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Crime & Punishment

 
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The reality of the goon freighter ganking in Uedema and neighboring systems.

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Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#121 - 2012-09-18 17:38:39 UTC
The Slayer wrote:
Ensign X wrote:
Robert De'Arneth wrote:
simple solution would be if you feel you are going to be hit bring freinds. It is a freighter not a fighter. There are game mechanics to prevent this, it is called bring a fleet, or risk your ship, it's that whole risk vs reward thing. Big smile


Maybe you would like to explain what these "friends" are going to do while the volley from 8+ Tornadoes tears through your hull? They'll have a good show, for sure, and can pop your wreck for you, but in the battle of Alpha vs. Friends, Alpha wins all the ******* time. Lol


It takes about 25 tornados (or more) to alpha a freighter in one volley. Typically our gangs run about 10 - 15 members. We use high DPS high ROF ships to take down the freighters. The best way to stop us is wait till we go GCC then jam us with two or three blackbirds. Easy.


Assumer they are fast on reaction, could they also rep just enough to offset dps for concord to respond fast enough? Mostly asking to see if freighter have yet another possible defense.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#122 - 2012-09-18 17:40:33 UTC
Paul Oliver wrote:
The Slayer wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:
If CCP wants to nerf suicide gankers they could make these 2 rules:

1) If while under CONCORD aggression you kill a ship, you pay the insurance payout for that ship.



Yeh insurance on a freighter is like 300mil or something. Oh noes.
Fine than three times the value of the insurance payout, even if it puts your wallet in the negative. Twisted


They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...
Samahiel Sotken
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#123 - 2012-09-18 17:41:31 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Samahiel Sotken wrote:
Jesus Christ, You pubbies *****

stopped reading at this point.

next!


Yes as a rational adult I too often disregard well reasoned points due to association, salty language, and forceful pronouncements.
Paul Oliver
Doomheim
#124 - 2012-09-18 17:41:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Paul Oliver
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...
Yes but by pushing that bar high enough it becomes possible to carry a reasonable value in cargo and not be a profitable target.
Its good to be [Gallente](http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1209/QEQlJ.jpg).
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#125 - 2012-09-18 17:42:29 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...

You can see a fairly good amount of kills with 4bil as well. So really, you'd want something like a 10billion penalty. Just to be sure, since you know:

"Ganking was never intended to be profitable"

even if the people being exploded are complete morons.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#126 - 2012-09-18 17:43:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Frostys Virpio
Paul Oliver wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...
Yes but by pushing that bar high enough it becomes possible to carry a reasonable value in cargo and not be a profitable target.


Because carrying 2 billions worth of isk is not enough yet?

Alavaria Fera wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...

You can see a fairly good amount of kills with 4bil as well. So really, you'd want something like a 10billion penalty. Just to be sure, since you know:

"Ganking was never intended to be profitable"

even if the people being exploded are complete morons.


Yeah I saw a few indeed. Thats why I said it would merely move the bar where it change from non juicy to juicy.
Robert De'Arneth
#127 - 2012-09-18 17:44:38 UTC
Medarr wrote:
Robert De'Arneth wrote:
You sure learned a lot for the one day you been playing EVE!! Or, you are posting on a one day alt, that is my guess. Now my question is, why are you coward and have a yellow streak 5 miles long down your back? If you are going to post about a corp, grow a pair and post on your main.


Hypocrit much




What are you babbling on about? I can assure you this avatar has well over 1 day, I show my start date at .Center for Advanced Studies [CAS] from 2005.08.14 16:22 to 2005.08.15 18:46.


Now I guess I could have hacked into CCP's systems and changed that date, just so I could come and post.

So please explain why you called me a Hypocrite?

I'm a nerd, you can check my stats!! Skilling Int/Mem at 45 sp per minute is how I mack!     I'm like a lapdog, all bark no bite. 
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#128 - 2012-09-18 17:45:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
Vincent Athena wrote:
If CCP wants to nerf suicide gankers they could make these 2 rules:

1) If while under CONCORD aggression you kill a ship, you pay the insurance payout for that ship.

2) If your wallet is negative, you may not board any ship bigger than a shuttle. (Lore: Ship crews are paid from the interest earned from the total of all ISK in all wallets. If yours is negative, you are not contributing to the crew wage pool, so you are not allowed to use a crewed ship.)

Suicide ganking would still be possible. Profitable? Not as much. They would just have to be even more selective.


Tell me why they should introduce literally the only game mechanic that can force your wallet to go negative

you know something beyond "wel suaside gank is bad!!!"

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Eternal Error
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#129 - 2012-09-18 17:45:29 UTC
Sentient Blade wrote:
BillyBanter wrote:
Once the sec status of the alt character is too low, they replace it with a new one.


Which is a bannable offence if they're recycling them.

This. If they recycle them, petition them. I petitioned someone for it a few years ago and the GM response was quite prompt.
Samahiel Sotken
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#130 - 2012-09-18 17:50:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Samahiel Sotken
Paul Oliver wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...
Yes but by pushing that bar high enough it becomes possible to carry a reasonable value in cargo and not be a profitable target.


What is reasonably high while still avoiding deleterious effects on the economy? It is economically untenable to allow too much wealth to move too easily with too little risk. Especially when there are already safer options available that aren't being used. Orcas, for example, have been mentioned prominently.

Furthermore, raising the EHP barrier will not be nearly as effective as you seem to believe. http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14307479 As long as pilots continue to misuse the freighter class of vessels in such an egregious manner at the expense of blockade runners, industrials, and orcas.
The Slayer
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#131 - 2012-09-18 17:52:12 UTC
Paul Oliver wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...
Yes but by pushing that bar high enough it becomes possible to carry a reasonable value in cargo and not be a profitable target.


Its already possible to do this. Carry less than twice the value of the ship and there is a good chance we won't even give you a second look. Don't fly through 0.5 and 0.6 space and there is a good chance we will never even SEE you.
Robert De'Arneth
#132 - 2012-09-18 17:55:29 UTC
Eternal Error wrote:
Sentient Blade wrote:
BillyBanter wrote:
Once the sec status of the alt character is too low, they replace it with a new one.


Which is a bannable offence if they're recycling them.

This. If they recycle them, petition them. I petitioned someone for it a few years ago and the GM response was quite prompt.



This may or may not be true, if it is there is clear path to take, and coming to the forums is not it. Also, the one day alt failed to prove his case, he was asked to post his kill mail, he refused. Game rules are ccp's to deal with not us players.

I'm a nerd, you can check my stats!! Skilling Int/Mem at 45 sp per minute is how I mack!     I'm like a lapdog, all bark no bite. 
PI Maker
Doomheim
#133 - 2012-09-18 17:57:43 UTC
Robert De'Arneth wrote:
PI Maker wrote:
Robert De'Arneth wrote:
post on your main.

why?

The why is pretty simple, if you make an alt like you do, no one will buy what you are selling, because no one really hears a coward.

And yet you replied, so you must have heard me just fine. Given that this game isn't based on reputation (e-honor idiots aside) i fail to see the value of one's posting history or character age. there are just as many 5yr old characters who are idiots as 1 day old ones. i'm looking at you.
Samahiel Sotken
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#134 - 2012-09-18 17:58:42 UTC
Recycling, as I understand it, is banable. Which is why we run regular "Sec Safaris" in nullsec. It's a lot less arduous to grind sec status when you control large swaths of 0.0 space with good true sec.
PI Maker
Doomheim
#135 - 2012-09-18 17:58:44 UTC
Samahiel Sotken wrote:
Paul Oliver wrote:
Frostys Virpio wrote:
They collect bills in loot. Are people really still not understanding WTF is ahppening in a gank? Even a newbie like me got enough information to know a 900 mill penalty would only change where the bar for profitable is. Insetad of a ship with 2 bill inside, they woudl aim for 4 bill...
Yes but by pushing that bar high enough it becomes possible to carry a reasonable value in cargo and not be a profitable target.


What is reasonably high while still avoiding deleterious effects on the economy? It is economically untenable to allow too much wealth to move too easily with too little risk. Especially when there are already safer options available that aren't being used. Orcas, for example, have been mentioned prominently.

Furthermore, raising the EHP barrier will not be nearly as effective as you seem to believe. http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14307479 As long as pilots continue to misuse the freighter class of vessels in such an egregious manner at the expense of blockade runners, industrials, and orcas.

i guess the goons have a bunch of orcas to sell in addition to the freighter market manipulation.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#136 - 2012-09-18 18:04:06 UTC
Greetings from Bat Country!

Apologies for my late replay to this thread but we have been rather busy in our R&D department, sifting through fat loots and working out just how much damage we did to ourselves the other night when our overviews bugged or something. Personally I think it was an NC. Awoxer but only time will tell.

Now onto the subject at hand, our cull of terrible frieghter pilots. I see many of you have questions and I will do my best to answer said questions without too much political woffle. Firstly, we are not recycling alts, we simply have lot and lots of scrub charactors at our disposal, most of them made for our ice interdiction.

Another whine.. ..I mean, complaint, is that frieghters are dont stand any chance against us. Well, thats kinda true. However its not because we own some sort of super weapon or that frieghters have a weak tank (they have a good one). The reason they die is because the pilots is stupid. They are packing far too much isk into their holds which means that it is possible to ram our heroic gank gangs into them and come away with piles of money. How much money? Well...

If you have any further questions I will be happy to answer them.
Robert De'Arneth
#137 - 2012-09-18 18:08:20 UTC
PI Maker wrote:
Robert De'Arneth wrote:
PI Maker wrote:
Robert De'Arneth wrote:
post on your main.

why?

The why is pretty simple, if you make an alt like you do, no one will buy what you are selling, because no one really hears a coward.

And yet you replied, so you must have heard me just fine. Given that this game isn't based on reputation (e-honor idiots aside) i fail to see the value of one's posting history or character age. there are just as many 5yr old characters who are idiots as 1 day old ones. i'm looking at you.



LOL Good try, you cannot insult me!! I was referring to what the OP was selling, sorry that was not clear to you. Roll I mean come on dude, my grand dauther who is 6 is better with insults. You and I will just have to disagree, not a suprise to me since you are an alt poster. Big smile

I'm a nerd, you can check my stats!! Skilling Int/Mem at 45 sp per minute is how I mack!     I'm like a lapdog, all bark no bite. 
Marivauder
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#138 - 2012-09-18 18:08:44 UTC
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#139 - 2012-09-18 18:09:52 UTC
thread sum-up: NPC corp game mechanic suggestion
Marivauder
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#140 - 2012-09-18 18:10:12 UTC
Razzor also said hahahahahahahahaha