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The nightmare.....tell me about it
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irishFour
Almost Dangerous
#1 - 2012-10-26 14:48:18 UTC
A corpie of mine was asking about the nightmare for pve. Ive never shot a laser, i don't know anything about the nightmare.
Playing around on eft, its not a challenge to get it over 1100 dps with some faction damage mods and implants.

I use a mach, its great, and i got into it because everyone on the forums rage about how awesome it is. Why dont they rage about the nightmare. More dps, similar skill requirements, a little different optimal and fall off.

Does it have tracking issues, tank issues, ability to actually apply the dps issues?
Should i eventually cross train for it?

Tell me what you know
irish

I like to have my cake and eat it too
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#2 - 2012-10-26 14:51:00 UTC
The Nightmare does have cap issues. Also, people love the machariel and have a massive hard on for projectiles. Shame they're mostly ignorant of falloff mechanics, otherwise they WOULD be raving about the Nightmare.

Projectiles get WAY more credit than they are actually due. EFT warriors love them.
illirdor
Upper Class Goat
#3 - 2012-10-26 15:01:31 UTC
Tachs ! its one of the ships that can fit a full rack of tahcs t2 without gimping the fit.. my corp fly them alot in a spidertank setup wich is cap stable :) its an amazing ship :)

Soooo this is my sig.... 
Kasutra
No Vacancies
No Vacancies.
#4 - 2012-10-26 15:02:25 UTC
It also has the Amarr damage type issue. The Mach doesn't really suck vs. any of the large rat factions, the Nightmare is less universally applicable and thus gets mentioned in fewer forum discussions.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#5 - 2012-10-26 15:05:44 UTC
Kasutra wrote:
It also has the Amarr damage type issue. The Mach doesn't really suck vs. any of the large rat factions, the Nightmare is less universally applicable and thus gets mentioned in fewer forum discussions.


The only rats that aren't weak to either EM or Thermal are Angels, which the Machariel will kill nicely. Amarr damage types are fine.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-10-26 15:06:02 UTC
the down sides of the nightmare are almost no damage selection, bad capacitor, and the fact that it is about as fast and agile as a freighter. aside from that it's pretty badass.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Chris Slayter
Perdition
#7 - 2012-10-26 15:06:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Chris Slayter
Something worth to mention is that the Nightmare is limited to the EM/Therm damage that comes with the laser turrets it uses.
Hands down, the Nightmare is king of Amarr-space missioning, but the Mach brings more variety of ammo to the fight.

Edit: Daniel beat me to it, guess I need to be faster next time :)
Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
#8 - 2012-10-26 15:39:15 UTC
Nobody notices a Mach anymore, but the mare turns heads and still gets WTFolades.

Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.

I invented Tiericide
Ginger Barbarella
#9 - 2012-10-26 15:50:09 UTC
irishFour wrote:
A corpie of mine was asking about the nightmare for pve. Ive never shot a laser, i don't know anything about the nightmare.
Playing around on eft, its not a challenge to get it over 1100 dps with some faction damage mods and implants.

I use a mach, its great, and i got into it because everyone on the forums rage about how awesome it is. Why dont they rage about the nightmare. More dps, similar skill requirements, a little different optimal and fall off.

Does it have tracking issues, tank issues, ability to actually apply the dps issues?
Should i eventually cross train for it?

Tell me what you know
irish


Nightmare KILLS in Amarr missions. Sucks in Minmatar. :(

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Ginger Barbarella
#10 - 2012-10-26 15:51:03 UTC
Val'Dore wrote:
Nobody notices a Mach anymore, but the mare turns heads and still gets WTFolades.


Got both, considering dumping the Mach. Really like the Nightmare, but it's uses are limited now that I've moved to Minnie space.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Arcosian
Arcosian Heavy Industries Corp Holding
#11 - 2012-10-26 16:02:34 UTC
The nightmare is awesome. What makes it awesome you ask?

#1 Easy to get 1000+dps to well over 50km
#2 Great damage projection
#3 Faction crystals are pretty cheap and last forever. Best of all you only need 4 at a time rather than the LOL # for mach
#4 Easy to fit an 800 dps tank against sansha/BR
#5 Tracking of .05...with tachs o.O
#6 Has spikey bits to impale corpses on Pirate

Down sides:
#1 Only Em/Therm damage which really isn't a problem if you (and you should) mission in amarr space.
#2 High end fit needs a cap booster (not really an issue as I hardly use it in L4)
#3 5% hardwires really make it shine
#4 Tach fits really don't let you fit a prop mod but you really don't need one for missions.

Remarks:
As long as you mission in amarr space it will be king of PVE. Don't use pulse lasers for missions.
irishFour
Almost Dangerous
#12 - 2012-10-26 16:04:29 UTC
Arcosian wrote:
The nightmare is awesome. What makes it awesome you ask?

#1 Easy to get 1000+dps to well over 50km
#2 Great damage projection
#3 Faction crystals are pretty cheap and last forever. Best of all you only need 4 at a time rather than the LOL # for mach
#4 Easy to fit an 800 dps tank against sansha/BR
#5 Tracking of .05...with tachs o.O
#6 Has spikey bits to impale corpses on Pirate

Down sides:
#1 Only Em/Therm damage which really isn't a problem if you (and you should) mission in amarr space.
#2 High end fit needs a cap booster (not really an issue as I hardly use it in L4)
#3 5% hardwires really make it shine
#4 Tach fits really don't let you fit a prop mod but you really don't need one for missions.

Remarks:
As long as you mission in amarr space it will be king of PVE. Don't use pulse lasers for missions.



What about drone hordes
What about it being the team mate for an archon or thanny while running anoms?

I like to have my cake and eat it too
Arazel Chainfire
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2012-10-26 16:09:57 UTC
irishFour wrote:
Arcosian wrote:
The nightmare is awesome. What makes it awesome you ask?

#1 Easy to get 1000+dps to well over 50km
#2 Great damage projection
#3 Faction crystals are pretty cheap and last forever. Best of all you only need 4 at a time rather than the LOL # for mach
#4 Easy to fit an 800 dps tank against sansha/BR
#5 Tracking of .05...with tachs o.O
#6 Has spikey bits to impale corpses on Pirate

Down sides:
#1 Only Em/Therm damage which really isn't a problem if you (and you should) mission in amarr space.
#2 High end fit needs a cap booster (not really an issue as I hardly use it in L4)
#3 5% hardwires really make it shine
#4 Tach fits really don't let you fit a prop mod but you really don't need one for missions.

Remarks:
As long as you mission in amarr space it will be king of PVE. Don't use pulse lasers for missions.



What about drone hordes
What about it being the team mate for an archon or thanny while running anoms?


Dunno about drone hordes, as the last time I was in drone space was before anoms came out. But for other spaces, you might do better with a different ship if you're teaming with a thanny/archon. That does depend though on whether the carrier is using fighters or sentries. If fighters, you want to have something like a legion to swat all the smaller ships. If using sentries, again you want something more like the legion so you can just assist the drones and not worry about actually having to lock things with the carrier's abysmal locking time.

Not saying the nightmare is bad... but it doesn't really compliment a carrier well...

-Arazel
Arcosian
Arcosian Heavy Industries Corp Holding
#14 - 2012-10-26 16:10:55 UTC
From what I've heard it doesn't have a problem with them. Lots of people seem to use paladin/NM for drone anoms. And if you are using a carrier you could probably drop some of the tank/cap mods on the NM and fit more DPS and just RR/cap transfer what you need.

But pirate/T2 BS aren't very insurable unlike another carrier would be. And a high end NM fit will probably run about the same cost as a T2 fit carrier.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#15 - 2012-10-26 16:20:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Paikis wrote:
Kasutra wrote:
It also has the Amarr damage type issue. The Mach doesn't really suck vs. any of the large rat factions, the Nightmare is less universally applicable and thus gets mentioned in fewer forum discussions.
The only rats that aren't weak to either EM or Thermal are Angels, which the Machariel will kill nicely. Amarr damage types are fine.
It's pretty horrid against Guristas and Serpentis as well, since they have high EM resists and thermal only as their second highest. Yes, you can dish out a fair amount of damage, but going for second and fourth damage type (with a heavy bias towards the latter) isn't as nice as going for first and second or second and third, which blasters and projectiles let you do.

…on the other hand, the damage projection of large lasers (especially Tachs) will outweigh that at longer ranges. Still, that leaves 3 out of 7 (or 5 out 12 if you count all kinds of anti-faction missions) where it'll do very nasty things to its environment. P
mecandbuttons
Red Bush Tea Guild
#16 - 2012-10-26 17:29:51 UTC
Irish,

I tried it out in a horde. It was actually not bad. I dont have all the skills at 5 for it and it still did pretty good on the test run. If you wanna try it out let me know.
Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
#17 - 2012-10-26 18:04:22 UTC
Paikis wrote:
Kasutra wrote:
It also has the Amarr damage type issue. The Mach doesn't really suck vs. any of the large rat factions, the Nightmare is less universally applicable and thus gets mentioned in fewer forum discussions.


The only rats that aren't weak to either EM or Thermal are Angels, which the Machariel will kill nicely. Amarr damage types are fine.

Guristas are horrible with a Nightmare - as are certain rogue drones (those with "standard" resists and lots of armour). At least compared to the joy of melting Blood Raiders, Sansha and the rest of the Rogue Drones.

That being said the 'mare is a fantastic ship in the right type of mission - Tachyon range and the volley damage are a significant factor in that.
If you're running that type of mission then it's almost certain that a Nightmare will be more efficient than a Mach... but if you're mostly against Guristas, Angels and so forth then you're probably better off with something else.
Exploited Engineer
Creatively Applied Violence Inc.
#18 - 2012-10-26 18:45:40 UTC
irishFour wrote:
I use a mach, its great, and i got into it because everyone on the forums rage about how awesome it is. Why dont they rage about the nightmare. More dps, similar skill requirements, a little different optimal and fall off.


It's big, it's slow, and except for rogue drones, it either has tanking issues or npc resistance issues.

However, for just sitting there and blowing things (preferably rogue drones, Sansha ships or Blood raider ships) to space dust, it works great.

It is, however, completely different from the Machariel. The Machariel is fast and lives by having selectable damage types, while the Nightmare is slow as a snail and never requires you to think about damage types. Just load faction multifrequency crystals, select your target, and vaporize it.
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba
Crunchy Crunchy
#19 - 2012-10-26 20:30:34 UTC
It's awesome unless...

  • You don't fit a prop mod.
  • You don't fit Tachs.
  • You don't fit cap booster.

    • If when thinking fit you think cap stable it is not for you.
    bufnitza calatoare
    #20 - 2012-10-27 10:00:07 UTC
    for over two years I use a nightmare for amarr region based missions.
    did the job nicely.

    now I use it for drone hordes and its wonderful.

    my other char flies a mach so each in their own element they rock . altho the mach eats ammo like pacman eats yellow dots
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