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Duality Open Period - 19/10 to 23/10

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CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2012-10-17 13:13:54 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Gangleri
This weekend Duality will be coming back online with a focus of testing the new NPC changes.


  • Duality will be online starting Friday October 19th.
  • It should be online by 13:00
  • Duality will remain online until the morning of Tuesday October 23rd.
  • If you are going to be on Duality join the chat channel Duality. I will be in that channel offering any support I can for people testing, answering questions, and testing myself. If you need to be moved I will be happy to help you from that channel while I am online.


HOW TO CONNECT TO DUALITY:

Copy your main Eve install to a different folder.
Then create a shortcut to that folder's launcher (eve.exe).
Right click on that shortcut on the desktop, go into "Properties" and in the "Target" field put a space after the last entry in the field and type /server:87.237.38.60 to force the launcher to point towards Duality.
Once you run that shortcut the launcher will download the most recent patch for Duality and get you ready to connect.

If your account doesn't work, post in this thread to have it reactivated

WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO TEST?

The focus of the testing will be on the AI changes that Team Five 0 have made. That said, there are some other changes by teams that you can feel free to give feedback on. I will list these below and link feedback threads to them as they come up. Please note that the features below are the only ones that we will be accepting feedback on at this time. Other features in the client (such as bounty hunting, or new ships) are not in a sufficiently testable state at this time and we will not accept any feedback on them in their current state. Rest assured that these will appear publically testable in sufficient time for your feedback to matter.

Team Five 0 - AI Changes. This is the main focus of this testing period
Team Superfriends - Module changes. These will have a focused test at a time TBC. (This has been cancelled at the request of the team)
Team Gridlock - Fleet Hangar changes
Team Game of Drones - Unified Inventory changes
Team Pony Express - HUD changes

MASS TEST!

On top of this we would like to run a mass test on Monday, October 22nd, at 14:00 EVE time. During this time we would like to test the performance impact of the new AI having been applied to everything. For details about this mass test, see FoxFour's thread here

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#2 - 2012-10-17 14:11:58 UTC
Quick question - does this build on Duality include the new ship balancing changes and features that were tested before? or ONLY the items listed above?

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#3 - 2012-10-17 14:28:11 UTC
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
Quick question - does this build on Duality include the new ship balancing changes and features that were tested before? or ONLY the items listed above?


Stuff that was there before is still there. Please note that we are not accepting feedback on them at this time.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
chaosjj
Doomheim
#4 - 2012-10-17 17:57:08 UTC
Will the new destroyers be available in some manner?
CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#5 - 2012-10-17 18:20:23 UTC
chaosjj wrote:
Will the new destroyers be available in some manner?


No. Please see above.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#6 - 2012-10-18 01:06:38 UTC
CCP Goliath wrote:


  • If you are going to be on Duality join the chat channel Duality. I will be in that channel offering any support I can for people testing, answering questions, and testing myself. If you need to be moved I will be happy to help you from that channel while I am online.


WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO TEST?
...
Team Pony Express - HUD changes



would i be able to ask rather specific questions on how the Overview works in relation to HUD UI and such things (and possibly get a decent answer...) ?
CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#7 - 2012-10-18 10:08:35 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:


  • If you are going to be on Duality join the chat channel Duality. I will be in that channel offering any support I can for people testing, answering questions, and testing myself. If you need to be moved I will be happy to help you from that channel while I am online.


WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO TEST?
...
Team Pony Express - HUD changes



would i be able to ask rather specific questions on how the Overview works in relation to HUD UI and such things (and possibly get a decent answer...) ?


We'd really rather you got on the server and tried it out for yourself. These would be the best ways to get answers to your questions.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#8 - 2012-10-18 14:55:10 UTC
CCP Goliath wrote:
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:


  • If you are going to be on Duality join the chat channel Duality. I will be in that channel offering any support I can for people testing, answering questions, and testing myself. If you need to be moved I will be happy to help you from that channel while I am online.


WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO TEST?
...
Team Pony Express - HUD changes



would i be able to ask rather specific questions on how the Overview works in relation to HUD UI and such things (and possibly get a decent answer...) ?


We'd really rather you got on the server and tried it out for yourself. These would be the best ways to get answers to your questions.


ohh of course, i intend to do so! i meant in the duality chat on friday =)
CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#9 - 2012-10-18 15:05:05 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:


  • If you are going to be on Duality join the chat channel Duality. I will be in that channel offering any support I can for people testing, answering questions, and testing myself. If you need to be moved I will be happy to help you from that channel while I am online.


WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO TEST?
...
Team Pony Express - HUD changes



would i be able to ask rather specific questions on how the Overview works in relation to HUD UI and such things (and possibly get a decent answer...) ?


We'd really rather you got on the server and tried it out for yourself. These would be the best ways to get answers to your questions.


ohh of course, i intend to do so! i meant in the duality chat on friday =)


Pretty much all of the development team are out-of-office tomorrow, so I wouldn't bank on getting answers in a live context. Forums is the best place for questions Big smile

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#10 - 2012-10-18 15:19:16 UTC
4 days...that's it...so sad.

I predicted this a thread about 5 days ago, that you would have an extremely short window for AI testing, but this is a complete joke.

There are hundreds of missions to be tested at all levels, and it is impossible to test them all in that time.
I could spend 12 hours / day testing and not even scratch the surface of the Level IV's.

Just more proof of the "kill high sec" agenda within CCP.
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#11 - 2012-10-18 15:25:05 UTC
CCP Goliath wrote:


Pretty much all of the development team are out-of-office tomorrow, so I wouldn't bank on getting answers in a live context. Forums is the best place for questions Big smile


ahh i see! well in that case ill prob start a thread in F&I section and pray to the dev gods that someone swings by and looks at it!

:S
CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#12 - 2012-10-18 15:25:43 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
4 days...that's it...so sad.

I predicted this a thread about 5 days ago, that you would have an extremely short window for AI testing, but this is a complete joke.

There are hundreds of missions to be tested at all levels, and it is impossible to test them all in that time.
I could spend 12 hours / day testing and not even scratch the surface of the Level IV's.

Just more proof of the "kill high sec" agenda within CCP.


Your last comment is a farce. As for the rest of the post, noone tests "everything", as it's impractical and wasteful. You test a sample size and use logic to extend the virtues or failures of that test onto like features/areas. For the purposes of AI, with a few exceptions, one level 4 mission is exactly the same as the rest. This has been extensively tested in house and we're broadening the scope to get player feedback and pick up edge cases.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#13 - 2012-10-18 15:26:41 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:


Pretty much all of the development team are out-of-office tomorrow, so I wouldn't bank on getting answers in a live context. Forums is the best place for questions Big smile


ahh i see! well in that case ill prob start a thread in F&I section and pray to the dev gods that someone swings by and looks at it!

:S


The dedicated feedback threads that the teams create, or this thread, is the place for questions about stuff on test servers. F&I is more for stuff that hasn't been conceived of yet, let alone in a testable state.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#14 - 2012-10-18 15:51:34 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
4 days...that's it...so sad.

I predicted this a thread about 5 days ago, that you would have an extremely short window for AI testing, but this is a complete joke.

There are hundreds of missions to be tested at all levels, and it is impossible to test them all in that time.
I could spend 12 hours / day testing and not even scratch the surface of the Level IV's.

Just more proof of the "kill high sec" agenda within CCP.


Do you ever get tired of that same old whiny attitude and tinfoil mantra?

I know the rest of us do, I just wondered if you ever got on your own nerves.

Go test what can be tested, collect some real data, then come back and ***** and moan some more. Until then, STFU.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#15 - 2012-10-18 15:52:33 UTC
CCP Goliath wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
4 days...that's it...so sad.

I predicted this a thread about 5 days ago, that you would have an extremely short window for AI testing, but this is a complete joke.

There are hundreds of missions to be tested at all levels, and it is impossible to test them all in that time.
I could spend 12 hours / day testing and not even scratch the surface of the Level IV's.

Just more proof of the "kill high sec" agenda within CCP.


Your last comment is a farce. As for the rest of the post, noone tests "everything", as it's impractical and wasteful. You test a sample size and use logic to extend the virtues or failures of that test onto like features/areas. For the purposes of AI, with a few exceptions, one level 4 mission is exactly the same as the rest. This has been extensively tested in house and we're broadening the scope to get player feedback and pick up edge cases.


Wow, just wow....

So Sansha Duo of Death is the same as Buzzkill.
And Mordus Headhunters is the same as any of the Recon missions.

This is a completely irreponsible post by you, and shows your complete disregard or worse, ignorance, of the hundreds of missions out there and different methods of running them.

So TQ will be the beta testing site.
I look forward to the posts starting Dec 5th.
CCP Goliath
C C P
C C P Alliance
#16 - 2012-10-18 16:00:35 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
4 days...that's it...so sad.

I predicted this a thread about 5 days ago, that you would have an extremely short window for AI testing, but this is a complete joke.

There are hundreds of missions to be tested at all levels, and it is impossible to test them all in that time.
I could spend 12 hours / day testing and not even scratch the surface of the Level IV's.

Just more proof of the "kill high sec" agenda within CCP.


Your last comment is a farce. As for the rest of the post, noone tests "everything", as it's impractical and wasteful. You test a sample size and use logic to extend the virtues or failures of that test onto like features/areas. For the purposes of AI, with a few exceptions, one level 4 mission is exactly the same as the rest. This has been extensively tested in house and we're broadening the scope to get player feedback and pick up edge cases.


Wow, just wow....

So Sansha Duo of Death is the same as Buzzkill.
And Mordus Headhunters is the same as any of the Recon missions.

This is a completely irreponsible post by you, and shows your complete disregard or worse, ignorance, of the hundreds of missions out there and different methods of running them.

So TQ will be the beta testing site.
I look forward to the posts starting Dec 5th.


For the purposes of AI testing, the only difference between Duo of Death and Buzz-Kill is that Duo of Death has Cruise Missile Batteries. Mordus Headhunters has some interesting trigger interactions that could throw up some unexpected stuff (please see above "a few exceptions") but any other mission with odd triggers would provide basically the same information (for instance, Worlds Collide). BTW, you should try just deleting every sweeping generalisation or assumption from the end of your posts - it would make you seem a lot more reasonable.

CCP Goliath | QA Director | EVE Illuminati | @CCP_Goliath
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#17 - 2012-10-18 16:16:20 UTC
Constructive feedback is a difficult concept for some...

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2012-10-18 16:25:05 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
4 days...that's it...so sad.

I predicted this a thread about 5 days ago, that you would have an extremely short window for AI testing, but this is a complete joke.

There are hundreds of missions to be tested at all levels, and it is impossible to test them all in that time.
I could spend 12 hours / day testing and not even scratch the surface of the Level IV's.

Just more proof of the "kill high sec" agenda within CCP.


It's obvious that you're not a developer or QA tester in real life (or if you are, you're a ****-poor one).

They don't have to test every single mission. You write your test scripts so that all of your new code gets touched, so in this case, that all of the features of the new AI are tried out. It might take 1 mission, it might take 20, but it certainly won't take "hundreds".

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#19 - 2012-10-18 16:33:39 UTC
CCP Goliath wrote:


For the purposes of AI testing, the only difference between Duo of Death and Buzz-Kill is that Duo of Death has Cruise Missile Batteries. Mordus Headhunters has some interesting trigger interactions that could throw up some unexpected stuff (please see above "a few exceptions") but any other mission with odd triggers would provide basically the same information (for instance, Worlds Collide). BTW, you should try just deleting every sweeping generalisation or assumption from the end of your posts - it would make you seem a lot more reasonable.


Sorry, you are dead wrong.

Buzzkill has multiple triggers and includes a huge number of frigs and cruisers, which orbit at ranges varying from 20km to 2500m.
Duo of Death has a single spawn of 2 Spider Drones, 4 Cruise Towers at extreme range, and 2 Battleships that orbit at 49km.

To equate the 2 missions is ridiculous.

I could see using Sentry Drones on the Cruise Missile towers and Centus Tyrants in Duo of Death, and possibly a smartbomb to take out the spider drones.
Precisely how would said Sentry Drones fare against 6 Buzzkill assault frigs orbiting at 12km from your ship? Or said smartbomb work against the same assault frigs?

To equate the methods of completing them is equally ridiculous.
To suggest that testing the AI in one of the missions allows for an extrapolation of the effectiveness of the AI for the other is ludicrous.


And as for being reasonable, I have seen how "being reasonable" works on these forums.

And I ask again, by the same logic that one mission, with few exceptions, is the same as another, does that mean if one null sec plex is tested, that is good enough? Or does null sec get a different treatment than high sec?

You know what, I have to go do some RL stuff now, and stop posting on this disaster. It is utterly pointless anyway.
The only thing that can reverse your view is a massive hue and cry on the forums post Dec 4th and if subs start dropping.

Since the sub rate may get conflated with the Dust release, no one will know for sure the true impact until March/ April.

Enjoy yet another triumph over high sec. Whether it lasts remains to be seen.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#20 - 2012-10-18 16:44:22 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:


For the purposes of AI testing, the only difference between Duo of Death and Buzz-Kill is that Duo of Death has Cruise Missile Batteries. Mordus Headhunters has some interesting trigger interactions that could throw up some unexpected stuff (please see above "a few exceptions") but any other mission with odd triggers would provide basically the same information (for instance, Worlds Collide). BTW, you should try just deleting every sweeping generalisation or assumption from the end of your posts - it would make you seem a lot more reasonable.


Sorry, you are dead wrong.

Buzzkill has multiple triggers and includes a huge number of frigs and cruisers, which orbit at ranges varying from 20km to 2500m.
Duo of Death has a single spawn of 2 Spider Drones, 4 Cruise Towers at extreme range, and 2 Battleships that orbit at 49km.

To equate the 2 missions is ridiculous.

I could see using Sentry Drones on the Cruise Missile towers and Centus Tyrants in Duo of Death, and possibly a smartbomb to take out the spider drones.
Precisely how would said Sentry Drones fare against 6 Buzzkill assault frigs orbiting at 12km from your ship? Or said smartbomb work against the same assault frigs?

To equate the methods of completing them is equally ridiculous.
To suggest that testing the AI in one of the missions allows for an extrapolation of the effectiveness of the AI for the other is ludicrous.


And as for being reasonable, I have seen how "being reasonable" works on these forums.

And I ask again, by the same logic that one mission, with few exceptions, is the same as another, does that mean if one null sec plex is tested, that is good enough? Or does null sec get a different treatment than high sec?

You know what, I have to go do some RL stuff now, and stop posting on this disaster. It is utterly pointless anyway.
The only thing that can reverse your view is a massive hue and cry on the forums post Dec 4th and if subs start dropping.

Since the sub rate may get conflated with the Dust release, no one will know for sure the true impact until March/ April.

Enjoy yet another triumph over high sec. Whether it lasts remains to be seen.


Apparently understanding what the point of the testing is, and separating it from your personal conspiracy oriented agenda, is also difficult.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
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