ccp could make an addon in the remote future, what advances highsec war mechanic ...oh wait.


...an ironic summary of our problem, I think.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#369 - 2012-11-08 15:21:04 UTC
This is a disgusting abuse of a bugged system and you are a horrible person for exploiting it.

You're also awesome and hilarious and I love you.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Musiaba Schenoly
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#370 - 2012-11-08 16:51:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Musiaba Schenoly
The Zerg Overmind wrote:
Dec Shield is back once again to use wardec mechanics to inflict grief upon your enemies.

The Plan:
Due to current wardec mechanics, ...


Edit: Wording changed to match our forum rules, CCP Phantom


nice1, any other comments ccp Phantom?
The Zerg Overmind
Rule Reversal
#371 - 2012-11-08 20:14:04 UTC
Musiaba Schenoly wrote:
The Zerg Overmind wrote:
Dec Shield is back once again to use wardec mechanics to inflict grief upon your enemies.

The Plan:
Due to current wardec mechanics, ...


Edit: Wording changed to match our forum rules, CCP Phantom


nice1, any other comments ccp Phantom?

LOL, he changed the word ABUSE to USE in the first sentence. We just got trolled

Burn Highsec Griefers
Tah'ris Khlador
Space Ghosts.
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#372 - 2012-11-08 20:30:20 UTC
I am presently initiating an operation to create a "Forever War" with a particular alliance of non-interest. I was decidedly way too giddy when I realized I could accomplish this task. This might be a sign that I play too much eve.

Member of the Pink Pony Killboard Padding Alliance
Tora Bushido
The Marmite Mercenaries
BLACKFLAG.
#373 - 2012-11-09 11:14:04 UTC
No idea why people keep calling this an exploit. Its an error by design. Blink

DELETE THE WEAK, ADAPT OR DIE !

Meta Gaming Level VII, Psycho Warfare Level X, Smack Talk Level VII.
Brib Vogt
Doomheim
#374 - 2012-11-09 16:46:21 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:
Permanent war decs will be fixed in Retribution.
We have made it so that in a mutual war, the original aggressor has the option of retracting the war.
And by "we have made it so", I mean Punkturis has made it so.
Tah'ris Khlador
Space Ghosts.
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#375 - 2012-11-09 19:22:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tah'ris Khlador
Brib Vogt wrote:
CCP Tallest wrote:
Permanent war decs will be fixed in Retribution.
We have made it so that in a mutual war, the original aggressor has the option of retracting the war.
And by "we have made it so", I mean Punkturis has made it so.


Can you link where this is posted? That is a poor fix, but I'd rather reply to the original post than here.

EDIT: Found it.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2159028#post2159028

Member of the Pink Pony Killboard Padding Alliance
The Zerg Overmind
Rule Reversal
#376 - 2012-11-11 00:42:06 UTC  |  Edited by: The Zerg Overmind
We've officially crossed 12k players trapped.

We also just got an interesting case. We just trapped "o7 Mate" corp against Dec Shield. But in the 24hrs before their we got their war, they applied to Dec Shield. Corps that apply to an alliance are still able to make outgoing wars, but once accepted they'll be trapped in permanent limbo of the "Accepted" state. Now this guy is trapped in that state, forever :P

Burn Highsec Griefers
ZaBob
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#377 - 2012-11-11 10:18:34 UTC
The Zerg Overmind wrote:
We've officially crossed 12k players trapped.

We also just got an interesting case. We just trapped "o7 Mate" corp against Dec Shield. But in the 24hrs before their we got their war, they applied to Dec Shield. Corps that apply to an alliance are still able to make outgoing wars, but once accepted they'll be trapped in permanent limbo of the "Accepted" state. Now this guy is trapped in that state, forever :P



It looks like they got unstuck?
Kc Decartes
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#378 - 2012-11-11 10:36:28 UTC
The Zerg Overmind wrote:
We've officially crossed 12k players trapped.

We also just got an interesting case. We just trapped "o7 Mate" corp against Dec Shield. But in the 24hrs before their we got their war, they applied to Dec Shield. Corps that apply to an alliance are still able to make outgoing wars, but once accepted they'll be trapped in permanent limbo of the "Accepted" state. Now this guy is trapped in that state, forever :P


Nobody cares anymore Zerg. The exploit is about to be patched. Thank you for the ***** and giggles though, they've been fun.

Time to stop trolling and move on. This glass house is about to have a stone tossed through it's front door.

Cya around.

KcD

D.F.C.S.
Goonspiracy
Doomheim
#379 - 2012-11-11 19:44:27 UTC
Dec Shield + Goonswarm. Controlling your game in ways that you can't begin to understand...
The Zerg Overmind
Rule Reversal
#380 - 2012-11-12 02:48:09 UTC  |  Edited by: The Zerg Overmind
Kc Decartes wrote:
lulz
From: Kc Decartes
Sent: 2012.11.12 02:41
To: The Zerg Overmind,

Your ***** are falling apart. Keep in mind we told u they would, almost 4 months ago now. I wanted to take this time to thank you for the giggles you've provided.

Ofc though you know that I'll always market towards your down fall. I never said one word on the fourms that I didn't mean.

I'm going to dance with you well after the dec game has ended. As if I was not on your comms since the birth of what you made your name with.

Cya around hero,

KcD

The amazing thing is that you STILL don't understand our motives

Kc Decartes wrote:
Re: Re: lulz
From: Kc Decartes
Sent: 2012.11.12 02:47
To: The Zerg Overmind,

I do understand, only on a more grand lvl then you. In the long run, it is you who does not understand.

Burn Highsec Griefers