These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

My EVE

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123Next page
 

Anyone who doesn't like this is A WoW FAN!

First post
Author
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#21 - 2012-10-10 09:27:57 UTC
I played WoW for a few years. Eight years in EVE, and about four in WoW, which I quit not too long ago. It's really not that bad of a game. The premise is entirely different from that of EVE, and the two games compete for different customers (though not lately it seems, what with CCP's obvious new direction). Beating the high-end content, especially on the highest possible difficulty, takes a lot of effort, and can result in a lot of satisfaction if you manage to do stuff that very few others will ever even see. The pvp, while inconsequential, is just as skill-intensive, and requires as much as, if not more, theorycrafting than EVE.

You can call WoW bad, but it won't be an objective statement. You have to at least provide some proof as to why it's bad, otherwise you're just trying to fit in by scoring dudebro points with the herd by bashing every possible alternative. That's not to say there aren't bad games out there, but WoW isn't exactly Big Rigs or Superman 64.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2012-10-10 09:30:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
Tippia wrote:
Solstice Project wrote:
Crack may be **** for everybody else, except the guy who takes it.
It's pretty **** for him as well, and if sarin is good for you, then you're as horrid as it is.

WoW is bad, and being able to deliver well on a selling point that is bad doesn't make it any better.

Thank you for not understanding what i have said.

I'll try again:
Consequences of actions are unrelated to actors perception of good/bad.

Crack is perceived perfect by crack addicts, while it's perceived as **** for everybody else.
Sarin is perceived as perfect for killing people in a specific way by those seeking the killings,
while it's **** for those who get killed by it.

The perception of good/bad comes from individualism and has nothing to do with facts.

Fact:
Sarin kills people.

You may perceive killing people as bad, but others might not.
Additional edit: Many equal opinions don't magically become facts.

It's wondering me that you believe opinion is fact, because that's what you're trying to communicate.
Alice Saki
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#23 - 2012-10-10 09:31:39 UTC
Can't play games like Wow

I have NO Attention span... So after Killing 5 boars (Its Boars right? South Park :P ) I'm board to tears xD

FREEZE! Drop the LIKES AND WALK AWAY! - Currenly rebuilding gaming machine, I will Return.

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#24 - 2012-10-10 09:40:05 UTC
Solstice Project wrote:
The perception of good/bad comes from individualism and has nothing to do with facts.
…and I'm not talking about the perception.

Quote:
It's wondering me that you believe opinion is fact, because that's what you're trying to communicate.
No, that's what you're saying: that WoW is good just because people perceive it as good. The fact of the matter is that it's only good at delivering something that's bad for you… just like crack and sarin gas.
Xolve
State War Academy
Caldari State
#25 - 2012-10-10 09:43:48 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
What's wrong with being a WoW fan? It's arguably a better game when it comes to delivering on its main selling points.
So do crack and sarin gas — that doesn't make them good products.


Actually it does, if you know- you're in the market for those things.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#26 - 2012-10-10 09:46:33 UTC
Tippia wrote:
The fact of the matter is that it's only good at delivering something that's bad for you… just like crack and sarin gas.

What is that?

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

Keno Skir
#27 - 2012-10-10 10:03:20 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
What's wrong with being a WoW fan? It's arguably a better game when it comes to delivering on its main selling points.


WoW is pants. Being a WoW fan makes me feel sorry for you.
Cpt Gobla
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2012-10-10 10:03:56 UTC
Tippia wrote:
No, that's what you're saying: that WoW is good just because people perceive it as good. The fact of the matter is that it's only good at delivering something that's bad for you… just like crack and sarin gas.


WoW isn't bad for you.

Being a stupid **** with no ambition to make anything of your life beyond playing a video game 18 hours a day is bad for you.

Simple difference is that if I give crack to someone who isn't an useless loser it'll still **** them up. If I give WoW to someone who isn't an useless loser they'll either remove it right away or play in a way that doesn't interfere with the rest of their lives.
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2012-10-10 10:23:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
Tippia wrote:
Solstice Project wrote:
The perception of good/bad comes from individualism and has nothing to do with facts.
…and I'm not talking about the perception.

Quote:
It's wondering me that you believe opinion is fact, because that's what you're trying to communicate.
No, that's what you're saying: that WoW is good just because people perceive it as good. The fact of the matter is that it's only good at delivering something that's bad for you… just like crack and sarin gas.


Quote:
WoW seems to be a good product for many, because it's playerbase
wants to be happy/satisfied and WoW delivers that.


Quote:
No, that's what you're saying: that WoW is good just because people perceive it as good.


You're putting words into my mouth, which makes you look rather questionable.

I never said WoW is good, because people perceive it as good.
I said that WoW is perceived as good by those who play it.

Yes, you're not talking about perception and that's the mistake you make.

You mistake your perception of something being good/bad as a fact and then project
this onto me by believing i've said "wow is good because it's perceived as good", which i haven't.

Fact: There is no good/bad outside of individual perception.

"seems to" is always relative to the observer,
while "is" is always absolute and - by many people - used as if it's connected to (f)actual reality.

Like ... roses are red. a building is big. the sun is bright. sarin is bad.
All of these are actually relative, but people use "is" as if they were talking facts.
You might be able to figure this out on your own. :)

... but if that's beyond you, then hopefully somebody else can explain it to you in a matter
that makes you see beyond your individualism and the mistake of taking perception/opinions as facts.

Edit:

Sarin kills, yes.
Is it bad ? No. Is it good ? No.
Is it perceived as bad, that sarin kills ? Totally depends on who you ask.

People use "is" ... "the sun is bright", when they should use "i perceive the sun as bright".
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#30 - 2012-10-10 10:45:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Solstice Project wrote:
"seems to" is always relative to the observer,
Yes, and that observer in this case is you. If it seems to you to be good for some set of people, then you are indeed saying that it is good.

Quote:
Sarin kills, yes.
Is it bad ?
Yes. In fact, being bad is its whole purpose of existing. If it was just a matter of killing people, there are far better ways of doing it — sarin just ensures that they die in horrible horrible ways.

Oh, and with its skinner-box:y design, archaic mechanics, simplistic story and narrative, and its outmoded tech, WoW is objectively a pretty bad game. It's the Monopoly of MMOs.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#31 - 2012-10-10 10:52:50 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Oh, and with its skinner-box:y design, archaic mechanics, simplistic story and narrative, and its outmoded tech, WoW is objectively a pretty bad game. It's the Monopoly of MMOs.

Okay well all of those are matters of opinion, except the very last one, which is a technicality.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

Veschenko
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2012-10-10 11:03:06 UTC
Ivy Romanova wrote:
Roll Sizzle Beef wrote:
Ivy Romanova wrote:

ALWAYS half assed , inception , cool boys wannabe videos that wows no one , and is mostly just a compilation of lucky kills.


TEST would like a word with you.


So do I
"MY BUTTHOLE!"

We've seen THOUSANDS of them already.
Its OLD, ITS REPETITIVE!
Where is the comedy man?
Is everyone brainwashed by MICHAEL BAY now?


Really love the way you use capitalization to emphasize your content.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#33 - 2012-10-10 11:03:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Okay well all of those are matters of opinion, except the very last one, which is a technicality.
No, they're pretty much all a matter of fact. You could argue that those facts don't make it “bad”, but then we run into the same argument as trying to claim that Alone in the Dark is a good movie in spite of making every mistake that makes a movie bad.

You could probably argue that WoW has merits as… I don't know… a social platform, maybe? But as a game? Nah.
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#34 - 2012-10-10 11:06:45 UTC
Xercodo wrote:
yeah we needed an EVE Hell 2 for the longest time now...


Sequels are always disappointing.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden

Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#35 - 2012-10-10 11:09:05 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
Okay well all of those are matters of opinion, except the very last one, which is a technicality.
No, they're pretty much all a matter of fact. You could argue that those facts don't make it “bad”, but then we run into the same argument as trying to claim that Alone in the Dark is a good movie in spite of making every mistake that makes a movie bad.

You could probably argue that WoW has merits as… I don't know… a social platform, maybe? But as a game? Nah.

I'm not arguing that those facts don't make it bad. I'm arguing that those facts aren't factual. If you want me to agree, then you'll have to give some details on each of those aspects that you mentioned before, except the last one, because I'm not a game designer/programmer and wouldn't be able to understand anyway.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted

Miles Parabellum
Core Collapse Inc
#36 - 2012-10-10 11:15:24 UTC
Christ, why do you people want to discuss WoW so badly? You're being obsessive and it freaks me out.

Anyway, I was at the threadmi... I mean work, seriously contemplating just sticking a gun in my mouth and pulling the trigger.
This video saved me. Thank you, Ivy!
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#37 - 2012-10-10 11:18:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Kitty Bear
Yep 12 million (at its peak) wrong players
but the good news is, some of them saw the error of thier ways
now there are only 10 million players


OK so it has cartoon graphics, fixed roles and class restricted weapons
None of which make it bad
Just about every other MMO out there does it just the same way


A bad game is full of bugs, glitches and broken game mechanics
None of which really apply to wow, but according to all the many whiney GD posts eve is full of broken game mechanics
Take from that what you will
WoW is simlpy a game that YOU do not like
and in the greater scheme of things, you're just not that important, your opinion is irrelevant





and yes, there is irony in my last statement.
Hiro Ceffoe
State War Academy
Caldari State
#38 - 2012-10-10 11:23:11 UTC
Are people really arguing about wether WoW is good?

Seriously...?

Nobody really cares and arguing about it makes you look a little dumb... just saying.

People who try to tell other people what to think don't really know what to think, if they did they would be content in thinking that, and simply let others alone, arguing about something suggests your open to another persons perspective, but it doesnt look like anyone is. so it's very much an excersize in futility.
Hypercake Mix
#39 - 2012-10-10 11:29:28 UTC
The video was... okay I guess. EVE isn't really good as entertainment for a 3rd party.

Guess that makes me a WoW fan huh? How unfortunate.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#40 - 2012-10-10 11:33:40 UTC
Destiny Corrupted wrote:
I'm not arguing that those facts don't make it bad. I'm arguing that those facts aren't factual. If you want me to agree, then you'll have to give some details on each of those aspects that you mentioned before, except the last one, because I'm not a game designer/programmer and wouldn't be able to understand anyway.
Ah.

Skinner-boxing is bad because it's the lowest form of “entertainment” — it's just a matter of tickling the reptilian part of the brain that gets triggered when you push a button and receive bacon. Tricking an autonomous system is a pretty sad substitute for providing genuine cerebral (or emotional) stimulation.

The mechanics are archaic because they go back to the outmoded class/level/XP design of '70s D&D and the wargames (and Chainmail) that preceded it. In the near half-century that has passed since then, far superior systems of character design and advancement have been created. It's easy (read: lazy) to design for, but that's about it. It generally offers no depth and little in the way of player choice and interaction, and this kind of progression also severely trips up the social aspect that could be seen as the main redeeming feature of the whole thing.

The story and narrative are simplistic because it's just a succession of “bad guy over there, go nuke” with a smattering of “collect 20 bear-asses” thrown in for variation. Granted, this isn't all that surprising since it's not the focus of the game (or, indeed, any game in the genre because the genre isn't well-suited for it), but it's more of a fall-through complaint: if it had nothing else, at least a good narrative would save it… but no luck there.

…and of course, the tech is old at this point, in terms of visuals and sound and world and server limitations and all of that. Age could be an excuse if other games hadn't proved that it's something that can be improved over time.

Monopoly is a bad game because of many of the same reasons: it's a roll-to-move, next-to-zero-choice, uncontrollably random game with ridiculously cheap components (lol paper money) — the best strategy of the game is to try to lock yourself out of the game to avoid all the randomness, but unfortunately, this strategy is subject to random chance as well. Compare this to a modern game like, say, Space Alert or BSG or Twilight Imperium. Hell, even silly-random games like Talisman and Arkham Horror have managed to introduce a modicum of player choice into the mix and manage to avoid the whole “to win, don't play” aspect of many older games.
Previous page123Next page