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Crime Watch effects on WH engagements
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Ossirrus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2012-10-14 07:36:37 UTC
Quote:
Weapons Flag: This flag is activated by using offensive modules against another player (or simply by activating certain non-targeted weapons such as smartbombs). Having this flag will prevent a character from performing actions such as jumping, docking and switching ships in space. This flag functions in all areas of space.


While Crime watch seemingly is focused on turning highsec and lowsec combat on its head, reading this portion of the Devblog raised my eyebrow a bit.

Unless im missing something this effectively prevents players from approaching a wormhole and leaving an engagement if they have fired a shot until a timer is done.

Even more disturbing is potentially losing a kill due to not being able to give chase to an enemy who has yet to fire a shot b/c you are now weapon flagged, and they jump through a wormhole to escape.

Has anybody thought about the effects this could have on Wormhole pvp?
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#2 - 2012-10-14 07:48:33 UTC
Jumping = gates.
wspace doesnt have gates.

no effect.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
unimatrix0030
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-10-14 09:04:04 UTC
Like jack said no effect, but one exception:
Attacking someone in hs and jumping back into w-space is not allowed, there they will stop you.

No local in null sec would fix everything!
seany1212
M Y S T
#4 - 2012-10-14 09:18:47 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Jumping = gates.
wspace doesnt have gates.

no effect.


"Switching ships in space"

Might cause you a few problems... Especially if you're in larger battles and manage to get your pod out when you lose a ship, depending on how CCP chose to code it, it could rule you out for the rest of the battle until aggressions gone. As always, CCP probably not thinking all aspects through.
Zyella Stormborn
Green Seekers
#5 - 2012-10-14 15:46:29 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Jumping = gates.
wspace doesnt have gates.

no effect.


"Switching ships in space"

Might cause you a few problems... Especially if you're in larger battles and manage to get your pod out when you lose a ship, depending on how CCP chose to code it, it could rule you out for the rest of the battle until aggressions gone. As always, CCP probably not thinking all aspects through.



You can switch ships from pod, just not from another ship.

There is a special Hell for people like that, Right next to child molestors, and people that talk in the theater. ~Firefly
Maggeridon Thoraz
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2012-10-14 16:06:56 UTC
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
[quote=seany1212][quote=Jack Miton]Jumping = gates.
wspace doesnt have gates.



You can switch ships from pod, just not from another ship.


the other way round would make more sense. if i wants to eject , i shoudl be able to eject but not ship with pod to other ship
seany1212
M Y S T
#7 - 2012-10-14 16:27:18 UTC
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
seany1212 wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Jumping = gates.
wspace doesnt have gates.

no effect.


"Switching ships in space"

Might cause you a few problems... Especially if you're in larger battles and manage to get your pod out when you lose a ship, depending on how CCP chose to code it, it could rule you out for the rest of the battle until aggressions gone. As always, CCP probably not thinking all aspects through.



You can switch ships from pod, just not from another ship.


Then this would be exploitable as i'd just get aggression, eject, then jump into another ship completely ruling out the 'switching ships in space' aspect. This is going to result in locking people out of battle in wormhole space. Then if CCP decide you cant eject theres going to be some very angry T3 pilots. Either way as always its CCP half thinking through an idea.
jonnykefka
Adhocracy Incorporated
Adhocracy
#8 - 2012-10-14 20:34:08 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
seany1212 wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Jumping = gates.
wspace doesnt have gates.

no effect.


"Switching ships in space"

Might cause you a few problems... Especially if you're in larger battles and manage to get your pod out when you lose a ship, depending on how CCP chose to code it, it could rule you out for the rest of the battle until aggressions gone. As always, CCP probably not thinking all aspects through.



You can switch ships from pod, just not from another ship.


Then this would be exploitable as i'd just get aggression, eject, then jump into another ship completely ruling out the 'switching ships in space' aspect. This is going to result in locking people out of battle in wormhole space. Then if CCP decide you cant eject theres going to be some very angry T3 pilots. Either way as always its CCP half thinking through an idea.


They've specified you can't eject with an active weapons flag either. T3 pilots have bitched. CCP's response was HTFU. I think CCP nailed it.

Basically, nothing changes except that you cant fast-switch between ships from an SMA if you've used an offensive module in the last 60 seconds, and likewise you can't save your SP by ejecting if you fired a weapon in the last 60 seconds. Minor alteration to a few tactics used in very specific situations. Everything else will be business as usual.
Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#9 - 2012-10-14 21:33:46 UTC
I dont like this changes being apply to lawless space like nullsec or Anoikis.

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7
Arazel Chainfire
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2012-10-15 01:58:32 UTC
jonnykefka wrote:

They've specified you can't eject with an active weapons flag either. T3 pilots have bitched. CCP's response was HTFU. I think CCP nailed it.



What I'm wondering is if CCP is going to bother changing this. It was rather specifically stated when they introduced T3's that learning how to eject and not loose skillpoints was going to be one of the things that balanced T3's.

I'll say this - if they do go through with this, you won't see me flying a T3 again... ever. I have better things to do than constantly retrain the same stupid skill over and over again, especially when I can fly every T2 ship as well.

-Arazel
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-10-15 02:03:42 UTC
Arazel Chainfire wrote:
I'll say this - if they do go through with this, you won't see me flying a T3 again... ever. I have better things to do than constantly retrain the same stupid skill over and over again, especially when I can fly every T2 ship as well.


or you could learn to fly them in a way where you don't lose them?
i fly T3s almost exclusively in PVP (on this toon) and ive had to retrain T3 sub skills once, and that was after a suicide gank on my pve tengu years ago in jita.

T3s are not throw away ships, you should not be flying them like a 50mil BC.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Zyella Stormborn
Green Seekers
#12 - 2012-10-15 02:50:10 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Arazel Chainfire wrote:
I'll say this - if they do go through with this, you won't see me flying a T3 again... ever. I have better things to do than constantly retrain the same stupid skill over and over again, especially when I can fly every T2 ship as well.


or you could learn to fly them in a way where you don't lose them?
i fly T3s almost exclusively in PVP (on this toon) and ive had to retrain T3 sub skills once, and that was after a suicide gank on my pve tengu years ago in jita.

T3s are not throw away ships, you should not be flying them like a 50mil BC.



Agreed. Although, to be honest, when they do their planned 'fix' of T3's, I hope they remove that particular penalty (loss of SP). The price alone is a notable penalty. ;)

There is a special Hell for people like that, Right next to child molestors, and people that talk in the theater. ~Firefly
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-10-15 03:29:26 UTC
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:

T3s are not throw away ships, you should not be flying them like a 50mil BC.



Agreed. Although, to be honest, when they do their planned 'fix' of T3's, I hope they remove that particular penalty (loss of SP). The price alone is a notable penalty. ;)


oh absolutely.
don't get me wrong, I'd love to be able to whelp prots at stuff weekly (it's not like the isk is any issue in WHs) but that isnt what T3s are for in their current state.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#14 - 2012-10-15 05:12:52 UTC
basically, these changes to Crimewatch will stop Heretics from using their T3 gate camp with orca support hotswapping. Tears, from my eyes, i tell you.

It will also stop Suddenly Ninjabears from doing the same thing to gank hisec carebears, where one guy gets aggro, points the shiny faction BS piloted by noob, then they bring in the Orca full of actual DPS ships to hotswap into. Again, tears rolling down my cheeks.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#15 - 2012-10-15 09:25:50 UTC
I'm looking forward to more variety in w-space fleets, not only T3s with the occasional HIC, Recon or Logi all the time.

The 60-second timer will hardly be felt, getting back to your POS to reship will usually take 60 seconds or more.

.
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2012-10-16 07:08:22 UTC
Ejecting from T3s will be possible it seems if you can tank 1 minute then eject. It's better not to think of circumstances where such thing may happen as such loss wil most definitely sound stupid.

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#17 - 2012-10-16 14:59:31 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:

T3s are not throw away ships, you should not be flying them like a 50mil BC.



Agreed. Although, to be honest, when they do their planned 'fix' of T3's, I hope they remove that particular penalty (loss of SP). The price alone is a notable penalty. ;)


oh absolutely.
don't get me wrong, I'd love to be able to whelp prots at stuff weekly (it's not like the isk is any issue in WHs) but that isnt what T3s are for in their current state.



Is it true that the Heavy Missiles Nerf is going to hit Tengu`s prices?
If so, our income could be touched a bit....

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7
Casirio
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2012-10-16 15:50:02 UTC
I've ejected and not lost skillpoints. I've ejected and lost skillpoints. tbh it probably will be "fixed" although it seems to me it is already. Several people I know have who lost t3's recently even when ejecting have lost sp. although I am slightly off topic my bad
Tul Breetai
Impromptu Asset Requisition
#19 - 2012-10-16 19:32:56 UTC
Kalel Nimrott wrote:
I dont like this changes being apply to lawless space like nullsec or Anoikis.



Agreeing with Kalel here, the changes are obviously made with empire space in mind, but the way it's phrased is that all space will be affected. Why? Switching ships is only really a hisec problem, because of aggression mechanics and CONCORD. WH and null shouldn't have this applied.

There's nothing worse than an EVE player, generally considered to be top of the food chain in the MMO world, that cannot smacktalk with wit and coherency.
Utsen Dari
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2012-10-16 23:35:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Utsen Dari
Patch day bug prediction:

It will turn out refitting a ship was coded so that the old ship instance vanishes and a new one is created. Crimewatch changes will make it so capships can't refit from each other in combat.
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