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seeding null-sec market.

Author
River St Clair
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-10-15 09:50:06 UTC
So as a hobby I started building ships in bulk for corp in null-sec. T1 versus only. Profit margins are meh, but its more of a convenience thing than a profit thing.

I also began to jump freighter in minerals in bulk to build various popular ships. I import popular t2 ships as I don't make them.

I don't make t2 items such as guns and various tank mods, instead making ammo which is helpful i guess.

Instead of hauling t2 modules from jita to my null-sec pocket. What t1 items that I can make are useful?

Ships
ammo
rigs.

For the most part, is that it?
Rengerel en Distel
#2 - 2012-10-15 11:59:07 UTC
Perhaps asking your corp what they would like you to make would be better than asking those not in your corp what your corp would like you to make?

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.

River St Clair
Doomheim
#3 - 2012-10-15 12:21:15 UTC  |  Edited by: River St Clair
They will ask for random personal items...like some random skillbook....like battleship or whatever.

I'm looking for general market item ideas.
Denal Umbra
Coffee Hub
#4 - 2012-10-15 12:54:12 UTC
There is no clear cut answer, you will have to do the research yourself. Start checking the market history tabs on items you think might be good. Every region varies and items needed depends highly on where you are located.

Also, don't forget that there are traders who are bringing in those said items in bulk and can undercut your prices and still make a killer profit.
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
#5 - 2012-10-16 05:02:06 UTC
If you want to sell t1 you'll need meta.
(( no good for manufacturing ))

meta 4 items like:

Micro warp drives
After burners
Warp scramblers
Warp disruptors
ECM
Target painters
Neutralizers
Remote repair

All of these are in high demand as meta 4 items for pvp.

Also look into:
Strip miners
Mining upgrades
Probe launchers
Mining crystals


A good way to improve your sells is to sell the items that work for the ships you sell.

If you sell shield bc's then sell T2 shield items with medium projectile guns and missle launchers.
Grab a few things that always sell like T2 damage controls too. Cap rechargers.

Just the handful of t2 items can improve your ship sells in the same station.
River St Clair
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-10-16 05:36:36 UTC
Yeah, from what i understand, meta items are retrieved from mission loot only? I'm not sure on that. I have no idea.

I like the idea of making things to sale from minerals, but it seems like options are a bit limited as I've looked at capital and sov items. ships and ammo.

I hear T2 is more trouble then its worth, from a few out of game sources. That with the fact that I'm not trying to work too hard.

Mar Mite
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2012-10-16 09:58:17 UTC
River St Clair wrote:
That with the fact that I'm not trying to work too hard.




That will make things difficult considering the fact that no matter how much effort you put in, there will almost always be someone else willing to go a bit further - and cheaper. This is not a criticism, just a fact. You need to to be smart about the items you deal with, research the market and choose wisely. If it was easy, everyone would do it. And noone will hand you that type of information here even if they happen to know it for you particular region.

Pick a few items you think are interesting, watch them for a couple weeks or more, and then decide whether you can profit on that particular item or not. If not, find some new candidates and monitor them closely until you can make an informed decision. Even if you were to get decent tips from the forums here, you'd be much better of finding your own niche and keeping it to yourself.

Don't fool yourself into thinking the market is a PVE activity...the market is definitely a PVP environment.
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-10-16 13:51:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Abdiel Kavash
If you want my suggestion: If you're hauling anything at all from highsec, scratch the whole manufacturing process and simply haul in finished items. You can bring hundreds of useful TII modules in the same space it takes you to move minerals for one ship. You'll save yourself time, training, and character slots to manufacture, you will get much higher margins per volume moved, much faster turnaround, and you will not be limited by whatever you have blueprints or skills for.

The only time it makes economical sense to build anything (other than capitals) in 0.0 is if you're living in the arse end of nowhere, JFing stuff would eat up way too much time and money, and you can somehow secure a supply of all the minerals you need. (Which in most cases means many miners slaving for minimum profit mining veldspar.)

As far as what to import, if your corp/alliance has any standardized or suggested fits, that is a good place to start.
Kisuke Riva
Project Stealth Squad
The Initiative.
#9 - 2012-10-16 14:42:36 UTC
Here's a quick and dirty how-to null-sec trade for you.

1) Learn which ships and fittings your alliance fights with
Instead of guessing or asking around use the tools at your hands to make educated decisions. Above all, study your alliance killboards for fleet doctrines and ship fittings; double-check that with your SRP and you know what is in demand. Don't forget the drones, the ammo and rigs! Ships get popped daily, they need to be replaced. Null-sec trade hubs are seller's markets. Demand is higher than supply out here, especially in war times. Do your homework and research: make notes and lists on what is being bought and how much goes over the counter on a daily basis. This gives you a shopping list for step 2.

2) Produce or Buy those ships and items in high-sec
Use your Jita trade alt to stock up on those ships, mods, ammo and rigs. If you can make some of it yourself with a higher margin, go for it. More miners sell to the market then you would think. Give buy orders a try, you will be surprised how many people actually right-click sell their stuff in jita. Be ready for an evening of 0.01 ISKing, it's not uncommon to build up 1B of stock in Jita through buy-orders during a couple of hours, while I do my stuff in null-sec on the other screen and account(s).

3) Move the goods to your high-sec staging system
Keep your packages under 1B and they should be more or less safe, use Red Frog Freight for moving your cargo, you should have the luxury of waiting a couple of hours or a day. They cost 0.5m a jump, which is nothing compared to the margin you will be making in your null-sec trade hub once you sell off your stock.
Once your cargo arrives in your high sec staging system, a station usually 1j away from the low-sec system your alliance is jumping (carriers and jump freighters) from you need to get them into null-sec. That's either done in Jump Freighters for a few hundred ISK per m3 or, if you have a scout on gates and stations you move your cargo to the low-sec staging system next door to be jumped by Carrier. A billion of T2 mods usually is less than 3 GSCs, so you should be ok with a cloaky transport ship, if you scout the entry gate and station. A carrier can load a handfull of Battlecruiser hulls, although you will have a better turnaround with cruiser and frigate sized hulls ... have a look at what stealth bombers your alliance is using and you should have a good start.

4) Jump the cargo to your null-sec trade hub .... wait .... profit!
So that either happens through JFs or Carriers. If you're really sneaky or an do-it-yourself type of person you can also cloaky haul that cargo into null-sec yourself. I've done it a couple of times for kicks, your alliance should have a solid Jump Bridge system in place. Way safer is naturally the Carrier or JFs services your alliance should have. If that's not in place, it's time to go search a proper alliance my friend.
Once your cargo is in the null-sec trade hub, you put it on the market, be a bit patient and profit. From here you reap your rewards, while you study changes in the market (step 1) and restart the cycle. If you're jumping stuff yourself, that's the time to think about what you want to jump out of null-sec to high-sec. A good start is salvage, factions mods and even T2 mods that are being looted from your enemies wrecks and sold to the market.

To give you an example from the field, my current mark up is on average 33% for ships, 40% for rigs and 30% for mods compared to Jita sell. Where I am selling, Heavy Missile Launcher IIs are going for 934,000.00 ISK at the moment, around 800 are sold per week. I can buy them in Jita for 684.998.99 ISK, that's a margin of 36% for you right there with the most obvious item possible. If I would fill up 3 GSCs with HML IIs that a carrier can load, that would be around 300m Profit. Naturally you don't only trade in one item but dozens. Right now I have around 100 orders, and they are going faster than I can supply. Try it yourself, it's good money. ;)
River St Clair
Doomheim
#10 - 2012-10-16 16:13:02 UTC
Thx, I'll end up trying out using red frog to move items to 1J from lowsec, then cloaky transporting them into the low-sec station where I can then carrier/ or jump freighter them home. It does seem to make sense to just buy/sell, the manufacturing process seems a bit miserable.

thx all.