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NPC vs NPC combat
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Kiela Paine
Paine Corporation
#1 - 2012-10-19 01:15:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Kiela Paine
Hey everyone

I just thought of something...

How awesome would it be to have NPC vs NPC combat? For example, you might jump through a gate in FW space and find Republic Fleet NPCs fighting Imperial Navy NPCs. Or maybe Blood Raiders out in Kor-Azor low sec attacking a small caravan of merchants and their armed escorts in the orbit of a large gas giant.

Or just about anything else you could think of. This would do wonders for the game's immersion factor. Yeah?

What do you think?
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#2 - 2012-10-19 01:21:14 UTC
Kiela Paine wrote:
Hey everyone

I just thought of something...

How awesome would it be to have NPC vs NPC combat? For example, you might jump through a gate in FW space and find Republic Fleet NPCs fighting Imperial Navy NPCs. Or maybe Blood Raiders out in Kor-Azor low sec attacking a small caravan of merchants and their armed escorts in the orbit of a large gas giant.

Or just about anything else you could think of. This would do wonders for the game's Immusion factor. Yeah?

What do you think?



I think it would just be annoying gameplay wise..

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Angeal MacNova
Holefood Inc.
Warriors of the Blood God
#3 - 2012-10-19 01:22:52 UTC
If done correctly, it could certainly add life to the game world.

http://www.projectvaulderie.com/goodnight-sweet-prince/

http://www.projectvaulderie.com/the-untold-story/

CCP's true, butthurt, colors.

Because those who can't do themselves keep others from doing too.
Kiela Paine
Paine Corporation
#4 - 2012-10-19 01:22:55 UTC
Oh yeah? Why do you say that, Garviel?
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#5 - 2012-10-19 01:31:49 UTC
just clutter..

And i dislike all NPC's in eve so..

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#6 - 2012-10-19 02:29:13 UTC
I have to agree with Garviel. I'm more interested in what the players are doing, not the NPCs.

It also creates a problem particular to Faction Warfare... where if one faction's NPCs "win" then they effectively give the edge to any player belonging to that faction.
This creates a situation similar to that with FW plexes... where the enemy is not very likely to warp in to a plex filled with your faction's NPCs... at least, not without a lot of friends and/or firepower backing him/her up.

How did you Veterans start?
Aglais
Ice-Storm
#7 - 2012-10-19 02:55:17 UTC
Honestly, I do think it'd add a vast deal to the immersion of the game. What would be interesting would be kind of Guildwars 2 style open events, where how they're dealt with influences the nature of the followups if there is one. As an example, a Minmatar terrorist and his/her gang of thugs appears out of Ammatar space and starts trying to make their way to the nearest major Amarr settlement to do some sort of damage, and it'd be up to a combination of NPCs and capsuleers to prevent this from happening. If successful then a decent sum of ISK is rewarded, and probably also some LP depending on who you help.

It must be stressed though that capsuleer involvement is to be encouraged. If there's nobody doing these it's just NPCs wasting ammunition on other NPCs near gates, and while visually impressive to some, it doesn't really serve much of a greater purpose. If something like this is ever attempted it'd need to be done right.
Hazen Koraka
HK Enterprises
#8 - 2012-10-19 07:46:11 UTC
Kiela Paine wrote:
Hey everyone

I just thought of something...

How awesome would it be to have NPC vs NPC combat? For example, you might jump through a gate in FW space and find Republic Fleet NPCs fighting Imperial Navy NPCs. Or maybe Blood Raiders out in Kor-Azor low sec attacking a small caravan of merchants and their armed escorts in the orbit of a large gas giant.

Or just about anything else you could think of. This would do wonders for the game's Immusion factor. Yeah?

What do you think?


What's immusion? :D Is this a new patch feature I missed?

But seriously, yeah would add some life I think but who gets the bounties Shocked

Exploration is Random. Random is Random... or is it?! http://docs.python.org/2/library/random.html
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#9 - 2012-10-19 18:49:14 UTC
Hazen Koraka wrote:
Kiela Paine wrote:
Hey everyone

I just thought of something...

How awesome would it be to have NPC vs NPC combat? For example, you might jump through a gate in FW space and find Republic Fleet NPCs fighting Imperial Navy NPCs. Or maybe Blood Raiders out in Kor-Azor low sec attacking a small caravan of merchants and their armed escorts in the orbit of a large gas giant.

Or just about anything else you could think of. This would do wonders for the game's Immusion factor. Yeah?

What do you think?


What's immusion? :D Is this a new patch feature I missed?

But seriously, yeah would add some life I think but who gets the bounties Shocked


FW Ships don't have bounties... they have tags.... If you collect them, you get them...

I actually really like that incursion systems (at least in nullsec and lowsec) have gate camps to catch people traveling through... and they aren't all just pitiful irrelevant gate camps, but gate camps that WILL catch and kill your ship (I've lost fleet inties that couldn't cold warp before getting tackled, and I've had corp mates lose tanked drakes that couldn't tank the sansha dps long enough to MWD back to the gate!).

I think some FW NPC vs NPC fights, where they will also target hostile militia, would be kind of interesting and immersive...

It shouldn't happen often though...
Kiela Paine
Paine Corporation
#10 - 2012-10-21 10:27:05 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Hazen Koraka wrote:
Kiela Paine wrote:
Hey everyone

I just thought of something...

How awesome would it be to have NPC vs NPC combat? For example, you might jump through a gate in FW space and find Republic Fleet NPCs fighting Imperial Navy NPCs. Or maybe Blood Raiders out in Kor-Azor low sec attacking a small caravan of merchants and their armed escorts in the orbit of a large gas giant.

Or just about anything else you could think of. This would do wonders for the game's Immusion factor. Yeah?

What do you think?


What's immusion? :D Is this a new patch feature I missed?

But seriously, yeah would add some life I think but who gets the bounties Shocked


FW Ships don't have bounties... they have tags.... If you collect them, you get them...

I actually really like that incursion systems (at least in nullsec and lowsec) have gate camps to catch people traveling through... and they aren't all just pitiful irrelevant gate camps, but gate camps that WILL catch and kill your ship (I've lost fleet inties that couldn't cold warp before getting tackled, and I've had corp mates lose tanked drakes that couldn't tank the sansha dps long enough to MWD back to the gate!).

I think some FW NPC vs NPC fights, where they will also target hostile militia, would be kind of interesting and immersive...

It shouldn't happen often though...


Agreed. Definitely not every day. It wouldn't make it as special if it was really common. And even so, the NPCs engaging NPCs don't have to be just FW ships like I mentioned in the original post. Pirates could fight Empire Navies as well... or caravans, other pirates... oh! Rogue drones too! Forgot about them.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#11 - 2012-10-22 02:01:27 UTC
this is alot of strain on the server. and this is not really a game about immersion.

players are meant to create their own immersion, so if u want a caldari vs gallente fight then u need to fleet up with ur mates and make it happen.

NPC's are frankly boring in every way except the fact that they shoot back, which is mildly stimulating at best. even incursions can be figured out so surely that ppl can make a single fleet composition and win every time.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Nestara Aldent
Citimatics
#12 - 2012-10-22 09:02:15 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
this is alot of strain on the server. and this is not really a game about immersion.

players are meant to create their own immersion, so if u want a caldari vs gallente fight then u need to fleet up with ur mates and make it happen.

NPC's are frankly boring in every way except the fact that they shoot back, which is mildly stimulating at best. even incursions can be figured out so surely that ppl can make a single fleet composition and win every time.


For some of us it is about immersion as well, and as I dont see how that can interfere with normal missions/ratting ect (just make those rats that shoot each other give no loot/bounty whatsoever), this could work.

I myself like games with immersion, and even though EVE dont try particularly hard to be such, its far better than other MMOs where someone will just dance in front of you for no reason.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#13 - 2012-10-22 12:11:47 UTC
Nestara Aldent wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
this is alot of strain on the server. and this is not really a game about immersion.

players are meant to create their own immersion, so if u want a caldari vs gallente fight then u need to fleet up with ur mates and make it happen.

NPC's are frankly boring in every way except the fact that they shoot back, which is mildly stimulating at best. even incursions can be figured out so surely that ppl can make a single fleet composition and win every time.


For some of us it is about immersion as well, and as I dont see how that can interfere with normal missions/ratting ect (just make those rats that shoot each other give no loot/bounty whatsoever), this could work.

I myself like games with immersion, and even though EVE dont try particularly hard to be such, its far better than other MMOs where someone will just dance in front of you for no reason.



Why would the NPC's only shoot each other? What if you're a member of an opposing faction.. Then it really doesn't make sense for them to leave you alone...

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#14 - 2012-10-22 14:45:30 UTC
Nestara Aldent wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
this is alot of strain on the server. and this is not really a game about immersion.

players are meant to create their own immersion, so if u want a caldari vs gallente fight then u need to fleet up with ur mates and make it happen.

NPC's are frankly boring in every way except the fact that they shoot back, which is mildly stimulating at best. even incursions can be figured out so surely that ppl can make a single fleet composition and win every time.


For some of us it is about immersion as well, and as I dont see how that can interfere with normal missions/ratting ect (just make those rats that shoot each other give no loot/bounty whatsoever), this could work.

I myself like games with immersion, and even though EVE dont try particularly hard to be such, its far better than other MMOs where someone will just dance in front of you for no reason.


sorry, i should have put NPC immersion. in eve u create ur own stories and back grounds, u make ur own factions and start ur own wars. dnt expect ppl to give it to u, u have to make it happen urself.

go into faction warfare low sec and watch the players fight each other if thats what u want, better yet join in and shoot them all.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Xideinis
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#15 - 2012-10-22 16:10:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Xideinis
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Nestara Aldent wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
this is alot of strain on the server. and this is not really a game about immersion.

players are meant to create their own immersion, so if u want a caldari vs gallente fight then u need to fleet up with ur mates and make it happen.

NPC's are frankly boring in every way except the fact that they shoot back, which is mildly stimulating at best. even incursions can be figured out so surely that ppl can make a single fleet composition and win every time.


For some of us it is about immersion as well, and as I dont see how that can interfere with normal missions/ratting ect (just make those rats that shoot each other give no loot/bounty whatsoever), this could work.

I myself like games with immersion, and even though EVE dont try particularly hard to be such, its far better than other MMOs where someone will just dance in front of you for no reason.


sorry, i should have put NPC immersion. in eve u create ur own stories and back grounds, u make ur own factions and start ur own wars. dnt expect ppl to give it to u, u have to make it happen urself.

go into faction warfare low sec and watch the players fight each other if thats what u want, better yet join in and shoot them all.


Well sure, you could go out and have a capsuleer slugfest... but not ALL of the ships out there are piloted by capsuleers. In fact, most of them are piloted by regular human beings. Empire navies, pirate ships, trade convoys... all of that is manned by a crew of non-capsuleer individuals, except for the rare occasion. I'm pretty sure that's what people are getting at here.

"Immersionists," we'll call them, simply want the game to be more realistic. Realistically, there would be fights between fleets with ships crewed by non-immortal individuals.

And of course you make your own story. But adding to the immersion factor of EVE by adding in NPC vs NPC combat would make it easier for you to add to your story. It would only enhance your experience when done correctly.
Ivanov Pava
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2012-10-22 17:01:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Ivanov Pava
I agree that is a good idea, and I agree that it should be done properly if done at all. I also think that NPCs shouldn't (necessarily) "drop" things when blown to hell by other NPCs. Hmm, unless some scenerio could be spun from something like that, whatever, maybe the game-designers can get creative with that, ya know.

Ya know, all games can be about immersion, and games tend to be better when they are more immersive and engrossing.

Yeah, that would be kinda cool to like maybe enter an area of Space and see some Spatial battle like already in-progress. Perhaps you could then jump into the fight, all guns blazing. OR perhaps you could "watch the show" as such from a safe distance, assuming any particular distance would be safe enough LOL

But, say, you're watching this (maybe you're not sure what to make of the fight, maybe you don't wanna "get involved", maybe don't wanna get in the middle of someone else's fight, or maybe you just like the pretty GFX, whatever), and maybe the fight comes to a close with maybe an ememy or other hostile winning that one...and then maybe, if they catch sight of you, commence to come after YOU. Holy hell! Better put up a fight, or better hyperjump your ass outta there, QUICK, or you're dead!...

Yeah, lotsa, lotsa of a myriad of new possibilites there! Yep, I like the idea--I think it's a good idea!
NEONOVUS
Mindstar Technology
Goonswarm Federation
#17 - 2012-10-22 19:11:17 UTC
As stated the basics of this exist, incursion camps(would it ever be fun to have a probability of these on all lowsec gates.) and intersystem station convoys, and even belt rats.
What would be fun is to expand them, having belt rats start going on stations and gates, like some of the Caldari Cosmos areas.
The convoys appearing more reguarly and "crossing systems" (they disappear in one and appear in another)
But really the Best ones would be the NPC navies in FW space.
They really need to be doing something actively.
Right now it just seems it should be called Capsulveers, fighters of the rulers!
People protest against saying that they shouldnt have to fight npcs but given the upcoming changes there should be much fewer complaints of needing different fits.
This could easily be combined with the idea of faction battlefleets appearing in opposite faction held systems.
This would definitely make the game more involving- in the good way, not the must click cloak button every 5 minutes or be found afking