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Getting Rid of the Undesirables (for good this time)

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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#441 - 2012-10-13 23:43:13 UTC
I think you're vastly underestimating CCP if you think this is as close as they can get to removing aggression from highsec.
Herr Hammer Draken
#442 - 2012-10-13 23:44:41 UTC
I do suppose kill right prices will have a function related to the bounty on the head of the kill target.
If the target has a huge bounty on his head I do not see a player selling a kill right very cheap.
The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much.
So I see kill rights being set at about that 20% level of that bounty assuming there is a bounty.
Unless someone wants to scam the system that is.

Also all current bounties will be erased and they start from scratch on the day of the winter update.

Herr Hammer Draken "The Amarr Prophet"
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#443 - 2012-10-13 23:47:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Gustav
Lord Zim wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Yeah, essentially. By making the kill right too expensive for normal people to buy, you can give the ganker a suspect flag that either lasts 30 days or until he dies.

However, the ganker could use an alt to kill himself when you activate the kill right, making the system exploitable both ways.

This is certainly true, since having a suspect flag doesn't stop you from docking up and swapping out to an inexpensive ship, but the right timing should make it a bit trickier to do.

Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Seriously, it's a completely useless system.

That it is, but it's as close as Stoffer can get to removing hisec aggression or griefing without actually making a lie out of the comment where he said "we would never completely remove hisec aggression". In short, wordlawyering to the highest degree.

Except. it doesn't. It hurts rookies. Here's why.

My alt is a part-time pirate. I grind his sec enough to keep him travel-safe in high-sec. I can be front-loaded for pointing a pod, collect a ransom and get a kill right, dock up and wait my 15.

While I'm waiting off my 15 minute aggression, I open up the market and elect to perform some arbitage of civilian equipment in high-sec. Arbitage is good for the economy, so this is acceptable gameplay.

I undock after my 15, go to high-sec, pick up a bunch of civvy mods and bring them to a rookie system for sale.

When I get there I go AFK for a beverage while undocked 15km off the station. That's because at that point I start autopiloting.

When I come back I'm being buzzed by rookie ships. Oh noes!

I activate my medium smartbombs. I might even get a few "innocents." Probably not though.

The result? Through normal gameplay rookies die. This is broke because you can't encourage rookie players to be the arbiters of something they know nothing about.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#444 - 2012-10-13 23:49:03 UTC
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
I do suppose kill right prices will have a function related to the bounty on the head of the kill target.
If the target has a huge bounty on his head I do not see a player selling a kill right very cheap.
The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much.
So I see kill rights being set at about that 20% level of that bounty assuming there is a bounty.
Unless someone wants to scam the system that is.

Also all current bounties will be erased and they start from scratch on the day of the winter update.

The bounty will be 20% of the value of the destroyed ship or pod, not 20% of the total bounty pool. That means that if anything, kill right prices will be related to the target's ship preferences.

It will also mean that if someone sets an expensive price on my kill right and I don't want to pay for it myself to remove it, I'd just get into something enticing like a buffered hauler, and then switch over to a shuttle to kill myself with an alt once someone drops the money to have a go at me.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#445 - 2012-10-13 23:52:57 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
I think you're vastly underestimating CCP if you think this is as close as they can get to removing aggression from highsec.

Without actually physically disallowing it? I'd l ike to see them try.

However, due to this, I'm unironically starting the training of a hisec gank the instant one of my accounts is done with its current training regime. I intend to be locked and loaded come the day CCP unironically tries to turn hisec into hello kitty online, just to spite Stoffer.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Herr Hammer Draken
#446 - 2012-10-13 23:55:41 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
I do suppose kill right prices will have a function related to the bounty on the head of the kill target.
If the target has a huge bounty on his head I do not see a player selling a kill right very cheap.
The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much.
So I see kill rights being set at about that 20% level of that bounty assuming there is a bounty.
Unless someone wants to scam the system that is.

Also all current bounties will be erased and they start from scratch on the day of the winter update.

The bounty will be 20% of the value of the destroyed ship or pod, not 20% of the total bounty pool. That means that if anything, kill right prices will be related to the target's ship preferences.

It will also mean that if someone sets an expensive price on my kill right and I don't want to pay for it myself to remove it, I'd just get into something enticing like a buffered hauler, and then switch over to a shuttle to kill myself with an alt once someone drops the money to have a go at me.


"The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much."

Herr Hammer Draken "The Amarr Prophet"
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#447 - 2012-10-13 23:57:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Destiny Corrupted
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
I do suppose kill right prices will have a function related to the bounty on the head of the kill target.
If the target has a huge bounty on his head I do not see a player selling a kill right very cheap.
The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much.
So I see kill rights being set at about that 20% level of that bounty assuming there is a bounty.
Unless someone wants to scam the system that is.

Also all current bounties will be erased and they start from scratch on the day of the winter update.

The bounty will be 20% of the value of the destroyed ship or pod, not 20% of the total bounty pool. That means that if anything, kill right prices will be related to the target's ship preferences.

It will also mean that if someone sets an expensive price on my kill right and I don't want to pay for it myself to remove it, I'd just get into something enticing like a buffered hauler, and then switch over to a shuttle to kill myself with an alt once someone drops the money to have a go at me.


"The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much."

Straight from the dev blog:

"The bounty payout is based on a percentage of the Total Loss, so the bounty received will always be considerably less than the actual Total Loss value. The base number we’re going for right now is 20%. This means that if you blow something up worth 100 million, then 20 million is paid out in bounty (or whatever is left in the bounty pool if less than 20 million)."

What this means is, if my bounty is a billion, but I only fly T1 frigates, the person who kills me would be getting a tiny payout, and wouldn't pay a hundred million for the kill right just because my bounty is a billion.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Herr Hammer Draken
#448 - 2012-10-14 00:00:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Herr Hammer Draken
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
I do suppose kill right prices will have a function related to the bounty on the head of the kill target.
If the target has a huge bounty on his head I do not see a player selling a kill right very cheap.
The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much.
So I see kill rights being set at about that 20% level of that bounty assuming there is a bounty.
Unless someone wants to scam the system that is.

Also all current bounties will be erased and they start from scratch on the day of the winter update.

The bounty will be 20% of the value of the destroyed ship or pod, not 20% of the total bounty pool. That means that if anything, kill right prices will be related to the target's ship preferences.

It will also mean that if someone sets an expensive price on my kill right and I don't want to pay for it myself to remove it, I'd just get into something enticing like a buffered hauler, and then switch over to a shuttle to kill myself with an alt once someone drops the money to have a go at me.


"The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much."

Straight from the dev blog:

"The bounty payout is based on a percentage of the Total Loss, so the bounty received will always be considerably less than the actual Total Loss value. The base number we’re going for right now is 20%. This means that if you blow something up worth 100 million, then 20 million is paid out in bounty (or whatever is left in the bounty pool if less than 20 million)."


And that is exactly what I said. If the value of the kill is worth 20% of the bounty pool. IE that much.
Er wait I see it now, if the value of the kill is worth 5 times the total bounty then the entire bounty can be paid out on that one kill.

Had a thought of someone flying around in a titan and killing it with an alt to clear their bounty.

Herr Hammer Draken "The Amarr Prophet"
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#449 - 2012-10-14 00:03:38 UTC
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
I do suppose kill right prices will have a function related to the bounty on the head of the kill target.
If the target has a huge bounty on his head I do not see a player selling a kill right very cheap.
The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much.
So I see kill rights being set at about that 20% level of that bounty assuming there is a bounty.
Unless someone wants to scam the system that is.

Also all current bounties will be erased and they start from scratch on the day of the winter update.

The bounty will be 20% of the value of the destroyed ship or pod, not 20% of the total bounty pool. That means that if anything, kill right prices will be related to the target's ship preferences.

It will also mean that if someone sets an expensive price on my kill right and I don't want to pay for it myself to remove it, I'd just get into something enticing like a buffered hauler, and then switch over to a shuttle to kill myself with an alt once someone drops the money to have a go at me.


"The bounty paid out is up to 20% of the total bounty if the value of the kill is worth that much."

Straight from the dev blog:

"The bounty payout is based on a percentage of the Total Loss, so the bounty received will always be considerably less than the actual Total Loss value. The base number we’re going for right now is 20%. This means that if you blow something up worth 100 million, then 20 million is paid out in bounty (or whatever is left in the bounty pool if less than 20 million)."


And that is exactly what I said. If the value of the kill is worth 20% of the bounty pool. IE that much.

Not to be nitpicky but to me it looks like an amount comes out of the bounty pool equal to about 20% of the kill value. If that's the way it works, this could go on for a very, very long time.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
GetSirrus
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#450 - 2012-10-14 00:10:25 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:

Bounty-hunters don't want random people interfering in their work.



neither does anybody else, but this is Eve?! single shard universe. Or did a specific profession suddenly get a free-pass?
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#451 - 2012-10-14 00:13:34 UTC
GetSirrus wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:

Bounty-hunters don't want random people interfering in their work.



neither does anybody else, but this is Eve?! single shard universe. Or did a specific profession suddenly get a free-pass?

Do you understand what it actually means to be a bounty hunter?

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#452 - 2012-10-14 00:26:52 UTC
GetSirrus wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:

Bounty-hunters don't want random people interfering in their work.



neither does anybody else, but this is Eve?! single shard universe. Or did a specific profession suddenly get a free-pass?

Miners recently did, yes. But this thread isn't about that. Cool

On-topic, though:

I like how instead of collecting our own bounties with alts, now we'll be collecting our own kill rights with alts instead.

Capitalism! Whoever's got the most ISK wins!

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom
Ludi Burek
The Player Haters Corp
#453 - 2012-10-14 00:33:53 UTC
Holy ****, how hard is it for people to understand that no one is crying about omg imma get flagged to a bunch of people. Limited intellects with their go pvp outside of high sec and htfu griefer... Shocked

The whole point is that CCP chose such an inelegant way to implement this system and ruining potentially awesome kill rights mechanic before it even goes live.

There. Get it? It's just one sentence. Roll
Asuri Kinnes
Perkone
Caldari State
#454 - 2012-10-14 00:42:05 UTC
Ludi Burek wrote:
The whole point is that CCP chose such an inelegant way to implement this system and ruining potentially awesome kill rights mechanic before it even goes live.

There. Get it? It's just one sentence. Roll

No, they don't.

They think that people who fly in high sec at -10 are going to suddenly be afraid because everyone can shoot them now....

Roll

Bob is the god of Wormholes.

That's all you need to know.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#455 - 2012-10-14 00:55:58 UTC
It's the standard carebear attitude. To a carebear, a player who fights other players, no matter for what purpose, is a coward.

It's a very bitter irony.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Herr Hammer Draken
#456 - 2012-10-14 00:56:53 UTC
Asuri Kinnes wrote:
Ludi Burek wrote:
The whole point is that CCP chose such an inelegant way to implement this system and ruining potentially awesome kill rights mechanic before it even goes live.

There. Get it? It's just one sentence. Roll

No, they don't.

They think that people who fly in high sec at -10 are going to suddenly be afraid because everyone can shoot them now....

Roll


LOL But that is pretty close to the truth. Closer than you think. Cry

Herr Hammer Draken "The Amarr Prophet"
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#457 - 2012-10-14 00:57:48 UTC
Herr Hammer Draken wrote:
Asuri Kinnes wrote:
Ludi Burek wrote:
The whole point is that CCP chose such an inelegant way to implement this system and ruining potentially awesome kill rights mechanic before it even goes live.

There. Get it? It's just one sentence. Roll

No, they don't.

They think that people who fly in high sec at -10 are going to suddenly be afraid because everyone can shoot them now....

Roll


LOL But that is pretty close to the truth. Closer than you think. Cry

But how does that even make sense?

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#458 - 2012-10-14 01:04:19 UTC
Asuri Kinnes wrote:
Ludi Burek wrote:
The whole point is that CCP chose such an inelegant way to implement this system and ruining potentially awesome kill rights mechanic before it even goes live.

There. Get it? It's just one sentence. Roll

No, they don't.

They think that people who fly in high sec at -10 are going to suddenly be afraid because everyone can shoot them now....

Roll


everyone can already shoot you in hisec, including your pod, if you're -10

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Asuri Kinnes
Perkone
Caldari State
#459 - 2012-10-14 01:06:18 UTC
Andski wrote:
Asuri Kinnes wrote:
Ludi Burek wrote:
The whole point is that CCP chose such an inelegant way to implement this system and ruining potentially awesome kill rights mechanic before it even goes live.

There. Get it? It's just one sentence. Roll

No, they don't.

They think that people who fly in high sec at -10 are going to suddenly be afraid because everyone can shoot them now....

Roll


everyone can already shoot you in hisec, including your pod, if you're -10

Shocked

ummmmmmmmm.......

Not to put *too fine a point on it* that WAS my point...

Question

Bob is the god of Wormholes.

That's all you need to know.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#460 - 2012-10-14 01:36:37 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
However, due to this, I'm unironically starting the training of a hisec gank the instant one of my accounts is done with its current training regime. I intend to be locked and loaded come the day CCP unironically tries to turn hisec into hello kitty online, just to spite Stoffer.

I think CCP will try and disarm you even more then. Cool

Soon ganking will go from "never intended to be profitable" to "never intended to be feasible".

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?