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Any Japanese players here or players who are familiar with Japan's economy?

Author
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2012-10-10 18:29:50 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:
Webvan wrote:
Brujo Loco wrote:
colleagues that frown on him getting about 15 to 30 mins earlier before OFFICIAL work hours, since everybody is at least 1 to 2 hours earlier than him.
Oh that's for sure. I had a Japanese boss for about six years. He would come in hours early and stay late every day. Me I'd be there just for the bell and at the end of the shift I'd be on the starting line like everyone else for that sprint to the door lol. I realized that those were all the bunglers, with all their write-ups and poor reviews. Their work was flawed, full of errors and waste, trying to increase production beyond their skills. It's how I was trained.

So I slowed down, started to raise my quality, and I got a lot of flack for it from others below my boss. Yet when reviews came around, I got a sterling review since I had the lowest reject count overall, saving the company a lot of money yet staying on quota. He then suggested that I come in early every day, stay a little longer. I said what the heck, so I did, lots of OT. I'd come in an hour early, sometimes two, stay a little later. Wound up getting promotion after promotion, becoming one of highest payed employees, advanced training (setup - programming) paid by the company, in charge of many of those bunglers, and my own machine shop (robotics shop) in charge of two shifts. Extra money paid for college too :D computer science etc.

Yeah, they are infused with outrageous work ethic, he grew up in Japan, talked about it a lot. Of course if you play their game while everyone else does their own thing, you go places for sure. I see how that is expected in Japan, the norm, so would be hard to stand out doing the same there.

I am sorry, but when I saw that you got lots of overtime, that is where alarm bells started to ring. I just don't see any sane supervisor encouraging overtime in the current economic situation. Before 2008 it might have worked. These days, not so much.

I think generally overtime pays time and a half. So if you make 10 dollars per hour. Overtime would pay 10+5=15 dollars per hour. Lots of overtime will get real expansive real quick for the company. That is why companies generally discourage overtime.


I get tons of overtime, but that's because I'm 28 in a job that's mostly stupid 18 year olds (back in university, don't judge me!) that like to not come in so I take all their shifts Cool

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2012-10-10 18:40:23 UTC
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
Caleidascope wrote:
Webvan wrote:
Brujo Loco wrote:
colleagues that frown on him getting about 15 to 30 mins earlier before OFFICIAL work hours, since everybody is at least 1 to 2 hours earlier than him.
Oh that's for sure. I had a Japanese boss for about six years. He would come in hours early and stay late every day. Me I'd be there just for the bell and at the end of the shift I'd be on the starting line like everyone else for that sprint to the door lol. I realized that those were all the bunglers, with all their write-ups and poor reviews. Their work was flawed, full of errors and waste, trying to increase production beyond their skills. It's how I was trained.

So I slowed down, started to raise my quality, and I got a lot of flack for it from others below my boss. Yet when reviews came around, I got a sterling review since I had the lowest reject count overall, saving the company a lot of money yet staying on quota. He then suggested that I come in early every day, stay a little longer. I said what the heck, so I did, lots of OT. I'd come in an hour early, sometimes two, stay a little later. Wound up getting promotion after promotion, becoming one of highest payed employees, advanced training (setup - programming) paid by the company, in charge of many of those bunglers, and my own machine shop (robotics shop) in charge of two shifts. Extra money paid for college too :D computer science etc.

Yeah, they are infused with outrageous work ethic, he grew up in Japan, talked about it a lot. Of course if you play their game while everyone else does their own thing, you go places for sure. I see how that is expected in Japan, the norm, so would be hard to stand out doing the same there.

I am sorry, but when I saw that you got lots of overtime, that is where alarm bells started to ring. I just don't see any sane supervisor encouraging overtime in the current economic situation. Before 2008 it might have worked. These days, not so much.

I think generally overtime pays time and a half. So if you make 10 dollars per hour. Overtime would pay 10+5=15 dollars per hour. Lots of overtime will get real expansive real quick for the company. That is why companies generally discourage overtime.


I get tons of overtime, but that's because I'm 28 in a job that's mostly stupid 18 year olds (back in university, don't judge me!) that like to not come in so I take all their shifts Cool

Right. See, your company has a problem with employees not showing up for work. So the company is desperate, so they let you work overtime. The overtime you get is sign of desperation of your employer. I have been in situations like that, someone called in sick, so with permission from my supervisor I stayed after my shift ended and worked overtime. But these situations are exceptions. To allow overtime when there is no emergency is not normal.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Webvan
All Kill No Skill
#23 - 2012-10-10 18:50:22 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:

I am sorry, but when I saw that you got lots of overtime, that is where alarm bells started to ring. I just don't see any sane supervisor encouraging overtime in the current economic situation. Before 2008 it might have worked. These days, not so much.

I think generally overtime pays time and a half. So if you make 10 dollars per hour. Overtime would pay 10+5=15 dollars per hour. Lots of overtime will get real expansive real quick for the company. That is why companies generally discourage overtime.

So I'm lying? lol
I was with the company for seven years and it was for a time on the Forbes top 20 small business list. A telecommunications company. Got ruined though, after a couple very poor CEO turnovers. Yep, not only time and a half, but I was making that w/o OT compared to my peers on avg. OT is actually cheaper than hiring more employees, and while temp workers always tend to be unskilled for certain positions. Just like programming for various development studios, star programmers are worth their weight in gold, you can't just replace them on a whim.

I'm in it for the money

Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12

Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2012-10-10 19:08:53 UTC
I just picked up 2 extra shifts this weekend Big smile

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2012-10-10 20:57:43 UTC
Webvan wrote:

So I'm lying? lol

I don't think so.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Selinate
#26 - 2012-10-10 22:14:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Selinate
Brujo Loco wrote:
Well, my only part in this thread will be to warn you a bit about what to expect in Japan. I have a friend that has been working there for the past year for a big Japanese corp and I dont know if its a LatinAmerican/Japanese culture clash thing only or it pertains to a more western vs eastern mentality.

Thing is, Japan blows if you are used to do things a ... "certain way".

Japan, specially working culture, is very very formal, stiff and unyielding, and my friend, which can be described as a workhorse in the American continent is frowned upon as not working too hard there, not due to sheer output or performance, but due to several differences in how work is treated.

I coud rant on about how he describes to me how he wants to skullf**** some of his colleagues that frown on him getting about 15 to 30 mins earlier before OFFICIAL work hours, since everybody is at least 1 to 2 hours earlier than him. How he has to leave at a certain hour after the boss has left in order of hierarchy and the funny music that plays off his puter telling people that its time to leave since work has officially ended and the game of who leaves first (losing face) begins.

He has proceeded to describe me the "school like recess" employees are given during lunchtime, and how he is observed from afar by the directors and managers that sit apart from regular workers. The cultural clash in Kobe of how he has gotten hard stares and sometimes outcries from people at stores from pretending to give them money with his filthy unwashed foreigner hands instead of using the money tray next to the register.

How alienated he is by the fact of using 2 sets of japanese symbols, specially in media (he works in that department) and how advertising is focused on getting a second level of meaning on a product instead of a more frontal one (kinda hard to explain here but you will know what Im talking about if u lived in Japan)

He also proceeds to tell me about the utter worship of the state of being "GENKI" and how it affects how you are treated and how you should treat yourself when around others, including the utter morbid and monstrous like (to him and me anyway) of personal space and physical contact. I have lived in the US, I know what personal space is, it clashes wildly with the way northamericans think of it, and is awful to latinamericans.

Im not saying its a bad place, or that is wrong for you to go there, mostly a small warning regarding what to expect from the CULTURE more than the country.

This could be better understood regarding their way if you delve more into the Paris Syndrome , when classical Japanese people go almost Psychotic on chaotic places like Paris ... and for me, as a Latinamerican Paris was the peak of order and perfection in tiny details (I hate Paris) so In a sense my friend passed through a phase of "Kobe Syndrome" XD, since we come from the opposite spectrum.

Its a stiffling, suffocating society (to us, to my friend by being there and me by proxy for empathizing and having to listen to him more or less daily).

Social interactions can be akward, specially when dealing with women and its a topic I will avoid since its a bit offtopic.

Its not the work, nor the environment, its a wonderful looking place, everything fits and you are not supposed to change it, it is clean, extremely clean place, and you are not supposed to taint it.

Thats more or less the TLDR

Hope it helps ... I will ask my friend if he knows anyplace there where someone can employ you (just remember Japan is super expensive so a good salary to you might be barely above minimum wage"


I've heard about a lot of this, some of it is daunting, but I'm still unphased. I only live once and **** me if I live in the U.S. for the rest of my life. As far as work goes, I was more interested in working for an American or European company that has a branch there, after I get an education in a different field of course. I'd make a lot more money that way from what I hear anyway, it just depends on what I look for and apply for.

TY very much for asking your friend that, I'll look forward to hearing about it.
Jada Maroo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2012-10-10 22:38:32 UTC
Just bring a suitcase full of worn panties in ziplock bags and use them for barter.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2012-10-11 00:28:07 UTC
Jada Maroo wrote:
Just bring a suitcase full of worn panties in ziplock bags and use them for barter.


Damn, why didn't I think of that? Sad

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2012-10-11 00:49:27 UTC
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
Jada Maroo wrote:
Just bring a suitcase full of worn panties in ziplock bags and use them for barter.


Damn, why didn't I think of that? Sad

You have higher standards.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2012-10-11 00:51:01 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
Jada Maroo wrote:
Just bring a suitcase full of worn panties in ziplock bags and use them for barter.


Damn, why didn't I think of that? Sad

You have higher standards.


Never been accused of that before What?

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Alice Saki
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#31 - 2012-10-11 09:14:27 UTC
Mars Theran wrote:
There's Saki production



Cool

FREEZE! Drop the LIKES AND WALK AWAY! - Currenly rebuilding gaming machine, I will Return.

Telegram Sam
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2012-10-11 19:30:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Telegram Sam
If you want to teach conversational English, there's probably a job for you somewhere in Japan. You don't need any special qualifications, other than a Bachelor's and being a native English speaker. The English conversation schools will hire about anyone. The Japan Exchange and Teaching (JET) Program(me) has higher standards and higher pay. It's run by the Foreign Ministry and Interior Ministry, I think. They also bring speakers of other European languages as language teachers.

Other than teaching your native language, it's really, really hard to get a job in Japan. First of all, you need a visa, and for a visa, you need a sponsor. Fish-gutting or burger-flipping jobs might be plentiful, but nobody in those kinds of industries is going to sponsor some Western foreigner to do that. And even if you're already in Japan and have learned the language, local companies aren't much interested in hiring foreigners. They have their own pipeline for recruiting employees, and as some foreign guy off the street, you're definitely outside the pipeline. Besides that, there's a conception that Westerners are trouble in the workplace-- they don't like the long hours, they complain about having tea instead of coffee, they file sexual harassment complaints, etc. etc. The only foreigners with professional jobs in Japan I've seen were transferees. They worked for some company in their home country, then got transferred to the Tokyo office.

Anyway, if you don't mind teaching English, the life of a teacher in Japan can be really fun. Not a lot of responsibility, Enough pay to live on, plenty of opportunities to meet people and learn the language. The JET Program is an especially good deal.
Eli Green
The Arrow Project
#33 - 2012-10-11 20:26:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Eli Green
MinefieldS wrote:
rodyas wrote:
Could become a fisherman.


Catch octopi and squid and you'll become a billionaire!


fixed it for ya :)

wumbo

Selinate
#34 - 2012-10-12 00:13:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Selinate
Telegram Sam wrote:
If you want to teach conversational English, there's probably a job for you somewhere in Japan. You don't need any special qualifications, other than a Bachelor's and being a native English speaker. The English conversation schools will hire about anyone. The Japan Exchange and Teaching (JET) Program(me) has higher standards and higher pay. It's run by the Foreign Ministry and Interior Ministry, I think. They also bring speakers of other European languages as language teachers.

Other than teaching your native language, it's really, really hard to get a job in Japan. First of all, you need a visa, and for a visa, you need a sponsor. Fish-gutting or burger-flipping jobs might be plentiful, but nobody in those kinds of industries is going to sponsor some Western foreigner to do that. And even if you're already in Japan and have learned the language, local companies aren't much interested in hiring foreigners. They have their own pipeline for recruiting employees, and as some foreign guy off the street, you're definitely outside the pipeline. Besides that, there's a conception that Westerners are trouble in the workplace-- they don't like the long hours, they complain about having tea instead of coffee, they file sexual harassment complaints, etc. etc. The only foreigners with professional jobs in Japan I've seen were transferees. They worked for some company in their home country, then got transferred to the Tokyo office.

Anyway, if you don't mind teaching English, the life of a teacher in Japan can be really fun. Not a lot of responsibility, Enough pay to live on, plenty of opportunities to meet people and learn the language. The JET Program is an especially good deal.


With my background and future plans, this was my exact plan originally, only instead of transferring I'd rather just apply directly to that branch of the company. I was also looking for alternatives, just to see what possibilities there were. I'd possibly look at GE if I want to continue the kind of work I already do, or do something else in maybe google or microsoft if I decide to switch backgrounds (it's difficult, but far from impossible).

However, thanks for the information. It will force me to reconsider my plan of action.
Telegram Sam
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2012-10-12 16:52:12 UTC
Selinate wrote:
Telegram Sam wrote:
If you want to teach conversational English, there's probably a job for you somewhere in Japan. You don't need any special qualifications, other than a Bachelor's and being a native English speaker. The English conversation schools will hire about anyone. The Japan Exchange and Teaching (JET) Program(me) has higher standards and higher pay. It's run by the Foreign Ministry and Interior Ministry, I think. They also bring speakers of other European languages as language teachers.

Other than teaching your native language, it's really, really hard to get a job in Japan. First of all, you need a visa, and for a visa, you need a sponsor. Fish-gutting or burger-flipping jobs might be plentiful, but nobody in those kinds of industries is going to sponsor some Western foreigner to do that. And even if you're already in Japan and have learned the language, local companies aren't much interested in hiring foreigners. They have their own pipeline for recruiting employees, and as some foreign guy off the street, you're definitely outside the pipeline. Besides that, there's a conception that Westerners are trouble in the workplace-- they don't like the long hours, they complain about having tea instead of coffee, they file sexual harassment complaints, etc. etc. The only foreigners with professional jobs in Japan I've seen were transferees. They worked for some company in their home country, then got transferred to the Tokyo office.

Anyway, if you don't mind teaching English, the life of a teacher in Japan can be really fun. Not a lot of responsibility, Enough pay to live on, plenty of opportunities to meet people and learn the language. The JET Program is an especially good deal.


With my background and future plans, this was my exact plan originally, only instead of transferring I'd rather just apply directly to that branch of the company. I was also looking for alternatives, just to see what possibilities there were. I'd possibly look at GE if I want to continue the kind of work I already do, or do something else in maybe google or microsoft if I decide to switch backgrounds (it's difficult, but far from impossible).

However, thanks for the information. It will force me to reconsider my plan of action.

In general, corporations like that don't hire internationally. What I mean is, they hire new employees locally, for work in the local office. Then when positions open in a foreign office (such as in Tokyo), they select the "best and the brightest" of the local office for a temporary transfer. A stint in a foreign office is a big resume-builder within the corporation, so foreign assignments are seen as kind of a reward. So getting hired directly by a corporation's foreign office is very difficult. But, this is of course just the general pattern. Not every corporation is the same, so I don't at all mean to discourage you. Good luck with it!
Becka Goldbeck
#36 - 2012-10-13 13:54:07 UTC
Selinate wrote:
I have a simple wish. I want to move to Japan at some point just for the life experience. However, I need a job over there, so I need to know if anyone knows any industries/markets that are growing out there that actually have a good forecast for the future? Nothing is off limits, and it doesn't have to be a Japanese company that I work at.


You could teach English. Since you provided no information about what you do that would be an easy one. You won't make that much but at least you'll be able to live in Japan. One thing you should know though is that's they're very xenophobic even against whites. You probably won't be openly harassed (although this has happened) but you may become uncomfortable, maybe not though.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#37 - 2012-10-13 14:04:55 UTC
Selinate wrote:
Telegram Sam wrote:
If you want to teach conversational English, there's probably a job for you somewhere in Japan. You don't need any special qualifications, other than a Bachelor's and being a native English speaker. The English conversation schools will hire about anyone. The Japan Exchange and Teaching (JET) Program(me) has higher standards and higher pay. It's run by the Foreign Ministry and Interior Ministry, I think. They also bring speakers of other European languages as language teachers.

Other than teaching your native language, it's really, really hard to get a job in Japan. First of all, you need a visa, and for a visa, you need a sponsor. Fish-gutting or burger-flipping jobs might be plentiful, but nobody in those kinds of industries is going to sponsor some Western foreigner to do that. And even if you're already in Japan and have learned the language, local companies aren't much interested in hiring foreigners. They have their own pipeline for recruiting employees, and as some foreign guy off the street, you're definitely outside the pipeline. Besides that, there's a conception that Westerners are trouble in the workplace-- they don't like the long hours, they complain about having tea instead of coffee, they file sexual harassment complaints, etc. etc. The only foreigners with professional jobs in Japan I've seen were transferees. They worked for some company in their home country, then got transferred to the Tokyo office.

Anyway, if you don't mind teaching English, the life of a teacher in Japan can be really fun. Not a lot of responsibility, Enough pay to live on, plenty of opportunities to meet people and learn the language. The JET Program is an especially good deal.


With my background and future plans, this was my exact plan originally, only instead of transferring I'd rather just apply directly to that branch of the company. I was also looking for alternatives, just to see what possibilities there were. I'd possibly look at GE if I want to continue the kind of work I already do, or do something else in maybe google or microsoft if I decide to switch backgrounds (it's difficult, but far from impossible).

However, thanks for the information. It will force me to reconsider my plan of action.


I'd visit first if you've never been there, some things about Japan I don't like... like how the police can throw you in a cage and starve you until you confess to something you may not even have done. Same reason I love Russia but I sure as hell won't move there P

Also I don't trust quiet people that won't look you in the eye, they're up to something Straight

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#38 - 2012-10-13 19:57:38 UTC
One of the better jobs you can get in japan is actually teaching English Speaking, where all you have to do is help japanese students annoucate and talk smoothly.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.

Selinate
#39 - 2012-10-14 00:49:52 UTC
Becka Goldbeck wrote:


You could teach English. Since you provided no information about what you do that would be an easy one. You won't make that much but at least you'll be able to live in Japan. One thing you should know though is that's they're very xenophobic even against whites. You probably won't be openly harassed (although this has happened) but you may become uncomfortable, maybe not though.



I have provided info about what I do. I'm an engineer at a nuclear power plant.
Milton von Friedman
Doomheim
#40 - 2012-10-14 02:43:38 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:

I am sorry, but when I saw that you got lots of overtime, that is where alarm bells started to ring. I just don't see any sane supervisor encouraging overtime in the current economic situation. Before 2008 it might have worked. These days, not so much.

I think generally overtime pays time and a half. So if you make 10 dollars per hour. Overtime would pay 10+5=15 dollars per hour. Lots of overtime will get real expansive real quick for the company. That is why companies generally discourage overtime.


It's perfectly reasonable to give overtime to productive employees, even when business is slow. I own and operate a small accounting firm and I have several high performance employees whom I am grooming for promotion, training, and giving plenty of work to.

Overtime does add up quickly, but it doesn't add up nearly to the extent of keeping clock-watching slackers on the docket. If one employee can do twice the work, at a higher standard, then I am not loosing a dime giving him time and a half; especially during a strong quarter where time is money.
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