These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Ships & Modules

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
12Next page
 

Max drone dps?
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Katsihiro
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-10-11 07:19:54 UTC
I'm looking for a fitting for a subcapital ship that provides the max drone dps with all skills to V.
A pure "drone dps" ship, no tank and no guns. Let's say for an alt to assist l4 missions.

Also, if I fit a dominix with 7 DDA II, I get 749 dps from gardes II. If I then add 1 or 2 SDA I rigs I still get the same dps.
How come SDA rigs have no effect? I guess it's a penalty issue but since I'm kind of new to EVE, I dont know exactly how it works.
Abannan
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-10-11 07:23:01 UTC
after 3 DDa's, you're starting to run into all sort of stacking issues, with 7 DDA's you'll be doing less damage then with 3 DDA's, so don't go ott with them.
I'd suggest 3 DDA's, 2 tracking links, 2 sentry rigs
Katsihiro
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-10-11 07:44:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Katsihiro
Your suggestion would get 719 dps (according to pyfa) so 7 DDA's are better + the option to use other rigs.

Actually every DDA increases dps. Lets say with 5 gardes

0 x DDA II = 450 dps
1 x DDA II = 536 dps
2 x DDA II = 624 dps
3 x DDA II = 692 dps
4 x DDA II = 729 dps
5 x DDA II = 743 dps
6 x DDA II = 748 dps
7 x DDA II = 749 dps

After that, SDA rigs have no effect.
So the question remains: is 749 dps the most damage you can get just from drones?

PS. which rigs would be most usefull?
Klymer
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2012-10-11 08:14:10 UTC
heavy drones will do more damage than sentries thanks to the specialization skills.
Maeltstome
Ten Thousand Days
#5 - 2012-10-11 08:31:41 UTC
Ogre II's with 3x DDA and you hit about 700 dps.
Katsihiro
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-10-11 08:36:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Katsihiro
700 is less than 749 dps :) We are talking about max dps here no matter the modules.

Ogres get 790 dps with 7 DDA's but having to travel from target to target makes them worse than the 749 dps gardes for most missions.
Mycael
Air
The Initiative.
#7 - 2012-10-11 08:45:38 UTC
Katsihiro wrote:
PS. which rigs would be most usefull?


Scopes. Large Drone Scope Chip I(I).
feihcsiM
THE B0YS
#8 - 2012-10-11 11:36:42 UTC
Ship fitting screen lists my all level V missioner as a sliver under 800dps (786 iirc?) with garde IIs in a rattler with 4 DDA IIs.

It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine.
Marcus Gideon
Triglavian Assembly
#9 - 2012-10-11 16:43:16 UTC
Katsihiro wrote:
I guess it's a penalty issue but since I'm kind of new to EVE, I dont know exactly how it works.

Right here, you need to stop arguing with seasoned players, and listen to advice. =)

EFT is not Eve... So whatever numbers EFT tells you, are not written in stone. Bear that in mind.

"Penalty: Using more than one type of this module or similar modules that affect the same attribute on the ship will be penalized."

This is why having 7 DDA is not going to do anything for you. And why adding Sentry rigs does nothing further. EFT may not be calculating the extra DDAs properly yet, but actual gameplay certainly will.

In general, 3 modules applied to a stat is the best you'll get before you start wasting slots with very little actually gained.

So yes, you could fit 7 in-game... or you could fit 3, and have slots left for tank and such.
Mishra Ninghor2
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2012-10-11 16:51:23 UTC
I just wanna say this in short about the subject, no ship should ever use more then 3 DDAs. They scale way worse then other damage modules.
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2012-10-11 17:03:37 UTC
Also, the actual power of each shot landed by any weapon (turret, missile, or drone) does vary from shot to shot. Once you're past three damage mods (roughly speaking), the theoretical DPS you gain from each additional damage mod is less than the per-shot variation you see from your weapons, so, effectively, those slots taken up by extra damage mods might as well be empty.

Actually, they'd be more use empty, because they're chewing up CPU and powergrid and not giving you anything worthwhile in return.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt
Doddy
Excidium.
#12 - 2012-10-11 17:04:12 UTC
Actually EFT is showing it fine. 7 DDA do have an effect. It is just number 7 is doing a whole 1dps more damage (completely irrelevant). The sentry rig on top is into the 7th stacking pen so while it does increase dps, it is by less than 1 dps so eft (and the game or pretty much anything else) rounds it down as having no effect.

What the op needs to remember here is that damage application is far more important than raw dps, so if fitting anything else in that low slot would help application it would be better. This is certainly the case with the rig slots. For low slots a pure dps assist doesn't really need anything else in the lows, though anyone sane would fit some tank and 7 DDAs may leave cpu issues preventing the fitting of omnis or link augmenters.

Given that come winter rats will switch target there you will definately need a proper tank on a dps assist tank and having 7 DDAs then will be even more pointless and probably getyou killed. In most cases the 4th mod effecting a stat is the last one there is any point fitting and raraely is there any big advantage over a third.

Really op you want 4 mods/rigs that effect damage, 4 mods/rigs that effect range and/or tracking, enough drone control range for what you want to do. After that fill it in with a prop md and tank.

[Dominix, dps assist]
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Damage Control II
Large Armor Repairer II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II

Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
100MN Afterburner II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II

Drone Link Augmentor II
Drone Link Augmentor II
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Drone Durability Enhancer I


Garde II x5

4 highs to play with. Tank is emergency only, needs more once rats start target switching.
Ginger Barbarella
#13 - 2012-10-11 17:23:02 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
Also, the actual power of each shot landed by any weapon (turret, missile, or drone) does vary from shot to shot. Once you're past three damage mods (roughly speaking), the theoretical DPS you gain from each additional damage mod is less than the per-shot variation you see from your weapons, so, effectively, those slots taken up by extra damage mods might as well be empty.

Actually, they'd be more use empty, because they're chewing up CPU and powergrid and not giving you anything worthwhile in return.


Good post.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Katsihiro
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-10-11 19:52:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Katsihiro
Thanks for the replies.

I just want to clarify that I'm not actually looking for a viable mission support ship. It's more like a test on drone damage.
That's why I don't want any tank or propulsion modules fitted. ONLY drone upgrades to see how far dps can go and which ship will provide it.

I'm not really taking eft too seriously, just looking stats. It doesn't matter if an additional DDA offers only 1 dps. Surely it would be completely waste of slots in real combat but not the issue here.

So... (in theory always) is a Domi with 7 DDA's II + 5 Omni's II + 3 DSC II rigs + Gardes II, the ship with the most pure drone damage or is it something else?
Even if the difference is 1 dps.

Again, not looking for a viable fitting so don't take tank or speed into consideration.
Tbh, I'm training my alt for a sentry ishtar to help with missions.
Framer Otsada
Silencer corp
#15 - 2012-10-11 20:28:25 UTC
You can't just say. It's still depended on many things. For example drone damage is only 1 type but although you can change the damage drones do with the type , tracking real dps arent the same. So in conclusion .. eft dps has nothing to do with real dps. You need to support us what you will hit , will it move ? What is the range you will have and of course travel time ? Some times sentries are faster although heavy do more damage. Also whst sort of dps you need ? differs if you need large alpha so you dont lose 1 cycle
Zyella Stormborn
Green Seekers
#16 - 2012-10-11 22:00:29 UTC
Doddy above gave you the best your going to get, going by what you want. If you truly want to pull another 3-7 dps out of it, and you can fit it, sure, put on a couple more dda's. But your original post did not say you wanted pure theoretical-to-the-1-point-regardless-of-usefulneess. Your post said
Katsihiro wrote:

A pure "drone dps" ship, no tank and no guns. Let's say for an alt to assist l4 missions.


So you got replies from people that know the game. Well. That gave you a FUNCTIONAL fit for an assist on L4 missions. .... and you argued it.... and now you just want to theory craft some paper eft dps...

ugh. o.0

~Z

There is a special Hell for people like that, Right next to child molestors, and people that talk in the theater. ~Firefly
Katsihiro
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2012-10-11 22:45:28 UTC
I didn't argue. Doddy's fitting is great.

As you quoted I said NO tank.
I wanted an "all drone modules" fitting, something I explained a little better on a later post.
I thought a ship like that would be by definition "theoretical" since it wouldn't be viable for most missions.
I said "Let's say for an alt to assist l4 missions" cause it could probably be usefull in a couple of misions.

Misunderstanding perhaps.

Anyway, as Framer Otsada said there are a lot of variables to take into consideration in order to have a good answer.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#18 - 2012-10-11 23:07:41 UTC
Katsihiro wrote:
So... (in theory always) is a Domi with 7 DDA's II + 5 Omni's II + 3 DSC II rigs + Gardes II, the ship with the most pure drone damage or is it something else?
Even if the difference is 1 dps.


Wait, wait. Didn't you reject Ogre IIs because they're impractical? Because they're going to have the highest paper DPS and it looks like that's what you're going for now.

If you stick with Garde IIs you actually want a Domi, 7 DDA IIs, and 2 SDA Is. The additional DPS from the SDAs is negligible (think fractional gains) but still real.

Since omnis don't add to paper DPS they can safely be ignored for this experiment.

Or you could go full ****** and fit a Nyx the same way -- except with more drones.
Marcus Gideon
Triglavian Assembly
#19 - 2012-10-12 02:56:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Marcus Gideon
Theorycrafting, with no practice application under the sun...

A Domi with 7x DDA II... no applicable rigs, no mid slots, no high slots, and a full wing of 5x Ogre IIs will do 790dps at max skills.

A Domi with 7x DDA II, 2x Sentry Damage I rigs (all that will fit with the Calibration cost), no mids, no highs, and a full wing of 5x Garde II does 749 dps at max skills.


Again, just theorycraft... but the Ogres get more DPS than Garde, at max skills. The reason being, even with the extra oomph from the Sentry rig, the Gallente Drone Spec skill factors into the Ogre DPS, but not the Garde.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2012-10-12 05:17:51 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Katsihiro wrote:
So... (in theory always) is a Domi with 7 DDA's II + 5 Omni's II + 3 DSC II rigs + Gardes II, the ship with the most pure drone damage or is it something else?
Even if the difference is 1 dps.


Wait, wait. Didn't you reject Ogre IIs because they're impractical? Because they're going to have the highest paper DPS and it looks like that's what you're going for now.

If you stick with Garde IIs you actually want a Domi, 7 DDA IIs, and 2 SDA Is. The additional DPS from the SDAs is negligible (think fractional gains) but still real.

Since omnis don't add to paper DPS they can safely be ignored for this experiment.

Or you could go full ****** and fit a Nyx the same way -- except with more drones.


Full tard with a x5 DCU Nyx x20 fighter bombers you are talking something like 11,000-12,000 DPS.
.....well assuming you are shooting at battleships or something big and not moving.

For fun a Thanny with 15 sentries can do near 1500

Neither is practical and would get you flamed hard.

Shield gank Ndomi with blasters can reach 1200dps, but you need an alt with a scimi to rep it, you are going to be hard pressed to get an active tank on that you pulse more then three times with the guns going.
12Next page