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Null sec serpentis ratting ship advice
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fcosta
#1 - 2012-11-05 10:39:05 UTC
Hello there.
I´m currently ratting in serpentis null sec using a standart ratting machariel with a decent tank and 800mm t2 guns loaded with phased plasma.

Although the tank is good, the dps gets a little gimped forom the sensor dampening produced by the rats.
I would like to ask all of the fitting Guru’s out there for some advice regardin the machariel fit, or if another ship is in order.

Should i keep ratting with the machariel, removing some tank and putting some sensor boosting module or should i switch to a better suited ship?

I see lot’s of guys going about in vindicators. Will this be a better option? If so, can someone share some vindi fittings that would work?

Thx in advance.
Tao Dolcino
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-11-05 11:50:05 UTC
It's maybe not the answer you would expect, but what about an Isthar ? A full flight of sentinels with the right modules is deadly and has a great range, it's almost a battleship in the size of a cruiser (with the nice T2 resistances).
fcosta
#3 - 2012-11-05 12:17:39 UTC
Tao Dolcino wrote:
It's maybe not the answer you would expect, but what about an Isthar ? A full flight of sentinels with the right modules is deadly and has a great range, it's almost a battleship in the size of a cruiser (with the nice T2 resistances).


Thx for the reply

I could certainly consider a Ishtar, but will it be able to apply the dps needed for clearing a sanctum or an haven in a reasonable amount of time?
And, with the new expansion coming up, the drones will start to have agro and the attention will need to be doubled. Since I need also to have an eye open for piratesPirate I would rather have a more “hands free” type of ship.Oops

What fit would you suggest though?

Waiting for more feedback.
Tao Dolcino
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-11-05 12:43:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Tao Dolcino
Well, the sentinels ship is a specific style, not everyone will like it :
You always try to warp in as far as possible, drop your speed to 0 if you are at the right distance, then drop the sentinels, and shoot first the fastest ennemies. If needed you insta-recall your sentinels (as they are static) and run to a farther position and repeat. The T2 sentinels alone deal more than 500 dps with the right skills (no ammo needed, no cap needed, invulnerable to web, ecm etc..., possibility to choose the range and type of damage, good tank : if a sentinel takes agro you can wait a bit before to recall her in bay, as long as the damages are only in the shield of the drone, that even becomes part of your own tanking strategy). You can then add 3 medium railguns for more dps, so you get at least 600 dps at good range instantaneously applicable (as the sentinels don't travel). The Ishtar is fast and has a small signature (135 if i remember correctly).

There's a post which has becomed a classical now about this : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=30338
it's maybe not exactly what you do, but there is a lot of good stuff from which you can build your own fit and strategy.

Edit : as for the new expansion, i wouldn't worry too much : the drones will catch abit more often aggro, but not that much. And with the sentinels it's absolutely no problem : as long as you stay next to them you can instantaneously recall them and launch them again. However i'd be maybe a bit more worried to use heavy drones.

Edit 2 : if sometimes, it happens, a few frigs get too close to you, no problem : you recall your sentinels and launch a flight of light or medium scouts. The isthar wins +50 m3 extra Drone Bay space per HAC level, So 125 + (5*50) = 375 m3, just like a Dominix !!!
Also, i have set the space bar to recall my drones, it's very very useful Blink
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#5 - 2012-11-05 17:01:44 UTC
Ishtar can do every 8/10 serp and DG solo, with 500-600 dps on ogre's, its easy peasy.

I hate sentries.
fcosta
#6 - 2012-11-05 21:38:28 UTC
Maeltstome wrote:
Ishtar can do every 8/10 serp and DG solo, with 500-600 dps on ogre's, its easy peasy.

I hate sentries.


still no vindicator fits? is it not a viable ship for sertpentis null?
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#7 - 2012-11-05 21:48:34 UTC
fcosta wrote:
Maeltstome wrote:
Ishtar can do every 8/10 serp and DG solo, with 500-600 dps on ogre's, its easy peasy.

I hate sentries.


still no vindicator fits? is it not a viable ship for sertpentis null?


It is, but they're expensive and rather vulnerable to being ganked. However, if that's what you've got your heart set on, then yes the Vindi will tear through Serp rats. Be prepared to put a high-meta MWD on it, and maybe consider a shield fit.

You might also consider a Vigilant, which can put out an amazing amount of DPS for a Cruiser and is rather more agile and escapable.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
fcosta
#8 - 2012-11-05 22:18:42 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
fcosta wrote:
Maeltstome wrote:
Ishtar can do every 8/10 serp and DG solo, with 500-600 dps on ogre's, its easy peasy.

I hate sentries.


still no vindicator fits? is it not a viable ship for sertpentis null?


It is, but they're expensive and rather vulnerable to being ganked. However, if that's what you've got your heart set on, then yes the Vindi will tear through Serp rats. Be prepared to put a high-meta MWD on it, and maybe consider a shield fit.

You might also consider a Vigilant, which can put out an amazing amount of DPS for a Cruiser and is rather more agile and escapable.


Can i have a specific fit for both of them ?
Lord Calus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-11-05 22:29:54 UTC
Naga

8 Meta4 Neutrons

AB
Active Kinetic x2
Active Therm
2x LSE2

3x magstabs

3x core defense field purgers


~850 DPS. Forsaken Hubs. Collect bacon.
Nor Tzestu
Dos Pollos Hermanos
Ghosts from the Abyss
#10 - 2012-11-06 00:47:55 UTC
Lord Calus wrote:
Naga

8 Meta4 Neutrons

AB
Active Kinetic x2
Active Therm
2x LSE2

3x magstabs

3x core defense field purgers


~850 DPS. Forsaken Hubs. Collect bacon.


This is what I was coming to post. Pretty much steamrolls serp rats before you even need to worry about tanking.
fcosta
#11 - 2012-11-06 08:49:23 UTC  |  Edited by: fcosta
niceTwisted

Never tryed one of those. need to give it a whirl.

any more viable options?

Btw, wich ammo should i use on the Naga?
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#12 - 2012-11-06 11:05:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcanis
fcosta wrote:
niceTwisted

Never tryed one of those. need to give it a whirl.

any more viable options?

Btw, wich ammo should i use on the Naga?


Antimatter L is the only ammo to use an non-T2 Blasters.

EDIT: Serps do a lot of thermal DPS. For Serps I'd consider Kin + Therm + Invuln as the hardeners.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
fcosta
#13 - 2012-11-06 12:11:48 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
fcosta wrote:
niceTwisted

Never tryed one of those. need to give it a whirl.

any more viable options?

Btw, wich ammo should i use on the Naga?


Antimatter L is the only ammo to use an non-T2 Blasters.

EDIT: Serps do a lot of thermal DPS. For Serps I'd consider Kin + Therm + Invuln as the hardeners.


Thx for the input. I suck at fitting ships and still need to improove the t2 skills at blasters. Regarding your previous post (wich i thank you for) do you have some sugested fits for the vindi and vigilant i can use out there?

I will certainly make sure to haul a Naga, an Ishtar and any other sugested ship and fit to my ratting systems to try them out one by one.

thx to all the contributers.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#14 - 2012-11-06 12:34:23 UTC
I'd recommend starting out with the Naga until you have polished your gunnery skills.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Lord Calus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2012-11-06 14:22:44 UTC
Naga is far and away the best anom ship I have used to date. Granted I have not tried a vindi, but why bother? Naga fully fit is like 200mil. I can rat with neutrals in local and never care, I just lost 7 ticks worth of ship if I die. This is coming from having personally used a HML and HAM tengu, drake, rattlesnake, domi, etc.

Antimatter L is the best ammo really, I dont see the point of using Tech2 and faction ammo to rat. I'm still working on my gunnery supports to 5, but Im getting 790ish DPS, 7k optimal, 18k falloff. The passive recharge is enough to keep the ship going between waves and never having to dock up. The only PITA ships are the elite cruisers and the grand admirals because they are hard to hit, and the grand admirals love to pull range. I have my orbit button set at 5k, which puts me orbiting around 6.5k, which gives 1.7k-2.5k hits. Ticks are between 20 and 27mil. Not a bad trade off for price. I was going to try and theory up a Talos, but why bother?

BTW, rail fits don't work. The range is nice to not have to chase down ships, but being that far out just gets you pounded in the face hole.
fcosta
#16 - 2012-11-06 17:49:44 UTC
Lord Calus wrote:
Naga is far and away the best anom ship I have used to date. Granted I have not tried a vindi, but why bother? Naga fully fit is like 200mil. I can rat with neutrals in local and never care, I just lost 7 ticks worth of ship if I die. This is coming from having personally used a HML and HAM tengu, drake, rattlesnake, domi, etc.

Antimatter L is the best ammo really, I dont see the point of using Tech2 and faction ammo to rat. I'm still working on my gunnery supports to 5, but Im getting 790ish DPS, 7k optimal, 18k falloff. The passive recharge is enough to keep the ship going between waves and never having to dock up. The only PITA ships are the elite cruisers and the grand admirals because they are hard to hit, and the grand admirals love to pull range. I have my orbit button set at 5k, which puts me orbiting around 6.5k, which gives 1.7k-2.5k hits. Ticks are between 20 and 27mil. Not a bad trade off for price. I was going to try and theory up a Talos, but why bother?

BTW, rail fits don't work. The range is nice to not have to chase down ships, but being that far out just gets you pounded in the face hole.



Thx a lot guys. i will definetly try out these fits and tatics.Blink
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#17 - 2012-11-06 18:26:29 UTC
Lord Calus wrote:
I was going to try and theory up a Talos, but why bother?


That Naga looks really good, I tried to pyfa a similar Talos with armor tank, pst, active shield and ASB but none of them seem to work like that Naga.

OP,

I've used Ishtar and while it performs really well sig/speedtanking all anoms, tier 3 BCs have clearly more deeps. Which is what counts in anoms, they don't put out any serious damage so light tank, max hurt is the way to go.

(these days Ishtar does 659 dps with Gardes plus couple of hundred from blasters, combined with great tank and utility it is a superb plexing ship)

.
Jerick Ludhowe
Internet Tuff Guys
#18 - 2012-12-01 19:51:04 UTC
Maeltstome wrote:
Ishtar can do every 8/10 serp and DG solo, with 500-600 dps on ogre's, its easy peasy.

I hate sentries.


How do you manage to kill the tower "boss" in the 8/10 with just an ishtar's DPS. The 10/10 can be managed by moving to beyond 55km, stopping the massive tank. I've tried moving to 80km as some have suggested for the 8/10 but am finding that the tower still is tanking.