These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Market Discussions

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

VAHFT Mutual Funds - Initial Public Offering

Author
Samroski
Middle-Earth
#141 - 2012-10-28 13:53:42 UTC
Nanatoa wrote:
A cap is a cap.
If you think you made a mistake with the reservations, fix it within the cap.
If you don't think you made a mistake, there's no need to mess with the cap.

It may be difficult to argue with Nanatoa's logic above :)

V'en appears to be a relatively new player and I'd be delighted to give 20 of my shares to him, which will hopefully fix this within the cap.

Any colour you like.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#142 - 2012-10-28 14:43:14 UTC
Vargan Armer wrote:
I will send the money as soon as, due to stupidity, I've reinstalled the EVE client :D


Hello,
you only sent 2 x 240M and not 2 x 250M.

If you are OK with that, I will give the resulting 20M "hole" to V'en.
Please tell me about your choice so I can arrange with Samroski.


Nanatoa wrote:
A cap is a cap.
If you think you made a mistake with the reservations, fix it within the cap.
If you don't think you made a mistake, there's no need to mess with the cap.


For some reason you sound quite hostile.
Samroski is going to solve your concern. "Solve" within friendly terms is the constructive approach imo.
BTW you are Market Maker if you want the headstart you should send ISK sooner than later.


Samroski wrote:

V'en appears to be a relatively new player and I'd be delighted to give 20 of my shares to him, which will hopefully fix this within the cap.


Yes that's why I am more concerned to help him in with his 20M than others with their billions.
If was going to give him another solution, but yours sure works. I am glad to have constructive Investors (capital " I " is deserved) like you on board.

Now, I noticed another Investor did not send 20M (see first reply in this post). If he won't reply or won't fill it up, then the 20M space could come from him. Otherwise, I'll be more than glad to accept your solution.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#143 - 2012-10-28 14:45:12 UTC
Confirming receipt of the following reservations:

Samroski as Market Maker
Graygor => Sent back the double ISK you sent.
Huttan Funaila
Rebecca Cairn
Irken Slushk as Market Maker
Dean Ozuwara
Rhat Dakota
Val'Dore on behalf of PlanetCorp InterStellar
Elegbara
Jadun
Towaoc
Vargan Armer
Amallya Trueshot


The following Investors have up to October 31st 23:59:59 EvE time to send ISK (else their reservation will be taken over by the next Investors in queue):


Grendell
Nanatoa
Mortimer Montague
Ford Chicago
Kama Sutramax
Seth Quantix
Grombutz
Nanatoa
#144 - 2012-10-28 15:04:29 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Nanatoa wrote:
A cap is a cap.
If you think you made a mistake with the reservations, fix it within the cap.
If you don't think you made a mistake, there's no need to mess with the cap.


For some reason you sound quite hostile.
Samroski is going to solve your concern. "Solve" within friendly terms is the constructive approach imo.
BTW you are Market Maker if you want the headstart you should send ISK sooner than later.


I would've phrased it differently, but you specifically wanted to see if anyone had "strong feelings". Making the message less direct (what you interpret as "hostile") and more polite might have given the impression that I don't feel strongly about the cap.

As for my investment, I haven't been ingame since you posted that isk could be sent. I will send the isk at my convenience, before the deadline set by you.

"Stay the course, we have done this many times before." - (CCP) Hilmar, June 2011

Vargan Armer
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#145 - 2012-10-28 18:05:21 UTC
Whoever it was that wanted 20 of my shares, sure.
TornSoul
BIG
#146 - 2012-10-28 18:55:17 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:

@Tornsoul

You did not see your name because the 100B filled within some hours and further Investors were put in queue (in case others don't fill their reservation by Oct 31).
But please see below @Grendell.


@Grendell

If you'd like to split your reservation with Tornsoul, be welcome!
I suppose you'll take 10B each?


Aha, so that is why.
Must admit I didn't add up the numbers at the time, thought there was plenty to go.


@Grendell - Thanks alot for offering - I'll gladly accept.

I'll be wiring 10B to VV shortly.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#147 - 2012-10-28 19:02:20 UTC
Vargan Armer wrote:
Whoever it was that wanted 20 of my shares, sure.


Perfect, thank you!



@V'en

We are sorted! You may send your 20M when you want.



Samroski wrote:

V'en appears to be a relatively new player and I'd be delighted to give 20 of my shares to him, which will hopefully fix this within the cap.


Thank you once again, it looks like Vargan Armer's solved the issue!





Grombutz
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#148 - 2012-10-28 23:28:32 UTC
ISK sent
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#149 - 2012-10-29 01:08:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Confirming receipt of the following reservations:

Samroski as Market Maker
Graygor => Sent back the double ISK you sent.
Huttan Funaila
Rebecca Cairn
Irken Slushk as Market Maker
Dean Ozuwara
Rhat Dakota
Val'Dore on behalf of PlanetCorp InterStellar
Elegbara
Jadun
Towaoc
Vargan Armer
Amallya Trueshot
Grombutz


The following Investors have up to October 31st 23:59:59 EvE time to send ISK (else their reservation will be taken over by the next Investors in queue):

V'en
Grendell
TornSoul
Nanatoa
Mortimer Montague
Ford Chicago
Kama Sutramax
Seth Quantix
TornSoul
BIG
#150 - 2012-10-29 03:08:39 UTC
uhm
Quote:

date=2012-10-28 19:07:43
refID=6517297720
ownerName1=TornSoul ownerID1=147917989
ownerName2=Vaerah Vahrokha ownerID2=1439129814
amount=-10000000000.00
reason=DESC: ESYFND





PS : Bloody hell, one can't even do a straight copy/paste from the API results on these POS forums (It thinks it's HTML???? which apparently isn't allowed)
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#151 - 2012-10-29 12:18:40 UTC
TornSoul wrote:
uhm

PS : Bloody hell, one can't even do a straight copy/paste from the API results on these POS forums (It thinks it's HTML???? which apparently isn't allowed)



All the amounts should be sent to VEMEX not to me.
I have moved your and Grendell's deposits in there, please do not send again.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#152 - 2012-10-29 12:24:39 UTC
IMPORTANT NEWS FOR MARKET MAKERS

You are going to get a small headstart so you'll be able to "make the market".
Starting tomorrow past downtime, VEMEX will start accepting your orders.
Current shares value is 1,000,000 per unit for all the funds.



Confirming receipt of the following reservations:

Samroski as Market Maker
Graygor => Sent back the double ISK you sent.
Huttan Funaila
Rebecca Cairn
Irken Slushk as Market Maker
Dean Ozuwara
Rhat Dakota
Val'Dore on behalf of PlanetCorp InterStellar
Elegbara
Jadun
Towaoc
Vargan Armer
Amallya Trueshot
Grombutz
Grendell
TornSoul


The following Investors have up to October 31st 23:59:59 EvE time to send ISK (else their reservation will be taken over by the next Investors in queue):

V'en
Nanatoa
Mortimer Montague
Ford Chicago
Kama Sutramax
Seth Quantix
Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
#153 - 2012-10-29 12:42:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Val'Dore
Nvm, will send in eve mail.

Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.

I invented Tiericide

oien cabrereas
Gold Trading Inc..
#154 - 2012-10-29 22:58:10 UTC
Im new soo
Investing 15mill in Easyfund if there any left.
also if you can tell me who to send the isk it be great :D
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#155 - 2012-10-29 23:03:04 UTC
oien cabrereas wrote:
Im new soo
Investing 15mill in Easyfund if there any left.
also if you can tell me who to send the isk it be great :D


Please wait until November 1, as the whole fund is reserved.
However, some Investors seem to have stopped following the investment even if they reserved shares.
In that case on Nov 1 their reservations will be all void so, you'll be able to buy the shares directly on the exchange.

For instructions about how to access, use it and where to send ISK, please wait for the manual which I am writing right now.
oien cabrereas
Gold Trading Inc..
#156 - 2012-10-29 23:11:34 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
oien cabrereas wrote:
Im new soo
Investing 15mill in Easyfund if there any left.
also if you can tell me who to send the isk it be great :D


Please wait until November 1, as the whole fund is reserved.
However, some Investors seem to have stopped following the investment even if they reserved shares.
In that case on Nov 1 their reservations will be all void so, you'll be able to buy the shares directly on the exchange.

For instructions about how to access, use it and where to send ISK, please wait for the manual which I am writing right now.


Thank you and I be waiting for that manual :D
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#157 - 2012-10-30 00:57:35 UTC
How to use the Exchange


Introduction

This exchange has been quite complex to put together but if you follow these instructions it'll be easy enough to use.

I'll cover the easy and common case first so that most Investors are done with this document quick, then I'll cover the ramifications. Some of them (like the "personal account" topic) should be read by everyone, but only after you read the first part. By default the exchange attempts to model a RL exchange as much as possible while still presenting EvE elements. When the EvE elements clash with the RL corresponding features, the RL features take precedence. If you ever used a simple RL stock portfolio management software you'll feel quite at home.


Accessing the exchange

Go to this location. It points to a page with some instructions, a listing of features but most of all, with a link to the actual front end. That's it. The current iteration is entirely teller based so you don't need to enter credentials or anything.


The Overview tab

As soon as you start the exchange you'll see a "quick glance" screen called Overview. It lets you gauge how all the funds (securities) are doing at the moment of the last update. Last update is an important concept, each security comes with such a property.

The following screenshot shows numbers associated to the various visible objects. Most are repeated all through the other screens, so you just need to learn them once. There's a series of rows, each shows a different security.

1) Symbol: stock-alike security ticker, your fund(s) are quickly identified by this acronym. The exchange supports other securities that might be added in the future. It's just the familiar ESYFND / MINBSK etc. tickers.

2) Type: this tells the kind of security. Of course as of now we only have funds so that's what you'll see.

3) Issuer: corporation ticker of who issued the securities. In case other players will want to list their stocks, this will tell whose corp those stocks are.

4) Bid: this is the top buy order's price. In EvE this would be just the top buy order. When you dump shares to buy orders, it's the price you'll get. The RL orders who act like this are called "market orders".

5) Ask: this is the lowest sell order's price. In EvE this would be just the price you'll pay for directly buying from the market. The RL orders who act like this are called "market orders".

6) Change: this is the price change since the last day / session.

7) Updated: date and time of last security listing update. A security that last traded one week ago will show a week old time stamp.

8) Name: the full or "friendly" name of the fund / security.

9) Description: short text detailing what the fund / security is about.

10) Service message: tells the current exchange status. In fact it's not always open or operating since it's based on me half manually managing the transactions.


The Easy Fund tab

This and all the remaining tabs are the detail view and order form for a specific fund (security).
Easy Fund Investors will of course want to use this tab, MINBSK Investors will use the Minerals Fund tab and so on.
All the Investors should read these instructions since most concepts are re-used through all the other tabs.

The window is divided in panes. Feel free to ignore anything else, some features like Excel charting are not supported by Google Docs so just skip those.
Don't get scared by the initial impression, you can ignore most of that stuff!

As shown on this screenshot, there are three main panes:

a) General fund (security) details. If you want things the simplest way, you may usually ignore it. I will write instructions about this at the end of the instructions.

b) Orders book. ESYFND Investors may ignore it as well.

c) Order form. This is the pane you want to check out, you need it to buy or sell your shares.

Let's see this order form in detail by looking at this screenshot.

1) Symbol: just the fund / security ticker. Basically "ESYFND" again.

2) Operation: BUY is the row to use to buy shares. Sell is the row to use in order to sell shares.

3) Order type: ESYFND Investors only use MARKET orders, that is immediate buy or sale of shares. You may basically ignore this.

4) Price: this is the current shares price. ESYFND Investors will notice how both buy and sell price is the same. This is also why they may safely ignore the Orders Book, ESYFND is a no-hassle approach to investing.

5) Quantity: this is where to specity how many shares to buy or sell.

6) Expiration: you may ignore this.

7) Order ID: This is a very important field! This is the tracking order number for whatever you do. You will receive this number as reply of your operations, it's your receipt and only reference you can use to fix possible issues.

8) Fees: this is the sum of fund and broker transaction fees (if any). The IPO original post and the Vahrokh.com VEMEX page show where to find information about those. They are also stated on the General fund (security) details pane above.
VEMEX generally won't charge for buy operations.

9) Total: this is the final amount to send to the exchange (buy operations) or the amount you'll receive (sell operations). See the end of this document for very important details about pricing in a dynamically changing market. At the bottom of this column there's a total. Purchases are indicated with a negative, red number (they reduce your money), sales with a positive, green number. If you have a mix of buy and sell operations you only need to send this total (if in red), in fact sell operations effectively reduce the amount to send.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#158 - 2012-10-30 01:00:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
How to send your orders

1) Copy the relevant row(s) text in an EvE-mail. You don't need to copy the numbers under "ISK to send or receive".
Example:

ESYFND SELL MARKET 1,000,000.00 1 GTC 0

2) Then alter the quantity for the wanted amount.
Example:

ESYFND SELL MARKET 1,000,000.00 15 GTC 0

3) If you are buying, send the ISK stated in the "Total" cell (15M in this case) to VEMEX / Vahrokh's EvE's Merchantile Exchange.
If possible, put a description like: "ESYFND SELL order".

4) Then send an EvE-Mail to VEMEX Monica (the teller) with the text stated at point 2.


Once the mail has been sent, I'll process it (it might take a while, I have a life).
As reply, you'll get another email with your order number (you don't really need it for ESYFND operations except if problems arise) and the updated number of shares in your possession.

If you sold, you'll get ISK sent to you instead.
That's it.

For quite important additional informations about prices please check the end of this manual ("The issue with moving markets prices").

Nota bene: there's an additional consideration to be said about ESYFND: when the fund is capped, it's impossible to buy new shares, any buy orders will be ignored.
The amount of available shares for purchase is stated in the Order Book to the right. If under "ASK" the yellow row (Orders) says zero, then there is a cap being enforced and no shares are available for purchase.


How are share prices determined

ESYFND as open end fund follows the standard pricing: share price = NAV / number of outstanding shares.


The Minerals / Ices / T2 / PI Fund tabs

The other funds windows are simliar to the ESYFND one, but with more options.

Looking at this screenshot, it's possible to see the same basic structure, except a larger Orders Book and Order form.

The Order Book represents a so called "Depth Of Market" (DOM) view (a feature some times charged a premium in RL markets or not available at all). It's functionally similar to the EvE market orders window.
The upper (green) part represents the sell orders, the lower (red) part show the buy orders, including up to 10 entries. The prices are placed exactly like in the EvE window and work the same. The quantity colum, unsurprisingly enough, represents the amount of available shares for each price level.

The Order Form, is similar to the ESYFND one but with more rows.
For a way better functionality I strongly suggest downloading the VEMEX frontend as Excel / Open Office file. This way you'll be able to use combo boxes, auto-calculating fields and much more.

The first two (identical to ESYFND) are two ready-to-use templates you can use exactly as explained in the ESYFND section.
The remaining rows show so called "BUY STOP" orders (but you can replace BUY with SELL). These orders are like the EvE Advanced buy / sell order window, that is you can setup orders that (unlike the MARKET orders) will be executed at a later time, when the market hits their setup price.
In order to setup a STOP order all you have to do is the same explained for the ESYFND except you have to input your preferred price instead of the default. Then you send the order and wait for the trade to happen.

If you see your order is not getting filled, you can move it up or down. Unlike EvE, RL markets let traders move orders for free (this is why high frequency automated trading is possible) and therefore you'll also have the same freedom.

Thus, like in RL markets you end up paying more per transaction but nothing for moving the orders.

If you want to move your order, you have to put CHANGE in place of BUY / SELL. In the price field you place the new price, in the order number field (VERY IMPORTANT!!) you must type the tracking order number you received when you setup the buy / sell order.

If you want to completely cancel the order, just put CANCEL in place of BUY / SELL and type the tracking order number as shown above.
If you downloaded the frontend as Excel file, all of these operations will autocalculate values, switch shown options and so on.
Here is a screenshot of the various options.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#159 - 2012-10-30 01:01:20 UTC
The Details pane

The pane at the top of the various securities windows contains a lot of informations about the securities themselves. Most are fairly intuitive, several are the same information shown on the general overview.

1) Symbol: the security (fund) ticker, also shown on the overview.
2) NEISIN: the security (fund) NEISIN code, used for history search purposes. For more information about ISINs and their EvE counterpart (NEISIN) please refer to this thread.
3) NAV (Net Assets Value): it's the total value of the currently viewed fund.
4) Face value: shares value when the fund launched.
5) Outstanding: total amount of issued shares.
6) Book Value: the current share value. For open ended funds like ESYFND it's equal to NAV / outstanding, for closed end funds it's the current share market price.
7) Name: security (fund) name, also shown on the overview.
8) Description: short security (fund) description, also shown on the overview.
9) Last price match: price hit during the last transaction.
10) Last updated: the date and time this security quotes have been updated, also shown on the overview.
11) Bid: current bid price (the highest buy order), also shown on the overview.
12) Ask: current ask price (the lowest sell order), also shown on the overview.
13) High: highest price for the current session.
14) Low: the lowest price for the current session.
15) Issuer: corporation ticker of who issued the securities, also shown on the overview.
16) Dividend frequency: how often dividends are issued.
17) Purchase fee: exchange fee on purchase operations, per each share value.
18) Sale fee: exchange fee on sale operations, per each share value.
19) Redemption fee: how much redeeming a share will cost, per each share value. It's very low for open ended funds, high for closed end funds. In RL it's not even possible to redeem closed end funds shares.
20) Management fee: how much the fund manager will take, measured on the plusvalence (if any).
21) Frond load: how much the fund charges per purchase operation (it's on the fund side, not an exchange fee).
22) Deferred load: how much the fund charges per sale operation.
23) VEMEX management message: fund specific message from the management.


The issue with moving markets prices

The exchange operations are processed as a FIFO queue (also used in RL).
It's entirely possible that when you send an order (any kind), someone else will have taken that order before you and thus your order won't find a fill at your desired price.

Example:
There are MINBSK shares at 1,039,012.01 and 1,039,013.99. You buy 5 of them but somebody else bid on 3 of them before you.
If you sent ISK for the exact 1,039,012.01 value, you'll get 2 shares for 1,039,012.01, 2 for 1,039,013.99 and ISK given back for the last share (not enough sent money left to buy it at the higher price).


There are two solutions for this:

1) Send more ISK than needed. I.e. if you send 10-15 percent excess ISK, you'll get the shares and the unspent ISK back.

2) Open a trading account with VEMEX. To do this, just send some ISK to VEMEX with description: "Open trading account".
From now on, you won't need to send ISK for every buy / sell operation, the ISK will be taken from the account, the sales ISK will go to that account.
At a later day you may eve-mail VEMEX with a "Withdraw NNNN" or "Close trading account".

NOTA BENE: accounts with no transactions for a long time will be flagged as abandoned and closed. ISK will be sent to the account owner.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#160 - 2012-10-30 08:36:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Confirming receipt of the following reservations:

Samroski as Market Maker
Graygor => Sent back the double ISK you sent.
Huttan Funaila
Rebecca Cairn
Irken Slushk as Market Maker
Dean Ozuwara
Rhat Dakota
Val'Dore on behalf of PlanetCorp InterStellar
Elegbara
Jadun
Towaoc
Vargan Armer
Amallya Trueshot
Grombutz
Grendell
TornSoul
Nanatoa


The following Investors have up to October 31st 23:59:59 EvE time to send ISK (else their reservation will be taken over by the next Investors in queue):

V'en
Kama Sutramax
Mortimer Montague
Ford Chicago
Seth Quantix



Important: on November 2 after down time, the reservations are free for all, who will post here will get the spot in a first come - first served way.