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Bond #3 ---- 2B @ 8% looking to get funding from Sept 22nd to Oct 22nd -- No Coll
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Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk
Great Black Hole of Eve
#1 - 2012-09-19 16:41:22 UTC
Well I am back from all my commitments in RL.

Currently I have time to play again so I am looking for additional funding for station trading.

Terms of the Bond will be:

1. 2B @ 8% looking to get funding from Sept 22nd to Oct 22nd
2. Minimum 500M buy in, I would prefer a single Bond holder but 2B is a larger amount.
3. No Coll

My previous bonds were for 1B. I am looking for 2B this time since my order #s have grown, also I am more confident in my abilities at trading.

I have not done a lot of trading over the past month, RL issues I am not going to discuss occupied most of my time and when I did have time here I was just doing some mission running. I enjoy it and since you can walk away for a few days with no negative effects I thought it was the smart thing to do. I lowered my Broker fees too! Trading seems to work better for me when I am able to keep an eye on it a few times a day.

My goals are not that lofty compared to some. I would be happy to make in total 2B over the 30 days.
My current NAV is about 1.5B. It is lower since I buy plex to support my playing and have not traded much over the past while.

If you have questions please contact me or list below.

Thank you in advance to all
Vadane Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-09-19 19:00:40 UTC
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk wrote:

My goals are not that lofty compared to some. I would be happy to make in total 2B over the 30 days.
My current NAV is about 1.5B.

Just to identify whether or not I understood you correctly:

Your current NAV is 1.5B. Assuming your bond gets filled, thats 3.5B. Your plan is to make 2B of profit with 3.5B base capital in 30 days (57% growth)?

I'd say thats steep. But then again, you might be a hardcore trader.
Live2Mine
The New Eden School of trade
Organization of Skill Extracting Corporations
#3 - 2012-09-19 19:17:57 UTC
Vadane Deninard wrote:
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk wrote:

My goals are not that lofty compared to some. I would be happy to make in total 2B over the 30 days.
My current NAV is about 1.5B.

Just to identify whether or not I understood you correctly:

Your current NAV is 1.5B. Assuming your bond gets filled, thats 3.5B. Your plan is to make 2B of profit with 3.5B base capital in 30 days (57% growth)?

I'd say thats steep. But then again, you might be a hardcore trader.


That does seem steep, but that's just his ambition. In reality to repay this Bond, he only needs to make 160mil (8%) over the course of a month, using 2bil. I think that should be fairly easy to do for him, and I could honestly see him making atleast 500mil if he's a competent trader.
Vadane Deninard
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-09-19 19:34:35 UTC
Yep, right about the interest and principle payments.

I was just wondering because he started to outline his goals by saying his goals were not that "lofty" Smile
Flying O
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2012-09-19 19:50:57 UTC
Ah lol, right. Well I would probably invest if I wasn't a trader myself
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk
Great Black Hole of Eve
#6 - 2012-09-19 22:03:27 UTC
I would not say I am a hard core trader. But working with the sums I am 50% return is not that much turn over. I need to buy and sell about 5-8 billion total over the month.

My Nav I include my ships & their gear in. Nothing amazing a Maelstrom, Hurricane and some other odds and ends.

I have a little over 1B in in isk + 2 Billion Bond = 3B. I am looking to make 1.5B total. Like one of you mentioned though that is my goal. If I were to clear say half that (750m) I would consider it still a success for me and my character.

I focus on high volume items with high overall isk amount in the market typically (200m+ a day in total value some are in excess of a billion). Typically also look for margins of about 20%+, Some items I trade are as low as 5%, but those are not as common for me to trade. I am not reinventing anything and am still learning new things all the time.

After trying different methods what I do is simply try and update orders 2 or 3 times a day during the work week and if possible more during the weekend.
De Guillaume
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#7 - 2012-09-19 22:43:48 UTC
i will invest 500m

i will send isk if this bond is filled
mail me when this happens.

Has you ever went so far as chose to go even use want to look more like do?
Caelis Boirelle
Aurora Investments
#8 - 2012-09-19 23:31:33 UTC
Two characters posting in a bond thread with no forum posting history nor any regular MD presence, who speak positively of the op's plans gets my spidey sense tingling right off the bat.

Just my two cents.

Oh and a small point, you've had 2bil in bonds in the past, yet your nav is only 1.5bil now? Did you just sit on the isk?

If, as you say, you intend to make 1.5bil with the 3.5bil that means you're expecting to make 43% over the duration of the bond? So if you did that with your two previous bonds you'd have made a minimum of 1bil between them. Seeing as you say your wallet balance is 1bil at the moment, you've either started taking bonds from a very early stage in your trading career or you're grossly overestimating your abilities.

Aurora Investments is looking for an alliance to call home
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk
Great Black Hole of Eve
#9 - 2012-09-19 23:51:10 UTC
Caelis Boirelle wrote:
Two characters posting in a bond thread with no forum posting history nor any regular MD presence, who speak positively of the op's plans gets my spidey sense tingling right off the bat.

Just my two cents.

Oh and a small point, you've had 2bil in bonds in the past, yet your nav is only 1.5bil now? Did you just sit on the isk?

If, as you say, you intend to make 1.5bil with the 3.5bil that means you're expecting to make 43% over the duration of the bond? So if you did that with your two previous bonds you'd have made a minimum of 1bil between them. Seeing as you say your wallet balance is 1bil at the moment, you've either started taking bonds from a very early stage in your trading career or you're grossly overestimating your abilities.



yes...yes...

I have no idea who anyone who has posted in this thread is. I have not spoken to any before. In my first bond I was accused of being an alt of the person who funded my bond too!! lol I also personally did not see them as being positive about my bond, in fact I see them as negative. Questioning 50% return over a month of trading is not positive feedback

As stated I was away for a while. While I did not post my previous bonds in them I stated my goal is to fund my account with plex.

I started the game buying a month subscription and 2 plex, which I sold right away. That was my original seed money. I have gotten 2 bonds in the past and made several billion in the past trading, since I have never spent more on this game and still have over what I started with, I have bought several plex, helped corp mates and other usual things with plex. I also bought implants and all the usual stuff. I have lost about a billion isk in ships and gear over the past several months. So that is why I currently only have what I have. I also got ganked for around 1B during my last bond on a haul (my last hauling ever!! lol)

I am surprised that people think a 50% return is so much on a basically small amount of capitol. I am not dealing with 50B or anything. I honestly do not think 50% is such a huge return on these sums of isk.

I am not claiming to be Ryyker Bow (who is a polite and nice person) and actually doubling 40B or so in a month.

I think any trader could get a 300% return on say 100m in a month. I truly am surprised that this bond that the 50% is such a questionable figure on 3B isk. equals about 50m a day.
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk
Great Black Hole of Eve
#10 - 2012-09-20 06:05:49 UTC
I am really kinda surprised at the response to this bond request. I am not surprised at the skeptical nature just at what is drawing the skepticism.

My last bond I stated I was shooting for a 50% return and no one said boo about that. I have made more then 50% over a whole month trading too. I do not consider ships lost in battles (my hauing accident I do consider a trade loss) as a loss, nor do I consider my monthly plex expense a trade loss. Those are just my cost of playing the game.

I was actually thinking more people would have questioned my increase from $1B to $2B.
I also thought that me trying to get a better rate of 8% over my previous 10% were what would be the problem.

I really do not think 50% returns on $3billion is shooting that high for a full 30 days of station trading.

While I know I am far from an expert and really am limited to my few months of trading that is my current opinion.

I really would appreciate if maybe some more experienced traders could weigh in with their opinions. Not on if I can get the 50% return (since they do not know me that would not be possible) but if a 50% return on $3B is really that outrageous of a return to be shooting for. I honestly think any less would not be worth it. Why trade everyday to make less then that?

I appreciate the honest opinions from established traders on this matter.

And thank you to the first 500M pledge to this endevour. I will contact tomorrow.

Drago
Stigman Zuwadza
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-09-20 06:42:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Stigman Zuwadza
Personally I don't think its unrealistic.

I mean 1.5b profit from 3b is only 375m per week, which in the first week is only 12.5%. I think people are not looking at your numbers correctly.

I started out station trading in Rens/Hek and seeded my market alts with a total of 1.5b, this would return me anywhere between 1-2b a month. I only checked my orders 2 or 3 times a day and nursed them at the weekends.

Any trader worth his salt knows that in the lower echelons of trading 12.5% a week should be easy peasy. Blink

Best of luck with your bond.

Fly safe. o7

It's broken and it's been broken for a long time and it'll be broken for some time to come.
Chiyeung Bonaparte
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2012-09-20 16:18:02 UTC
I can confirm that Vadane isn't an alt Big smile
Caelis Boirelle
Aurora Investments
#13 - 2012-09-21 07:36:09 UTC
Firstly, the two individuals I was refering to were Live2Mine and Flying O. I know Vadane, plus he questioned your proposal and the other two came and defended it, hence my original point.

Also, I'm not questioning the return that you're suggesting you'll make, it's not unreasonable. What I am questioning is if you have any evidence or history to show that you, personally, will be able to make that return. You could come here and tell me you were expecting to make a 500% return and I'd buy it if you gave me something to back it up with.

Plus I'm sorry if I'm not as polite as Ryyker, but I'm sure I'm not alone in this forum when I say that I approach all requests for my hard earned isk with a healthy dose of skepticism.

Aurora Investments is looking for an alliance to call home
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk
Great Black Hole of Eve
#14 - 2012-09-21 17:13:03 UTC
Caelis Boirelle wrote:
Firstly, the two individuals I was refering to were Live2Mine and Flying O. I know Vadane, plus he questioned your proposal and the other two came and defended it, hence my original point.

Also, I'm not questioning the return that you're suggesting you'll make, it's not unreasonable. What I am questioning is if you have any evidence or history to show that you, personally, will be able to make that return. You could come here and tell me you were expecting to make a 500% return and I'd buy it if you gave me something to back it up with.

Plus I'm sorry if I'm not as polite as Ryyker, but I'm sure I'm not alone in this forum when I say that I approach all requests for my hard earned isk with a healthy dose of skepticism.


I still do not see them defending it, other then to say my interest commitment is small. I cannot control who or what is posted in a forum thread. Saying that I am only committing to a cost of 160m is not that positive in my book.

I will not post my API on the forum. If you are truly interested in funding me I will discuss all my plans, and share my API with you or other investors under the agreement that it is kept confidential, as all players would most likely want. I can fully explain my history too. Please message me if you are interested.

My inclusion of Ryyker was not meant as an insult to you. It was for 2 reasons:

1) to show some players can achieve bigger returns
2) They do it on much much larger amounts. I think he was working with about 40B??

My compliment to Ryyker was not a jab at you. When I started the game I saw his massive profits on EveProfit and his bond here on the MD. I messaged him explaining what I was doing and for any advise. He was nice enough to send me a response with some solid foundation building advise along with offering to look at other questions I might have. Since my game is still basically at the same level (station trading in the margins) I am waiting to try that offer out later, when I have advanced as a trader to a higher game. People willing to take time out and respond to a new player is not as common in the gaming world in some circles.

So to close, If you are interested in funding this I am willing to discuss my account and plans, provide my API and whatever reasonable request that any potential investor may have.

Sorry for any confusion
Caelis Boirelle
Aurora Investments
#15 - 2012-09-21 19:32:30 UTC
Not to worry, I appreciate what you're saying.

I would probably be content to invest but unfortunately as of the last few days most of my liquid isk is either tied up in the market or earmarked for a future project, and I'm not so desperate for the extra income as to go liquidate a few assets.

If it's any help you've got my vote (not that I'd imagine it counts for much!) and if you do need any help or advice in the future, feel free to get in touch.

Aurora Investments is looking for an alliance to call home
Theangryhobo
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#16 - 2012-09-21 23:10:03 UTC
I will fill the other 1.5 bil

.
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk
Great Black Hole of Eve
#17 - 2012-09-21 23:22:33 UTC
I currently have 1.5 billion in review.

I have the 500M commited above

I have a player reviewing my api key for a pledge of 1B.


I appreciate your offer for 1.5B but since I am in talks with someone first I am giving them first chance.

I would greatly appreciate if you would fill the final 500m if all goes well otherwise.

Once I hear back (this was all about 1 hour ago) I will post here where the financing is.
Theangryhobo
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2012-09-21 23:32:45 UTC
500 mil sounds good. If other drops I'll take their 1 bil as well.

.
Theangryhobo
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2012-09-22 14:52:28 UTC
ISK sent.

.
Drago Wolfbane Skorvalk
Great Black Hole of Eve
#20 - 2012-09-22 20:12:01 UTC
Theangryhobo wrote:
ISK sent.


500M isk Recieved From theangryhobo.

Messaged the other 2 investors and am awaiting their loans. I have a private message one not on this forum, I will ask when the isk is recieved if they want me to post them on this forum or not. I guess I call them private donor? Not sure but I will figure out what they want done, I forgot to even ask.
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