Jita Park Speakers Corner

Lore although not read by everyone is required to introduce anything into the game otherwise it will stuff things up for the RP crowd and it is there game too.

The previous information did not do enough as we have been over before the splash ads which were the main thing people would have seen were completely worthless to the uninformed.

As to people not giving a ****. that is your guess my guess is they need more education. The only way to know is to educate them and shove it in their face and if the education 3 buttons ect.. does not work then the CSM will forever be a minority joke and a PR stunt and so should just be axed. As to the 3 buttons if people can not be bothered looking at the candidates don't you think those that are that lazy would just click abstain rather than wasting time looking at a different screen and selecting a candidate to vote for. Yes it is in your blocks interest for the same or less people to vote in CSM 8, so I do take your words with a pinch of salt but as I have said all along all that can be hurt in trying to educate the populous and getting them to vote is the minorities.

But give it a chance and see if it can be more than it is, then kick it to the curb if it remains a joke.

CD-STV sounds like a plan to limit the "lost votes" but it still does not address the problem of fragmentation and fishing in other territories. While it is election time the CSM candidates promise the blue sky to industrials and heaven for pirates and once elected they only care about 0.0 and titans (or what ever part they are associated with).

Eve is big, you might know a lot about it but you will never know everything and experience all the stuff in every way. CSMs are like lobbyists for eve. If you are a delegate of the petrol extracting companies you won't be a friend of green peace and vice versa.
You are playing in a big player organization, nice, but you don't know what the smaller ones enjoy in this game. You are hardcore industrial, you won't understand the needs of FW or incursion.

To get this reflected in voting, each player would need to make 2 votes. One for the category and one for a candidate (last maybe combined with CD-STV). The categories are defined by ccp or the csm in parts of game play / play style.
Category examples:
0.0
Lowsec
Factionwar
Wormhole
Industrial
SovWarfare

The first vote determines how many seats a specific category gets allocated in CSM. Maybe further divided in main and alternates. For example, if 0.0 category gets a lot of votes they get 7 seats allocated of which 4 are main and 3 are alternates. The top voted categories get main seats in csm and less popular get alternates or don't get any at all if no seats left.

The second vote of a player goes to a candidate of choice who don't have to be part of the category the player voted for. You can promote the wormhole category and still support the guy in FW.

A candidate hast to choose one category he wants to run for (or maybe two but that will make result calculation more complicated) and is put on that list. If the category he is running for claims a seat, the candidate with highest points in this category will score the seat (maybe combined with CD-STV). If multiple categories per candidate are allowed those who scored a seat else where are not in the race.

Large blocks would keep there power as they can strengthen there category and push their candidate into it. And CCP would have a nice way to determine what categories are popular and can assure to have someone at hand for the specific topic.
Restricting CD-STV to the same category would help to funnel the votes.

So because I'm in goonswarm, I'm suddenly completely incapable of having my own opinions on anything?

So you didn't vote for your CEO. You heartless bastard.

Oh and there is of course the fact that I have never seen you not tow the same line as all the other members of Goonswarm but I would not accuse you of not having your own opinion as yours is the one the rest of the Goons seem to follow on these forums.

I did vote for my CEO, but I'm still wondering why you keep saying "your bloc". I'm not telling you that the thing to do is to titillate people into caring to "help my bloc", in fact if I were to try to "help my bloc" I would say "force people to vote before they can play" etc, because a vote from someone who doesn't give a **** and just wants to get past the hurdle which is preventing them from playing is going to be worth exactly ****-all.

Would you want this CSM? Ask yourself why they didn't vote. It comes down to one of two possibilities.

1. The account holder couldn't get online during the time to cast the vote they wanted.

2. The account holder doesn't care.

In the case of #1, I would think that the percentages of people this applies to is a random distribution of the player base. These votes would be distributed according to the candidates who most agreed with them, provided that they didn't fall into case #2. The issue here is that this number has to be extremely low due to the length of the CSM voting window.

In the case of #2, When you put a bunch of random names in front of people who can't be bothered enough to be educated on their choices and not fall into this category, they are going to randomly select people. Period. Now there are two potential outcomes here. One is that you end up with a CSM that doesn't represent the player base because they were effectively chosen. (Assuming there are enough people that fall into this category that normal votes have no hope of overcoming the randomization effects and becoming elected is effectively luck). The other is that you have enough people to keep the exact same CSM you have now and the random votes just push everyone up.

So you either end up with random garbage or the exact same thing that happens today. None of which is apparently appropriate for the existing CSM.

So again, not a solution.

I still find it interesting that the one thing you don't see here is the 10,000 people who voted for Mittani complaining that CCP is hearing exactly as much of their ideas through the CSM as the 1100 people that voted for Riverini. The method we have now is close to fair. Why are we even thinking of changing it to something even less fair?

Let's see if we can quantify my thoughtprocess a little, then:

Prior to joining goonswarm, I was just a hisec dweeb, doing hisec-y things. I didn't give a **** about the CSM, even though I picked up that it was happening. So I joined goonswarm, and I still didn't give a ****. Then CSM5 went ahead and said "no, go ahead, nerf JBs, they're the main cause for force projection" and other idiotic things which can only be expected from people who don't actually conduct warfare in nullsec (to wit, we use staging systems to stage out of, these systems are seeded with ships, ammo, etc, we don't take JBs from/to VFK every day, yet the CSM claimed this was what we did and CCP should definitely fix it). That made me actually care, and that was the first CSM for which I voted. Prior to that I would've just abstained or selected some random pubbie just to get into the game proper.

Information doesn't help, making them care does.

Your previous statement which are now to numerous to easily list refute this point.

ok I will make the answer easy
1, given burn Jita showed few read the forums, check emails and the splash screens were a joke and the CSM has been mostly null for years, so how do people learn what it is and why they should care to vote.

2. the 3 buttons require more work to randomly vote than to just abstain and when I said the whole game voted I was meaning if they were to chose candidates that represent what they want not a big list of names click one.

Yes I will admit having something specific to rage about does make the average peasant care and with Hi-sec nerfs inbound they probably will care more.

Enough to get them off their boring incursion and mission runs or their movies while they mine, no idea. It will help if they are given relevant info so they will know what to do other than coming to the forums bitching how this is unfair and rage quitting.