These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

PLEX going up because CCP conjures ISK, buys PLEX, then trashes them.

First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Gankatron 2000
Doomheim
#101 - 2012-10-12 20:14:43 UTC
The OP is right . . . kinda . . .

CCP doesn't create ISK out of thin air for CCP ALt, use that alt to buy plex, and then trash to PLEX.

Come on people . . . That would be "morally ambigous" and the consequences of being caught would destroy the customer trust and ultimately their business. CPP has worked out a much more ingenious plan . . .

1) CCP creates ISK out of thin are and gives it to PLAYERS (bounties, Incursions). To the tune of +20 Trillion ISK/month

2) Players realize that inflation is quickly eroding the value of their ISK

3) Players convert ISK to PLEX, the "gold standard" of eve.

4) Instead of storing billions of ISK that they will never use, players now stockpile stacks of PLEX that they will never use.

5) All of those un-used PLEXs are a zero intrest loan that CCP may/may not have to repay (provide service) in the future. More importantly, it is revenue that they can book without having to provide a service for.

How much is this worth to CCP?
Assuming that half of the 20 Trillion ISK/month that CCP injects into the economy each month gets converted to PLEX and stored in a JITA hanger, CPP is getting loaned over 250K per month by it's "eve rich" users. With a reported revenue of 66 million last year (from the interwebs, not sure if it's true), 3 million per year would equal ~4% gross margin shift. That's a successful/unsuccessful IPO sort of swing in gross margin. Don't think for a second that CCP doesn't have a lot riding on this Plex Trade.

Was this CCP's original plan? Probably not.

Are they going to do everything they can to encourage it to continue. Most certainly.
Christy D Floyd
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#102 - 2012-10-12 20:27:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Christy D Floyd
Gankatron 2000 wrote:
The OP is right . . . kinda . . .

CCP doesn't create ISK out of thin air for CCP ALt, use that alt to buy plex, and then trash to PLEX.

Come on people . . . That would be "morally ambigous" and the consequences of being caught would destroy the customer trust and ultimately their business. CPP has worked out a much more ingenious plan . . .

1) CCP creates ISK out of thin are and gives it to PLAYERS (bounties, Incursions). To the tune of +20 Trillion ISK/month

2) Players realize that inflation is quickly eroding the value of their ISK

3) Players convert ISK to PLEX, the "gold standard" of eve.

4) Instead of storing billions of ISK that they will never use, players now stockpile stacks of PLEX that they will never use.

5) All of those un-used PLEXs are a zero intrest loan that CCP may/may not have to repay (provide service) in the future. More importantly, it is revenue that they can book without having to provide a service for.

How much is this worth to CCP?
Assuming that half of the 20 Trillion ISK/month that CCP injects into the economy each month gets converted to PLEX and stored in a JITA hanger, CPP is getting loaned over 250K per month by it's "eve rich" users. With a reported revenue of 66 million last year (from the interwebs, not sure if it's true), 3 million per year would equal ~4% gross margin shift. That's a successful/unsuccessful IPO sort of swing in gross margin. Don't think for a second that CCP doesn't have a lot riding on this Plex Trade.

Was this CCP's original plan? Probably not.

Are they going to do everything they can to encourage it to continue. Most certainly.







This is it in a nutshell. I know its hard to believe that CCP would do this but do you not remeber the famous memo....GREED IS GOOD!!! How do we End this charade of CCP's? Real easy stop using plex boycott it entirely. I dare you to ask CCP to remove plex from the game I know what there answer will be..... HELL NO . Oh and where the f#ck is the CSM while all this is going down proablly at home watchin p0rn eating cheesy puffs.

Money is better than poverty, if only for financial reasons.
Gankatron 2000
Doomheim
#103 - 2012-10-12 20:43:05 UTC
Christy D Floyd wrote:

This is it in a nutshell. I know its hard to believe that CCP would do this but do you not remeber the famous memo....GREED IS GOOD!!! How do we End this charade of CCP's? Real easy stop using plex boycott it entirely. I dare you to ask CCP to remove plex from the game I know what there answer will be..... HELL NO .


Perhaps you mistook my statement as a negative implication of CCP. I don't begrudge CCP for making a profit. I encourage it. As soon as Eve starts losing money we're going to lose the game that we love.

If CCP actually managed to foresee that PLEX would become the gold standard in EVE and increase their gross margins by 4-5%, then g*d damn, someone a CCP deserves the Nobel Prize in economics.

Is this bad for the eve economy? Injecting ISK at 20 Trillion/month will certainly cause inflation. Any time the money supply grows FASTER than the population growth, inflation is the result. Is inflation bad for the game? Define bad? As long as people can still blow stuff up, afford to get blown up, and have fun with your friends then CCP is meeting the demands of its customers whether trit is a 2isk/unit or 200isk/unit

If CCP uses the money "load" by eve rich players to make the game better, attract new customers, and keep existing customers engaged then I think this could be in the long term beneficial for the users.
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#104 - 2012-10-12 20:56:22 UTC
If I had the isk, I'd buy every single PLEX off the market & trash them just to annoy you even more.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Bart Starr
Aggressive Structural Steel Expediting Services
#105 - 2012-10-12 20:57:21 UTC
Lolar55 wrote:
If my memory serves me right CCP fired one of their own employs after their internal security team discovered he was using his power to help ppl ingame so its highly unlikely that they would decide to do something like that on a larger scale, that would make their security team obsolute.Pure logic.



Oh, wait, I think you got that backwards.

CCP banned the accounts of the player that exposed T20 for helping out Band of Brothers.

T20, himself, remained happily employed within CCP for quite some time.
ISD TYPE40
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#106 - 2012-10-12 20:58:50 UTC
While this subject is of understandable concern to many players, both buyers and sellers of PLEX, I would ask that people refrain from posting rumours. CCP has already made its position on this subject very clear, that PLEX prices are set by the players themselves.

Using a sensitive subject to troll people provides no benefit to anyone and serves only to cause problems. Please respect other forum users and post sensibly in future, thank you.

[b]ISD Type40 Lt. Commander Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]
Bart Starr
Aggressive Structural Steel Expediting Services
#107 - 2012-10-12 21:01:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Bart Starr
Mallak Azaria wrote:
If I had the isk, I'd buy every single PLEX off the market & trash them just to annoy you even more.


LOL. Spoken like a goon.

Though It wouldn't annoy me at all.
Sure, I use PLEX because ISK has no inherent value to me.
High PLEX prices are fine. If its 1 Bill or 600M ISK, I'll pay it as long as I feel like it.

I'd much rather other scrubs were wasting their real money and I'll provide the play money.

I'm just pointing out that CCP is probably just doing this directly to save on server costs.
In fact, they'd probably be considered poor businessmen if they weren't doing it.

Why stress these servers when you can just print ISK? The fithy unwashed player base probably won't notice anyway, with all the other ISK inflation going on.
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#108 - 2012-10-12 21:06:18 UTC
Bart Starr wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
If I had the isk, I'd buy every single PLEX off the market & trash them just to annoy you even more.


LOL. Spoken like a goon.

Though It wouldn't annoy me at all.
Sure, I use PLEX because ISK has no inherent value to me.
High PLEX prices are fine. If its 1 Bill or 600M ISK, I'll pay it as long as I feel like it.

I'd much rather other scrubs were wasting their real money and I'll provide the play money.

I'm just pointing out that CCP is probably just doing this directly to save on server costs.
In fact, they'd probably be considered poor businessmen if they weren't doing it.

Why stress these servers when you can just print ISK? The fithy unwashed player base probably won't notice anyway, with all the other ISK inflation going on.


the people who buy PLEX with cash would love this to happen. I'm referring to the people that buy them with isk although unfortunately, such an act would adversely affect too many Goons to be a worthwhile venture.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Colonel Xaven
Perkone
Caldari State
#109 - 2012-10-12 21:12:45 UTC
Kara Vix wrote:
Ah this thread is a perfect example of the amusing nonsense in general discussion that keeps me coming back for more laughs. I haven't been able to find another source of intellectual debate of this level since GW Bush was the president in the states.Lol


best post in here.

www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance
Bart Starr
Aggressive Structural Steel Expediting Services
#110 - 2012-10-12 21:18:43 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD TYPE40
Of course.....buying and trashing PLEX = win for CCP on many levels.

PLEX becomes more scarce, which reduces outstanding liabilities for CCP.
(Each PLEX in player hands represents a promise to provide a service)
Theoretically each PLEX on the market represents a 1 month subscription that won't be paid in the future.
Erasing them (by any means, Aurum, face shaping, direct trashing, etc...) is beneficial, as it reduces hardware loads.

People who buy PLEX for ISK resale think they win, because OMG, 1 Billion ISK for a PLEX!
More cash flows into the coffers.

Because the hidden cost is that your ISK isn't worth nearly as much, as it is being rapidly devalued through this type of manipulation.

*snip*


EDIT: You have been asked to stop posting baseless rumours twice. Please cease doing so, thank you - ISD Type40.
Colonel Xaven
Perkone
Caldari State
#111 - 2012-10-12 21:21:39 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD TYPE40
Bart Starr wrote:
Of course.....buying and trashing PLEX = win for CCP on many levels.

PLEX becomes more scarce, which reduces outstanding liabilities for CCP.
(Each PLEX in player hands represents a promise to provide a service)
Theoretically each PLEX on the market represents a 1 month subscription that won't be paid in the future.
Erasing them (by any means, Aurum, face shaping, direct trashing, etc...) is beneficial, as it reduces hardware loads.

People who buy PLEX for ISK resale think they win, because OMG, 1 Billion ISK for a PLEX!
More cash flows into the coffers.

Because the hidden cost is that your ISK isn't worth nearly as much, as it is being rapidly devalued through this type of manipulation.

*snip*



by repeating your rumors you have two effects:

1) it wont become true
2) prices rise further

EDIT: My apologies, I just had to edit that quote - ISD Type40.

www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#112 - 2012-10-12 21:33:26 UTC
And its hard to imagine it would stay secret. Last year the internal news letter article "greed is good" got leaked, along with an internal E-mail from CCP's CEO.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
Robert De'Arneth
#113 - 2012-10-12 21:49:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Robert De'Arneth
Wake up kiddies, this IS EVE ONLINE , not hello Kitty online. The rules are in place to make prices rise, people use this all the time with all the game items including PLEX. Bart Starr, you are a rabble rouser, you have no facts, to back your ignorant statement. If you cannot afford to play EVE get down the road. I even remember the thread where many people conspired to raise the price of plex, I know several people who helped out, they bought a lot of plex at low cost and sold it at a higher price.


This is EVE dude, stop your tin foil crying and go play or back to something more your style, like My Little ponies online, my grand daughter loves this game, based on your tears I am betting you will fit right in.

I'm a nerd, you can check my stats!! Skilling Int/Mem at 45 sp per minute is how I mack!     I'm like a lapdog, all bark no bite. 
Clystan
Binaerie Heavy Industries
#114 - 2012-10-12 21:58:51 UTC
It is sad to think of all the little Plexes sitting in hangars in Jita. Look at them - they are getting all fat and inactive. Take your Plex out. Read your Plex a skillbook now and again. Sheesh.
Bart Starr
Aggressive Structural Steel Expediting Services
#115 - 2012-10-12 22:37:53 UTC
Robert De'Arneth wrote:
Wake up kiddies, this IS EVE ONLINE , not hello Kitty online. The rules are in place to make prices rise, people use this all the time with all the game items including PLEX. Bart Starr, you are a rabble rouser, you have no facts, to back your ignorant statement. If you cannot afford to play EVE get down the road. I even remember the thread where many people conspired to raise the price of plex, I know several people who helped out, they bought a lot of plex at low cost and sold it at a higher price.


This is EVE dude, stop your tin foil crying and go play or back to something more your style, like My Little ponies online, my grand daughter loves this game, based on your tears I am betting you will fit right in.


You obviously didn't read my thread. Several times I stated that I am laughing at the situation.
IE: "This is what is happening, here is how its happening, I think its funny!"
Then I watch all the fanboys leap to defend CCP's 'honor'

"Tears" is more like "Wah, make PLEX cheaper, CCP!" And I never said any such thing. I don't really care what the prices are, except 'higher' is more entertaining because of all the drama.

I enjoy watching EVE players suffer, especially at the hands of the developers.
They've always been the best at it, after all.....
Lyron-Baktos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#116 - 2012-10-12 22:48:12 UTC
Bart Starr wrote:
Now, this isn't a complaint. I want PLEX to be as expensive as possible because I don't think 'perse auki' scrubs should be able to fly for free.

That said, PLEX price surges are easy to explain.

A PLEX is simply a 'gift certificate' for game time. A player pays currency and gets a PLEX.
The PLEX represents a promise from CCP provide 30 days of server resources (or AURUM) to the bearer.
Destruction of PLEX is the equivalent of tearing up these 'gift certificates' - or flushing them down the toilet.
This makes CCP happy because they collected $$$ without having to provide a service. The gift certificate, though paid for, never will be redeemed.

So,
-CCP can create or remove ISK from the game at will. (We know this because of negative ISK accounts reported for RMTers.)
-PLEX are available on the open market for ISK, and CCP can create or destroy alts at will.

CCP simply creates ISK out of thin air, then buys them off the market (injecting ISK into the game), and then trashes them.

Result? PLEX prices go up.
CCP then invites players to buy more PLEX - for those players to sell on the market for ever higher amounts of ISK.

Of course, ISK inflation results as CCP pumps ISK into the system via PLEX buys.
But why would they care? They are earning cash without having to provide valuable 'server resources' for that cash.
All they have to do is provide ISK which is 'free'.....even though it erodes the buying power of everyone 'honestly' playing the game.

Simple. Corrupt. Profitable. And CCP is easily capable of it.
(Remember, this is the same company that quietly provided T2 Blueprints to favored Alliances. Then....BANNED Kugu for discovering the cancer and going public with it.)


Do you realize how ******* ******** you are? Just biomass yourself and leave the game
Colonel Xaven
Perkone
Caldari State
#117 - 2012-10-12 22:48:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Colonel Xaven
Bart Starr wrote:


You obviously didn't read my thread. Several times I stated that I am laughing at the situation.
IE: "This is what is happening, here is how its happening, I think its funny!"
Then I watch all the fanboys leap to defend CCP's 'honor'

"Tears" is more like "Wah, make PLEX cheaper, CCP!" And I never said any such thing. I don't really care what the prices are, except 'higher' is more entertaining because of all the drama.

I enjoy watching EVE players suffer, especially at the hands of the developers.
They've always been the best at it, after all.....





Funny how you try to look calm after your bwawaQQ and tinfoil hat words on page 1 and after. You claim to laugh about the situation? I bet you have no initial idea even what the situation is.

www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance
Glary Crazy
Empyrean Warriors
#118 - 2012-10-13 00:09:32 UTC
This thread is so god damn bad.
Hrothgar Nilsson
#119 - 2012-10-13 00:10:39 UTC
Bart Starr wrote:
LOL. Spoken like a goon.

Though It wouldn't annoy me at all.
Sure, I use PLEX because ISK has no inherent value to me.
High PLEX prices are fine. If its 1 Bill or 600M ISK, I'll pay it as long as I feel like it.

I'd much rather other scrubs were wasting their real money and I'll provide the play money.

I'm just pointing out that CCP is probably just doing this directly to save on server costs.
In fact, they'd probably be considered poor businessmen if they weren't doing it.

Why stress these servers when you can just print ISK? The fithy unwashed player base probably won't notice anyway, with all the other ISK inflation going on.

W.T.F....

ISKtime, $time

if ISKtime > $time, pay $ for sub
if $time > ISKtime, pay ISK for plex for sub

I've... seen things you people wouldn't believe...

Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion...
Gillia Winddancer
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#120 - 2012-10-13 00:11:15 UTC
Glary Crazy wrote:
This thread is so god damn bad.


You think? I find it to be the pinnacle when it comes to setting an example of how utterly stupid some people truly are.