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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#121 - 2012-10-31 20:47:52 UTC
TheGunslinger42 wrote:
funrollloops wrote:
To be honest, I just don't really trust miners. I don't believe anyone finds mining fun, so what the hell are they doing? They're definitely up to something (at least the ones that aren't bots). I wish they'd find something else to do besides hanging around the asteroid belts in their odd looking barges gibbering weirdly and using their perverted weaponry to shoot space rocks.


James summed it up well a while ago: Miners strive to NOT play the game and to instead be bots. I'll try and find the post, it was one of his big threadnaughts about ganking miners from last year

It was an amazing threadnaught.

Thread Calibration V

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#122 - 2012-10-31 21:42:10 UTC
White Quake wrote:
Hello

As i have stated before i am not new to EvE but new to the forums. As a PvP pilot of nine years, i am find it highly disturbing the amount of hostility that PvP pilots direct at high sec PvE players, i do not use the term care-bear as it is derogatory towards other players who do not choose to game as i do. Below i am going to highlight issues i have with the current PvP pilot attitude towards PvE players.

1. We hate miners - The question is why? What is it they do other than play EvE online in a different way to you? The truth is, nothing, 0.0 alliances control the market, not empire corps, they never have. So why the hate towards miners?

2. We hate mission runners - The question is why? What is it they do other than play EvE online in a diffrent way to you? The truth is, nothing, The get enjoyment from buying expensive ships, running level 4's, watching there wealth go up and tricking out there ships much like i do for PvP. But, you don't like it? Seems a tad reprehensible to me.

3. We hate Incursions - The Question is why? What is it they do other than play EvE online in a diffrent way to you? The truth is, nothing, they love incursions, the love to make so much money, they don't know what to do with it, so what? How does this affect you? It doesn't, you just complain and get them nerfed to hell and back. Seems again, reprehensible.

4. We hate WH corps - The question is why? What is it they do other than play EvE online in a diffrent way to you? The truth is, nothing. You dislike they can hide in bubbles, make money and don't have to fight you, have cloaky ships (even tho you use these yourself). Again, reprehensible.

The bottom line is, PvP pilots dislike PvE pilots for one reason and one reason only, they choose to play EvE Online differently than you, for you to attack the PvE population verbally on the forums and to push your own agenda will not force them to PvP or force them into our play grounds. All you will force them to do is quit.

Also please don't rag in with *market pvp* because thats rubbish, the market is business. Not PvP. U cant swing it that way, so dont even try

I have been a pvp since 2 months after beta when i joined Curse Alliance and have been ever since, yes i have an ice miner (doesn't make me much isk) and yes i have a mission runner in a tengu (makes less isk than null ratting tbfh) so, in that regard.

You need to leave off because it is very sad and reprehensible that PvP pilots think you have god given right to tell other people how to play a game they pay for. You can sit and say Market PvP and Trade PvP and blah blah PvP but they don't see it like that and should not be forced to.

When a player "pays" to play EvE Online, they should not then be forced to play how a PvP pilot demands he does, it is beyond selfish.


I don't hate you at all. What I don't like is that you are able to gain as much reward as I do with far less risk and many people of your demographic emphatically argue in favor of the current broken risk:reward dynamic so their all holy "isk/hr" remains unaffected. People who experience actual risk are tired of highsec being pampered and being told to HTFU when we complain. It doesn't help that CCP mostly ignores other sec areas or leaves them hideously broken for long periods of time either. It also doesn't help that most of the highsec PvErs who post here are npc alts, rage posting, or posting something moronic.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#123 - 2012-10-31 22:20:33 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
What I don't like is that you are able to gain as much reward as I do with far less risk and many people of your demographic emphatically argue in favor of the current broken risk:reward dynamic so their all holy "isk/hr" remains unaffected. People who experience actual risk are tired of highsec being pampered and being told to HTFU when we complain. It doesn't help that CCP mostly ignores other sec areas or leaves them hideously broken for long periods of time either. It also doesn't help that most of the highsec PvErs who post here are npc alts, rage posting, or posting something moronic.

There's always moronic posting.

When it comes to highsec's risk:reward, it's practically a wall of badposts stacked on badposts, used to keep people away from their broken risk:reward.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
flakeys
Doomheim
#124 - 2012-11-01 08:34:43 UTC  |  Edited by: flakeys
Lilly Tiger wrote:
flakeys wrote:
Roll For someone who asks for a thread to be closed if it doesn't go the way he likes you sure know what topic's to choose OP .



I was actually following and posting in that thread you mentioned, and have been writing similar threads myself in the past. The reason he asked for it locked might have been that insistent guy always posting angry retorts and hiding behind "im in character!" and reiterating the same arguments over and over again?

Actually, come to think of it, i have been posting and following quite a few of those kind of threads over the years in EVE, and you know what? they almost always end with getting locked because of A) insane amounts of hate/flaming from some very vocal people. Usually of the type "you suck/should leave/die etc for not wanting to do PVP 24/7 in EVE!!!". B) the OP asking for it to be locked because of the massive amounts of personal attacks that start and the derailment of the topic that ensues from that..


And CCP gave us a tool for this wich is a forum block.Meaning that it's silly asking for a thread you started to be shut down because one person irritates you for either trolling or rage comments.You just simply ignore them.If you need to close a thread because of one bad apple then just close the forums down because it happends in every thread.

To me this showed OP wants to have a ''closed discussion'' as we call it in my country.Meaning he starts a discussion but only wants it if it goes his way by his rules and that is something you can not ask on a public forum.Also commenting on stuff you disagree with by saying : childish , immature , etc for me just even more proves the point.

If you feel the forums have become a cesspit and full of trolling as the OP claimed in his first thread , and you also have not used these forums while playing over the last 7+ years then enlighten me why you would start a new discussion on the forums after pointing out the above and asking for that thread to be locked over nothing.

You quoted me where i said the OP chooses the highest troll topics yet he claims to be against trolling.You then start as a disagreement but in the same line also claim these threads allways end up in a trollpit.So in short it looks like disagreeing for the sake of disagreeing and yet handing out the same point i made by accident Blink

The OP makes this same mistake over and over btw. He is saying pvp pilots should not say how the pve pilots play.As such he is telling the pvp pilots how they should play.See yet again a controversial , you can't say how i play but I CAN SAY how you play.I hate high sec deccers/griefers/scammers/suiciders just as much as the OP but it would be stupid from me to tell them how to play as i don't need others telling me how to play either.This is part of eve and yes the rule don't like it then don't play actually is the most decent one allthough it's usually only used as a troll remark.

If the OP is not trolling - wich i'm starting to doubt by now - then he sure is one stubborn guy or verry narrow minded . You tell me wich one he is

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#125 - 2012-11-01 08:49:55 UTC
Ritsum wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
White Quake wrote:

When a player "pays" to play EvE Online, they should not then be forced to play how a PvP pilot demands he does, it is beyond selfish.


When a player "pays" to play online he should not be forced to pay prices how an industry pilot demands he does, it is beyond selfish






You are paying to play a sandbox game where most of the items are player made, if they make it they have the right to set it at any price they want.

If you are mad about it do something about it in game, it is a sandbox and you have every right to do something about it.

Eg: Gank transport ships.



Er yes, that was in fact the point I was making.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Gussarde en Welle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#126 - 2012-11-01 08:53:40 UTC
Zenethalos wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:
Hating a common foe is a great way to unify people and get the herd moving in a singular direction. The pros create the foe, fuel the hate, and choose the direction.

The real question is, what's the direction? and who chose that direction?


Beat me to it. Where is most of this hate generated? In 0.0. When is this hate generated? When the major players are at a lull and have no big war to fight. Who generates the hate? The people in charge? Why do they generate the hate? To keep their troops unified until the next big thing comes along. What if they don't generate hate and create a campaign against it? People get bored, infighting, people leave.

The soldiers need directive and entertainment. Hulkageddon, ice interdiction, invasion of WH space en mass are all tools to keep the front liners from becoming rebellious.


This. Idea
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#127 - 2012-11-01 09:09:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
The stupid is strong in some parts of this thread, makes me glad I don't have an NPC alt or I might fall into the moronic rage posting demographic, trolling yes, moronic, hope not.

At least some of us hisec folk are willing to do something to disillusion others about the safety of hisec, admittedly we're only bumping folks but already the sweet sweet rage from certain people has been well worth the loss of the ISK I could be making missioning or mining instead.

Imagine how much more would flow if some of us so called hisec carebears that are disillusioned with the current situation decided to start suiciding barges and carrying on from where GSF left off.

Hisec income is currently too high for the amount of risk involved when you compare it to null and lo, hence it's full of alts for lo and null players, I believe, the figure was in the region of, 75% of characters reside in hisec. However instead of nerfing hisec incomes CCP should spend an expansion giving null and lo the buff they so desperately need to make it worthwhile living there for anything but ganking and sov.

I think it's high time to reclaim the term carebear from the whining idiots that want their corner of the sandbox to be padded so that they don't get hurt. These people need a new name, suggestions on a postcard please.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Liafcipe9000
Critically Preposterous
#128 - 2012-11-01 09:26:13 UTC
another crybaby posting after he got ganked by goons P
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din
Commonwealth Vanguard
#129 - 2012-11-01 10:00:45 UTC
I dont hate PVE'ers, miners or anyone else.

Rewards should however scale with risk and to a degree effort. Ice mining for instance, nice afk income, small effort low risk, reward is fairly low. Works fine. Missions, more effort, extremely low risk cant be done that well afk, income is modertae, works fine. Wormholes, higher risk both from AIs and from roaming people, quite alot of effort wuite high income, works great.

Hisec incursions- wtf, low risk, not that much effort - MASSIVE REWARDS.
FW missions, no sp, very low effort, extremely low riskbecause you can do it in a cheap frigate - MASSIVE REWARDS.

Those two things need to change. Everything else PVE seems quite fine to me.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Roderick Grey
Koenigsbergers
#130 - 2012-11-01 10:07:11 UTC
I think the reason that a lot of pvpers hate carebears is because they don't further their game style in any directly tangible way, if you're roaming through null and everyone suddenly docks up, no conflict, no form ups just silence it can frustrate certain players. Also I think a few players may hate the fact that pvpers have to generate isk but those generating isk don't have to pvp. Not that I agree with any of this, just my two cents.

“We could learn a lot from crayons; some are sharp, some are pretty, some are dull, while others bright, some have weird names, but they all have learned to live together in the same box.” - Special needs division of Fcon.
Wodensun
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#131 - 2012-11-01 14:31:00 UTC
White Quake wrote:

You need to leave off because it is very sad and reprehensible that PvP pilots think you have god given right to tell other people how to play a game they pay for.


Let me begin with saying your a hypocrit and just as bad as the people you post about. Roll
GTFO oldtimer your days are over. Honorable pvp is dead, long live the blob. Twisted

Do not give me likes them 101 likes arent a accident...
Ghazu
#132 - 2012-11-01 16:10:54 UTC
OP didn't explain what or why certain gameplay choices are so reprehensible, while the opposition have at least made an effort.

http://www.minerbumping.com/ lol what the christ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2299984#post2299984
eddie valvetino
Bi-Polar Bears
#133 - 2012-11-01 16:20:06 UTC
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
Your head looks too small Straight


agreed

Also, I don't hate anyone... I'm just lazy and they're easy to kill.

I just wish they would stop whining when someone finds a way to kill them.

Eve is now and has always been, a PvP based game. All the things in it lead to that.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#134 - 2012-11-01 16:22:10 UTC
Jessie Arr said it best.

Jessie Arr wrote:
I am now and always have been a carebear. I just beleive in pre-emptively defending my asteroids from everyone in the game, even people that live in regions far removed from my own.


I, too, am a carebear, and believe in defending my ISK from everyone who hasn't given it to me yet.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#135 - 2012-11-01 16:46:39 UTC
White Quake wrote:

You need to leave off because it is very sad and reprehensible that PvP pilots think you have god given right to tell other people how to play a game they pay for.


Not God-given, but rather CCP-given. I'm sure any respectable theologian would agree that there's a significant difference.

Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
admittedly we're only bumping folks and already the sweet sweet rage from certain people is well worth the loss of the ISK I could making missioning or mining instead.


There's also the fact that we help them to interact, hell, some of them are even good-humoured about it. Even the ones who use language that surely violates the EULA, the ones who bleat about it, and the ones who beg someone else to kill us (while not being prepared to do their own dirty work) are at least starting to get more from the game with the social content they're adding to local chat.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#136 - 2012-11-01 16:51:59 UTC
So… when will highsec “PvE pilots” back off from interfering with “PvP pilots?”

Oh, and OP: the market is the most vicious PvP arena in the game.
Touval Lysander
Zero Wine
#137 - 2012-11-01 19:45:22 UTC
Tippia wrote:
So… when will highsec “PvE pilots” back off from interfering with “PvP pilots?”

Oh, and OP: the market is the most vicious PvP arena in the game.

You used THAT word

"arena".

It's over!!!

"I've always been mad, I know I've been mad, like the most of us...very hard to explain why you're mad, even if you're not mad..."
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#138 - 2012-11-01 19:50:36 UTC
admiral root wrote:


Not God-given, but rather CCP-given. I'm sure any respectable theologian would agree that there's a significant difference.


Do NOt blaspheme Sir. Repent, say 12 Hail CCP Falcon's and give yourself 10 leashes and we'll call it even, CCP giveth/buff and CCP taketh/Nerf Away.

Amen.
White Quake
Doomheim
#139 - 2012-11-01 19:55:39 UTC
Tippia wrote:
So… when will highsec “PvE pilots” back off from interfering with “PvP pilots?”

Oh, and OP: the market is the most vicious PvP arena in the game.


Absolute rubbish, there is no combat over the market, it is simply business, you don't see RL businessmen killing each other because Argos sold a stereo cheaper than Comet now do you?

There is no PVP on the market, it is an economy, simple because you can it's player vs player is untrue to say the least. It is twisting and mincing words to suit your own agendas.

The bottom line is, i am a PVP piot i have never ganked a barge nor war decked a high sec corp to get cheap kills and boost my ego fighting players who have no interest in PVP

That there in is the issue. PVP pilots should NOT be allowed to shoot in high sec at all. You should be confined to low sec were i live, were i play and shoot people, i have a kill record of over 858 kills and not one of those is in high sec at all. PvP pilots unless REGISTERED merc corps, should be confined to low/null sec. Merc corps should be forced to use a system were they bid on wars to get contracts and the client has to put up the wars for bidding.

i.e a client wants another corp taken out, he puts up an contract for the war - paid 900mil for 2 weeks, minimum ten kills, if the corp takes the contract, they are auto paid half, if they fail at the target, the isk is returned to the owner.

Please don't lecture to me about pvp, i have been pvping for as long as i can remember. I'm tired of pvp pilots having a go at high sec pilots because they play differently than u do.
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#140 - 2012-11-01 20:00:27 UTC
White Quake wrote:
Absolute rubbish, there is no combat over the market, it is simply business, you don't see RL businessmen killing each other because Argos sold a stereo cheaper than Comet now do you?


From experience, I can tell you that both Argos and Comet *fight* to sell you expensive crap at a lower price than each other. That right there is real-life PvP (technically, BvB). I've been a victim of both of these corporate bastards ganking my wallet.

White Quake wrote:
PVP pilots should NOT be allowed to shoot in high sec at all.


And the troll reveals his true colours.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff