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First L4 Raven
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Silmas Feanarius
Ego One
#1 - 2012-10-04 11:49:43 UTC
A simple question, really. I just bought a Raven, fit like Jester's starter L4: http://bit.ly/VyHc8H (minus rigs, I currently use 2x Rigors and 1x CCC and also nosferatu's instead of the DLA and RR).

So, I understand everything about pulsing the booster and (of course) resistances, also the painter. My question is, how do I phisically fly the thing once in missions? In a Drake, I used to pick a celestial or trigger battleship and happily orbit, afterburner firing, maximizing speed/transversal to mitigate damage from missiles and turrets.

What do I do instead with the beastly Raven? (which signature radius is indeed less than a passive Drake w/furies, at least until december). Do I warp at range and kite at 80 Km+ (my current targeting radius) until they catch me? Or do I keep a large (40km+, drone range) orbit on a target or celestial?

Any feedback is appreciated, thanks.

Need more well-formatted linking.

Swearing in Sardinian.
addelee
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2012-10-04 12:27:17 UTC
I normally warp in just outside my maximum drone range. Once warped and stopped, I align to something that is the opposite direction to the NPC's.

This way, you have time to target any frigates that are coming in quickly on you and send drones after them (hitting them with cruise missiles isn't a waste of time but it's avoidable).

Speed is generally rubbish in a BS (I get about 120 out of a raven) so you are pretty much a sitting target.

My normal plan of action is to take out the frigates first with drones while spamming missiles at the battleships. Once the frigates are finished, target any cruisers with the drones and then do any clearing up with missiles.

Obviously, fit with the relevant damage type of missiles and hardeners.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#3 - 2012-10-04 13:50:20 UTC
Silmas Feanarius wrote:
My question is, how do I phisically fly the thing once in missions? In a Drake, I used to pick a celestial or trigger battleship and happily orbit, afterburner firing, maximizing speed/transversal to mitigate damage from missiles and turrets.


Regardless of which ship you're flying, when in Missions I find the best thing to do is orbit the mission beacon at 1KM. You need to be moving to take advantage of your evasive skills, and moving in circles is better than moving in straight lines.

Open your Overview settings and make sure Large Collidal Objects is checked, I can't remember which section that's in.

Continue to orbit the beacon until all ships are dead.

If you warp in to a room with a beacon and a gate less than 10KM away, then orbit the gate at 1KM. If the gate is 40/50KM away or more, then orbit the beacon until the majority of ships are down and then move, firing as you go.

This is just the way I do it - someone may well have a better idea, but it works for me. Enjoy Blink

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-10-04 13:52:08 UTC
My tactic with a missile battleship would be to fly at right angles to the bulk of the NPC's, on the theory that any transversal is better than none, and you might get them to miss some of their shots. It won't be incredibly effective considering a standard battleship's signature radius and speed, but every miss you generate is a few HP's you don't need to rep back up.

(My normal mission boat's a gunship, not a missile boat, so in cases like that, it's more effective to minimize transversal to help your shots land. With long-range guns, anyway.)

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt
Silmas Feanarius
Ego One
#5 - 2012-10-04 14:21:57 UTC
Thanks everyone. I guess it also depends on the mission, whether i must fly towards a certain point or just kill everything in sight.
I think I'll kite until I get shield management V, energy systems operations V, energy management IV and shield compensation IV to be safer, then I'll orbit or fly straight at an angle.

Need more well-formatted linking.

Swearing in Sardinian.
BearJews
Order of Extrodinary Gentlemen
#6 - 2012-10-04 17:59:05 UTC
na you don't need to do that. Just sit in one place (unless you have to get to a gate) and read up on the missions before doing them. This way you can control the incoming dps while doing as little as possible!
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-10-04 18:57:14 UTC
I don't see how you can kite anything. I don't remember speed of my Raven, but my Navy Raven does 117 m/s. If I remember right, npc bs do about 200 m/s, often a little more than that.

I use both run away and orbiting the gate/warp in beacon tactics. Depends on the mission. Something simple like level 4 Angel Extravaganza, I just orbit the gate in each room. Level 4 Dread Pirate Scarlet, I open Tactical Overlay and head straight away from the npc.

As far as the fit you linked. I have following suggestions:
1) Consider fitting sensor amplifier in low slot instead of 4th bcu.
2) Consider dropping tp in favor of another tanking mod (shield resist or cap recharger or shield boost amplifier)
3) Consider fitting NOS in high slot

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#8 - 2012-10-05 00:06:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Yes you can kite BS and BC (and many cruisers) in a Raven with an AB, the exception being Angels. Moving still helps to reduce damage taken from all NPC including Angels.

I've posted a LOT on the topic of Ravens, but this is the first post I found:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=394780#post394780

My current Raven Navy Issue is very similar:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1827748#post1827748
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#9 - 2012-10-05 00:18:39 UTC
You should read the missions guides first, some rooms will cause additional aggro. I would normally orbit the gate (2500) or else whatever structure there is, normally at whatever range I land at.
Silmas Feanarius
Ego One
#10 - 2012-10-05 07:41:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Silmas Feanarius
To clarify, this is my current fit:

[Raven, Raven - Corvus Current]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Mark I Generator Refitting: Diagnostic System

Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
X-Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I
Shield Boost Amplifier I
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Explosive Deflection Field II
Explosive Deflection Field II

'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I, Nova Cruise Missile
'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I, Nova Cruise Missile
'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I, Nova Cruise Missile
'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I, Nova Cruise Missile
'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I, Nova Cruise Missile
'Arbalest' Cruise Launcher I, Nova Cruise Missile
E50 Prototype Energy Vampire
E500 Prototype Energy Vampire

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hobgoblin II x5
Hammerhead II x5



I do always read eve-survival for info. This example is what I'd use against Angels.

Last night I did my first L4's with this Raven and found, unsurprisingly, that it's like starting L4's all over again.. had to warp out a couple time on Recon 2/3 and Intercept the Saboteurs, though this last one is due to aggro mismanagement. I definitely have to work on my active tanking skills.

This fit does 415 dps w/ drones, 2971 volley. Capacitor lasts 2 min

Need more well-formatted linking.

Swearing in Sardinian.
Arec Bardwin
#11 - 2012-10-06 19:50:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Arec Bardwin
I'd do the following:

Dump the ccc rig for another rigor and swap out the painter for a large cap booster. Remove the nos in high and fit a dmg control instead of the power diagnostic. Remember small T2 scout drones.

Upgrade to a Navy Raven asap
Taiyri Uchonela
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-10-07 16:34:07 UTC
I would also slowly upgrade those BCUs to CN BCUs. The increased damage they provide is pretty awesome.

http://thepvpexperience.com
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#13 - 2012-10-07 19:40:52 UTC
I would also switch my light drones to warriors when shootings angels. They faster.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-10-07 22:45:21 UTC
Taiyri Uchonela wrote:
I would also slowly upgrade those BCUs to CN BCUs. The increased damage they provide is pretty awesome.

I was checking CN BCU price yesterday, 130 mil for just one. I will probably get them at some point, but it will not be any time soon.

Also 30 day plex hitting 600 mil sucking the isk out of my wallet.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
Silmas Feanarius
Ego One
#15 - 2012-10-08 13:23:11 UTC
Arec Bardwin wrote:
I'd do the following:

Dump the ccc rig for another rigor and swap out the painter for a large cap booster. Remove the nos in high and fit a dmg control instead of the power diagnostic. Remember small T2 scout drones.

Upgrade to a Navy Raven asap


Damage control on a shield tanked ship? Not really!
Also the painter helps save 1-3 volleys on BC's, BS's and elite frigates. Invaluable. I bought the ship pre-rigged that way and it seems fine. Somewhere I read 1 painter has the bonus of 2 rigor rigs so that would be lost.

I'm thinking about getting a Gist X-type Large booster which would get my tank to 700 burst for 5 minutes vs. gurista (with the right hardeners of course, stable with both NOS's running) and set me back only 600 mil or so.

Is a Navy Raven that much better out of the box, that is to say, with my skillset? That also doesn't cost much at 350 mil.

Need more well-formatted linking.

Swearing in Sardinian.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2012-10-08 20:24:36 UTC
Silmas Feanarius wrote:
Arec Bardwin wrote:
I'd do the following:

Dump the ccc rig for another rigor and swap out the painter for a large cap booster. Remove the nos in high and fit a dmg control instead of the power diagnostic. Remember small T2 scout drones.

Upgrade to a Navy Raven asap


Damage control on a shield tanked ship? Not really!
Also the painter helps save 1-3 volleys on BC's, BS's and elite frigates. Invaluable. I bought the ship pre-rigged that way and it seems fine. Somewhere I read 1 painter has the bonus of 2 rigor rigs so that would be lost.

I'm thinking about getting a Gist X-type Large booster which would get my tank to 700 burst for 5 minutes vs. gurista (with the right hardeners of course, stable with both NOS's running) and set me back only 600 mil or so.

Is a Navy Raven that much better out of the box, that is to say, with my skillset? That also doesn't cost much at 350 mil.

Navy Raven has 7 launchers. No matter what mods you fit or what rigs, that 7th launcher is the biggest increase in dps you can have, there is simply no substitute for it.

If you don't mind the dps you have with Raven, but want a safer ship to use, consider Navy Scorpion. It is everything that is Raven plus better tank.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!
Taiyri Uchonela
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2012-10-15 15:51:51 UTC
I currently use the navy scorpion for missions because I started going into Lvl 4s before I should have. With my skills it's tank is ridiculous and I've never really had a worry about dying so far. Though I haven't done any of the harder lvl 4s yet so take that with a grain of salt.

http://thepvpexperience.com
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2012-10-15 16:42:06 UTC
I suppose once you're ready to move on past the standard Raven, the choice is whether you want extra firepower or extra tanking. The Navy Raven gives you extra base defenses and that all-important seventh missile slot; the Navy Scorpion still only has the six missile slots, and gives up a utility high and one of its lows (less room for Ballistic Controls) for extra mids, which combine with that shield resistance bonus for amazing tanking capabilities. You can theoretically fit a passive tank like a Drake's (only more massive) to the Navy Scorp - one of maybe two or three ships for which Large Core Defense Field Purgers might make sense.

The skillset you develop for a standard Raven should translate pretty cleanly to the Navy Raven.

Oh, and don't expect the price on Navy Ravens or Navy Scorpions to stay where they are forever; those low prices are a side-effect of the current state of faction warfare, and will probably go up as supplies drop following the release of the winter update.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt