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[ATI - HD7*** Series] System Freeze

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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#161 - 2012-10-09 19:58:47 UTC
digitalwanderer wrote:
Drivers are always busted somehow and the perfect driver that works with every possible hardware configuration and every possible piece of software will never exist, period.


and its still the responsibility of the vendor to ensure drivers stability, noone else
digitalwanderer
DW inc
#162 - 2012-10-09 23:35:31 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:
digitalwanderer wrote:
Drivers are always busted somehow and the perfect driver that works with every possible hardware configuration and every possible piece of software will never exist, period.


and its still the responsibility of the vendor to ensure drivers stability, noone else




Given the amount and variety of software out there, that's easier said than done, and to be quie honest, Nvidia also releases regular driver updates but go on their forums and you'll see plenty of complaints depending on the application being run too.


There's thousands of applications out there, and it would take a enourmous amount of people just working on drivers to make sure all of them work as they should.
ISD Suvetar
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#163 - 2012-10-10 12:43:33 UTC
Just to weigh in on this, I've got a 6870 running the latest drivers on Windows 7 - 64bit edition.

I regularly run 3 clients without any problems, but I've not tried to use the map screen whilst doing thing. I'll test that when I can.

[b]ISD Suvetar Captain/Commando Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]
Teh Minez0r
Virtual Intergalactic Army
#164 - 2012-10-10 20:43:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Teh Minez0r
Same issue here. Complete system hang together with Hd 7970 (had no issues with 4890 crossfire before). Though, I can't only blame ATI on this one as none of my other games neither crash nor lock up the whole system. Anyway, that's ***ing ridiculous that there's obviously still no fix for this problem yet.

edit: what I realized is that I NEVER got a lock up if I didn't shoot myself or used drones. I just warped to a Guristas Hidden whatever before and stood there for ~30mins. 5ses after shooting em my system was stuck. So that smells even more like a CCP fail here. Any1 else ever tried that? Because autopiloting through highsec also doesn't lock up my rig.
Mad B0mber
Novaku Inc
#165 - 2012-10-11 06:09:43 UTC

Same issue for me

7970 single card

other games i play work fine

Eve is the only game that locks up completely.. out of the various games i play

ran tests, disabled and re enabled various settings..

all fail. freeze is unrecoverable.


tried to log the error with no luck..



Saber Coombs
Deep Sea LTD.
#166 - 2012-10-11 07:54:48 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:


and its still the responsibility of the vendor to ensure drivers stability, noone else


And it's the game developers responsibility to use the drivers in a correct way.

Regardless of exactly where the problem lies, it was introduced after a patch by CCP. They broke their own game which means they have the ability to fix it or come up with a workaround, they choose not to. What they do is throw their hands in the air and blame AMD, and I find that extremely unprofessional.
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#167 - 2012-10-11 12:48:22 UTC
Teh Minez0r wrote:
I can't only blame ATI on this one as none of my other games neither crash nor lock up the whole system.

Mad B0mber wrote:
other games i play work fine


then you're lucky you dont play games which DO lock up with ATIs. Fact is its is NOT only eve having issues. Had lockups with Tribes Ascend too, so its at least another one.

Teh Minez0r wrote:

Anyway, that's ***ing ridiculous that there's obviously still no fix for this problem yet.

yep, blame ATI

Saber Coombs wrote:

And it's the game developers responsibility to use the drivers in a correct way.

got stuck in time in 1992?
Software isnt programmed for specific drivers anymore for decades. Games dont "use" drivers directly, its the operating system and HAL which interacts with drivers. You're welcome in 2012.
Saber Coombs
Deep Sea LTD.
#168 - 2012-10-11 14:36:36 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:
Bla, bla, bla


The game was working fine, CCP released a patch, game stopped working. You arguing technical details is just silly.
Mad B0mber
Novaku Inc
#169 - 2012-10-11 17:09:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Mad B0mber
So i rolled back my Ati video drivers to 12.4 from my manufacturer Gigabyte for my 7970 and so far so good.. though too soon to tell..

will update this if all goes well.. or doesn't go well



But the whole problem originally started with an Eve update.. not a video card drivers update
Teh Minez0r
Virtual Intergalactic Army
#170 - 2012-10-12 01:47:51 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:
Teh Minez0r wrote:
I can't only blame ATI on this one as none of my other games neither crash nor lock up the whole system.

Mad B0mber wrote:
other games i play work fine


then you're lucky you dont play games which DO lock up with ATIs. Fact is its is NOT only eve having issues. Had lockups with Tribes Ascend too, so its at least another one.

[quote=Teh Minez0r]
Anyway, that's ***ing ridiculous that there's obviously still no fix for this problem yet.

yep, blame ATI

Nope. Since CCP and Blizzard (WoW) use their own engine, I won't blame AMD for this cuz obviously the engines break the systems and not the driver. And I got like 200 games on steam, tested with around 50 and there's no problem with any of it.
Mad B0mber
Novaku Inc
#171 - 2012-10-12 05:59:11 UTC
Mad B0mber wrote:
So i rolled back my Ati video drivers to 12.4 from my manufacturer Gigabyte for my 7970 and so far so good.. though too soon to tell..

will update this if all goes well.. or doesn't go well



But the whole problem originally started with an Eve update.. not a video card drivers update




nope rolling back to 12.4 CCC drivers was of no use.. still full lockup.. Shocked

well time to play every other game that i have that works well without crashing on my 7970..
Teh Minez0r
Virtual Intergalactic Army
#172 - 2012-10-12 08:15:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Teh Minez0r
Interesting post here on tera-europe forums:

Quote:
The problem with the 7970 card total lockup, only happen on an i7 socket 1366 or 2011 system, 1156 and 1155 is fine.
When it happen the VDDC voltage on the GPU drop to 0,5V and it freeze, when testing with an Radeon 6970 the VDDC never drop when playing. And when testing the 7970 card on an AM3 Phenom system, there is no issues and the VDDC is stable as well.
There is not any log or anything when this happen, as the system total lockup. I have not tested 12.6 beta and 12.7 beta so don't know if they work.

I'am not using the card anymore, but I was able to replicate the problem in other games as well. Shogun Total War 2 was the best at crashing, with high setting it only last 5-10 sec before total lockup.
I got my money back for my Radeon 7970 card, so can't do any testing on it anymore, the shop I bought it from was able to replicate the crash, with 3 Radeon 7970 of different brand and on both a Asus and Gigabyte socket 2011 motherboard.

source: https://forum.tera-europe.com/showthread.php?t=72574&page=8

There's also a solution posted, though I can't try it atm since I wiped eve of the hdd for a reinstallation:

Quote:
Hey guys I have been playing TERA for 2 days and I had the same problem about random pc black out = "crash"
not to desktop crash but PC crash that only hard reboot work... so
I tried all the methods that was posted about updating drivers and etc..also tried the visual memory method but nothing solved the problem.

Now my solution is simple It may look stupid but It's really gonna work for these symptoms..

1- Start - control panel
2- Hardware and sound
3-Power options
4-Balanced - change plan settings
5- Put "turn off the display" to NEVER
and "put the computer to sleep" to NEVER.and don't forget to save changes.

that's it ... enjoy

source: https://forum.tera-europe.com/showthread.php?t=115675

edit: After reinstalling eve I didn't have a crash yet, although I have to admit I was around just 15mins. Anyway used this to log the voltages of my 7970 (oc'd it btw to 1000 / 1500 on stock voltage through CCC) with gpu-z. The default voltage for the gpu (vddc) should be 1.175v afaik. Mine jumped around (at the 1ghz clock btw) between 1.125v to 1.162v. Seems like the card still trottles th
Pigeonholed
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#173 - 2012-10-12 15:56:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Pigeonholed
@Teh Minez0r

I was aware of this attempted fix and it does not work for my machine. I am one of the 7970 users and I have the unfortunately i7 920 CPU/socket combination.

For me...the easiest way to check to see if the issue is resolved is to open the star map. At BEST I've had about 5 seconds before my machine completely locks up and requires a hard reboot. Matter of fact I was theory crafting about not having sufficient power on my own, but the mentioned solution, to set "put computer to sleep: Never" does not work.

I'm still in a 'wait and see' mode to see if the newer set of drivers will address the issue. Honestly I'd just like to see AMD acknowledge that there is a serious issue, CCP already has and they're doing what they can on their side to see it addressed as well.

For the hell of it I've enabled Graphics OVerdrive in the catalyst CC and bumped the power control settings to 10% to see if that makes a difference. I'll edit the post to see if I get to reboot in a bit.

Edit, 1105 AM CDT: Logged in, hit F10, map loaded in a second, tried to move the mouse and the hanging midi of doom struck. Complete system freeze requiring a reboot.

I've done the works, submitted issue to CCP and AMD per the links earlier in the thread and the in game bug report...all i can do is wait since I don't feel like dropping another 500 bucks on a top of the line Nvidia card atm.

Happy hunting to all those who can play the game!
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#174 - 2012-10-12 18:06:30 UTC
Saber Coombs wrote:
The game was working fine, CCP released a patch, game stopped working. You arguing technical details is just silly.

"I dont care about facts how things work, just want to rant"

Teh Minez0r wrote:

Nope. Since CCP and Blizzard (WoW) use their own engine, I won't blame AMD for this cuz obviously the engines break the systems and not the driver. And I got like 200 games on steam, tested with around 50 and there's no problem with any of it.

yeah I tested like all of my 4375 games and at least half of them crashed with ATI. All legit.

Teh Minez0r wrote:
Interesting post here on tera-europe forums:

here we go. Its probably CCPs fault I guess other games freezing too in the same manner. You guys fail at understanding basics
Teh Minez0r
Virtual Intergalactic Army
#175 - 2012-10-13 08:36:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Teh Minez0r
Quote:
I was aware of this attempted fix and it does not work for my machine. I am one of the 7970 users and I have the unfortunately i7 920 CPU/socket combination.

For me...the easiest way to check to see if the issue is resolved is to open the star map. At BEST I've had about 5 seconds before my machine completely locks up and requires a hard reboot. Matter of fact I was theory crafting about not having sufficient power on my own, but the mentioned solution, to set "put computer to sleep: Never" does not work.

I'm still in a 'wait and see' mode to see if the newer set of drivers will address the issue. Honestly I'd just like to see AMD acknowledge that there is a serious issue, CCP already has and they're doing what they can on their side to see it addressed as well.

For the hell of it I've enabled Graphics OVerdrive in the catalyst CC and bumped the power control settings to 10% to see if that makes a difference. I'll edit the post to see if I get to reboot in a bit.

Edit, 1105 AM CDT: Logged in, hit F10, map loaded in a second, tried to move the mouse and the hanging midi of doom struck. Complete system freeze requiring a reboot.

I've done the works, submitted issue to CCP and AMD per the links earlier in the thread and the in game bug report...all i can do is wait since I don't feel like dropping another 500 bucks on a top of the line Nvidia card atm.

Happy hunting to all those who can play the game!

Same here, running the hd7970 on an asus p6t6 ws revolution working together with an i7 920 aswell. Will post later if anything changed but the 15 mins yesterday have been a success already for me.

Robert Caldera wrote:
Saber Coombs wrote:
The game was working fine, CCP released a patch, game stopped working. You arguing technical details is just silly.

"I dont care about facts how things work, just want to rant"

Teh Minez0r wrote:

Nope. Since CCP and Blizzard (WoW) use their own engine, I won't blame AMD for this cuz obviously the engines break the systems and not the driver. And I got like 200 games on steam, tested with around 50 and there's no problem with any of it.

yeah I tested like all of my 4375 games and at least half of them crashed with ATI. All legit.

Teh Minez0r wrote:
Interesting post here on tera-europe forums:

here we go. Its probably CCPs fault I guess other games freezing too in the same manner. You guys fail at understanding basics


The only one ranting is you. Dunno if u get paid by ccp or nvidia for crying "ati is ****, it's all ati's fault, don't buy it!", doesn't matter anyway. Prolly just keep of this thread as you aren't helpful but just trolling here. I've never written that I checked like 4k games, I told you what I know about the games I'm playing from time to time beside eve. And if you would at least read a post once completely, you'd have seen that I've pointed at the engines of the games. As ppl also complain about this problem without changing any drivers, this doesn't add up.

So, just try to help or troll another thread plox.
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#176 - 2012-10-13 12:35:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Robert Caldera
Teh Minez0r wrote:
I've never written that I checked like 4k games, I told you what I know about the games I'm playing from time to time beside eve

from time to time. what the f**** does this prove??
My eve didnt crash for 5 hours playing when I didnt use the starmap (which is rarely needed in game anyways), then after 5hours or even longer PC freezed. So 50 games you play from times to times which arent crashing when you occasionally start and play them for 1h does mean fly sh*t in regards to the issuein question.

Simply understand the concept of how software is written today. There is application software, there is operating system including HAL , there are hardware drivers and in the end is the hardware itself. Application software developers dont give a f*ck about hardware its running on, because it doesnt need to know that. So even if CCP added something to their game which certain types of devices/drivers cant cope with, its not their deal.

ATI should fix the driver but they dont give a f*ck because you still buy their cr*p.
Saber Coombs
Deep Sea LTD.
#177 - 2012-10-13 13:56:50 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:
Saber Coombs wrote:
The game was working fine, CCP released a patch, game stopped working. You arguing technical details is just silly.

"I dont care about facts how things work, just want to rant"


Pretty funny, since you keep ignoring the most obvious fact.
Teh Minez0r
Virtual Intergalactic Army
#178 - 2012-10-13 15:47:47 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:


ATI should fix the driver but they dont give a f*ck because you still buy their cr*p.

First of all - will you, by any chance, finally realize that it's AMD and not ATI? Dunno how often you mixed them yet but it's seriously not that hard...

And I still can't see that you have proven in any way that it's AMD's fault, could also be a **** up in Intel's chipset(s) (driver)... But - go on fanboy...
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#179 - 2012-10-14 11:02:40 UTC
Saber Coombs wrote:
Pretty funny, since you keep ignoring the most obvious fact.

what is the most obvious fact?

Teh Minez0r wrote:

And I still can't see that you have proven in any way that it's AMD's fault, could also be a **** up in Intel's chipset(s) (driver)... But - go on fanboy...

yeah maybe its intels chipset drivers fault no idea, certainly its not CCPs fault.
Teh Minez0r
Virtual Intergalactic Army
#180 - 2012-10-14 16:17:06 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:

Teh Minez0r wrote:

And I still can't see that you have proven in any way that it's AMD's fault, could also be a **** up in Intel's chipset(s) (driver)... But - go on fanboy...

yeah maybe its intels chipset drivers fault no idea, certainly its not CCPs fault.

Though I'm wondering how the drivers work with earlier cards but not with the 7k series... I'd understand it if the 7k driver was only for this series, but it's for all from 5k series on. Doesn't make sense in my eyes.