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Imperial Outlaws [I.LAW] Commence Operations

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Ryven Krennel
Hopscotch
#1 - 2011-10-15 13:20:24 UTC
Capsuleers of the Summit,

I am pleased to announce the formation of a new corporation. Imperial Outlaws [I.LAW] has officially commenced operations on the Amarr/Minmatar warfront, as a member of the Amarr faction. We are dedicated to furthering the interests of the Amarr Empire, and also to aiding our allies, the Caldari militia. Some of our members are likely known to you: Eran Mintor, Shalee Lianne, Almity, and others who have served ably on the front lines in the past. I am sure there are questions that will likely be asked, and I will humbly answer those that I can.

Ryven Krennel
I.LAW Diplomat

"Oh, good, we're surrounded.  That makes this easy."

Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#2 - 2011-10-15 13:38:41 UTC
Majesty Theological Institute wishes you God's blessing in your endeavors, and maintaines hope that you are able to maintain your honor, dignity, and faith through an often trying and difficult war.
Ryven Krennel
Hopscotch
#3 - 2011-10-15 13:43:51 UTC
Thank you, Tiberius, for your kind words. The concepts of honor, dignity, and faith are concepts that can never be esteemed too highly.

"Oh, good, we're surrounded.  That makes this easy."

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#4 - 2011-10-15 15:06:45 UTC
What are your stances on the political statu quo, offensive movements in Minmatar sovereign space, the status of Intaki, offensive movements in Gallente sovereign space, piracy, and privateering ?
Ryven Krennel
Hopscotch
#5 - 2011-10-15 16:23:24 UTC
Ms. Farel,
I expected I would hear from you. I also expected you would skip lesser niceties to go straight to the "landmine" issues. While this is not necessarily polite, it is not terribly surprising. So, how do I answer? [I.LAW] has just been formed. As for our "stance" on all of these issues? I can't make an official statement on all of them. So, I will make what statements I can.

1) The political status quo: I suspect that the political status quo could care less what we think of it. The factions are locked in a tepid conflict with only slight gains to any one side at any given time. This could go on indefinitely. Nonetheless, we intend to support our Empire and our allies.

2) Offensive movements in Minmatar Space: This is a silly question. This is a war. The Minmatar are in OUR sovereign space right this moment. Why the hell wouldn't we be in theirs? The Minmatar attack targets in Amarr space all the time, even in the Throne Worlds themselves. Who is complaining about us operating in their territory?

3) Offensive movements in Gallente Space: This is akin to the above question. However, it is a tricky one, is it not? So, allow me to say this: Not long ago, the Gallente militia invaded Amarr sovereign territory in large numbers. Specifically, the corporation Quantum Cats [QCATS]. They weren't terribly successful, but, nonetheless, they violated Amarrian sovereignty in conducting attacks on our militia in our space. Naturally, we are not going to shy away from returning the favor.

4) Status of Intaki? Really? What does this have to do with anything? Truthfully, I am not up to date on their situation. If you would like to educate me on the subject, you can always send me some literature detailing why this should matter to me and what effect, if any, the Intaki situation has on our operations.

5) Piracy: Piracy is a word with an amorphous and often shifting definition. What actually equates to piracy? I suspect, Lyn, that you still have the same very rigid definition of piracy as before, and will likely disagree with me on just what we're discussing here. Thus, I would suggest you define "piracy" before I talk about it at length. I can say that [I.LAW] does not consider itself a pirate organization nor do we condone acts of piracy.

6) Privateering: Again, a very vague word. Perhaps you can more clearly define what you consider to be privateering so I understand what it is you are actually asking.

As a personal aside, I am glad to see you are doing well, Ms. Farel. You're still asking the tough questions, and that's also encouraging.

Ryven Krennel

"Oh, good, we're surrounded.  That makes this easy."

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#6 - 2011-10-15 16:58:34 UTC
Mr Krennel,

Firstly I must thank you for your answers, even if I definitly did not ask for you to explain yourself : I merely asked for clarifications. I must apologize if my message sounded like an inquiry or accusation.

I am also sorry that it offended you and maybe it was not polite enough. Actually, there are very few militia corporations to whom I would even ask this question, and even fewer that actually present themselves here on the IGS. Why I would not even ask them the same thing is simply because I already know the answers. In your case, and I perfectly acknowledge it was not obvious, please consider it actually a mark of esteem to your image and integrity.

Now then, I have not forgotten the personnal and different stances of all of you on the matters at hand, but this does not mean that this new corporation automatically follow the same principles, thus my question.

________________


Besides that, as you felt the need to justify yourself by replying with questions, and if you do not mind, I will try to answer.

I am sorry that you think my question about offensive movements in Minmatar Space is silly. Maybe it would have been in a total war, yes, but in this proxy war, I do believe that it is a valid one. And, as much as the Minmatar attack you, the Empire also attacks them. And this does not just limit to the war itself. I think you may miss the bigger picture.

For QCATS, I must assume that you follow the "an eye for an eye" doctrine if you are looking to return them the favor, then. Do not forget that you only have two eyes in the equation, and might end up blind very soon that way.

Concerning Intaki, as you stated that you intend to help your Caldari allies, Intaki might actually well get into the equation, as it has always been one of the central points of their side of the conflict. If you really help or support the Caldari, and depending on the Caldari group you help on that matter, your actions will have an impact on Intaki without any doubt, whatever side you choose.

I agree that Piracy is a poor term. This is why I added privateering. What I consider privateering is for example several of very discutable very hostile actions that have been codoned and enforced by both the Knighthood and PIE Inc several months ago, against neutral NRDS entities.

Then again, I am sorry if I offended you.

Best regards,
Farel.
Arkady Sadik
Gradient
Electus Matari
#7 - 2011-10-15 17:06:04 UTC
May I ask what makes you outlaws?
Ryven Krennel
Hopscotch
#8 - 2011-10-15 17:53:40 UTC
To Mr. Sadik,
Honestly, the name is pretty much an aesthetic touch. Makes us sound roguish. As far as I can tell, that is all it takes to name a corporation these days.

To Ms. Farel,
I am sorry you feel I was offended. This is not the case. I forget that light hearted banter is lost in translation. Still, this thread is intended to be introductory. A lot of our rules, views, and such are still emergent. As such, I am reluctant to engage in an in depth discussion at this time. I did, however, feel you deserved an answer of some sort, incomplete as it is.

"Oh, good, we're surrounded.  That makes this easy."

Graelyn
Aeternus Command Academy
#9 - 2011-10-15 22:47:54 UTC
That's quite a roster of names you have.

I wish you the best, and hope to fight well alongside your forces.

Fly Strong.

Cardinal Graelyn

Amarr Loyalist of the Year - YC113

Seriphyn Inhonores
Elusenian Cooperative
#10 - 2011-10-15 23:14:19 UTC
Ah, the good Arkady Sadik beat me to it. An aesthetically-named organization...like a military unit from a holoreel. Fair enough.
Gottii
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2011-10-16 00:55:17 UTC
We'll update our red list accordingly.
Ryven Krennel
Hopscotch
#12 - 2011-10-16 02:37:52 UTC
I am going to say a few more things regarding the subjects that have come up so far:

Gottii: Okay, figured as much.

Seriphyn: Glad you see it that way.

Cardinal Graelyn: Indeed. See you out there.

Lyn Farel: I will attempt to enhance what I have said previously. I am not saying "Eye for an eye." What I am saying is, in war, you do not win by sitting around waiting for the enemy to attack you. You attack the enemy. This is not to say there are not clever strategies wherein one does practice defense. It is to say that if you let the enemy dictate the war, then you will always be at the enemy's command. This is not sound strategy. What I find disheartening is so many members of the supposed supporters of the Empire that don't understand this. They seem to ignore the enemy militia members firing on members of the Amarr bloc in Amarr (the system), but want to call out people who attack the Minmatar in their systems.

As for privateering, we've discussed those supposedly NRDS entities you are referring to before. They fired on militia, and not just the ones with criminal status. That being the case, I still think your definition needs some refining, or you should reevaluate your view of them as NRDS entities.

I am not being hostile. I am responding to your points as clearly as I can.

Ryven Krennel

"Oh, good, we're surrounded.  That makes this easy."

John Revenent
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#13 - 2011-10-16 08:24:34 UTC
Ryven Krennel wrote:
Ms. Farel,
Status of Intaki? Really? What does this have to do with anything? Truthfully, I am not up to date on their situation. If you would like to educate me on the subject, you can always send me some literature detailing why this should matter to me and what effect, if any, the Intaki situation has on our operations.

Ryven Krennel


It has very much to do with what you state in your original release, most of the Caldari Militia has made a effort to retake Intaki which I have no quarrel with as it is not Ishukone's nor her subsidiaries such as Ishukone-Raata to intervene with the attempt of occupancy.

The problem that you will find is that most of the Caldari Militia, along side other racial militia's is that privateer, pirating is a full blown problem, hell I have witnessed Provist forces engage Ishukone/Mordu escorts and their defenseless haulers.. This type of corruption is unacceptable it only brings originally neutral/peaceful elements into this 'conflict' such as Ishukone-Raata, and the Intaki Liberation Front. I suggest you do read up on the situation before you decide to write it off as a small matter, it will become even worse off then it is.

Ishukone Loyalist - Private Contractor

"Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned."

Arkady Sadik
Gradient
Electus Matari
#14 - 2011-10-16 10:08:59 UTC
John Revenent wrote:
most of the Caldari Militia has made a effort to retake Intaki which I have no quarrel with as it is not Ishukone's nor her subsidiaries such as Ishukone-Raata to intervene with the attempt of occupancy.
Please note that the Intaki/Ishukone contract only allows Mordu's forces to be present in Intaki. Even Ishukone Watch is excluded from this. The Caldari Militia attacking Intaki is a direct breach of the Ishukone treaty with the Intaki Assembly.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#15 - 2011-10-16 11:42:22 UTC
Ryven Krennel wrote:

Lyn Farel: I will attempt to enhance what I have said previously. I am not saying "Eye for an eye." What I am saying is, in war, you do not win by sitting around waiting for the enemy to attack you. You attack the enemy. This is not to say there are not clever strategies wherein one does practice defense. It is to say that if you let the enemy dictate the war, then you will always be at the enemy's command. This is not sound strategy. What I find disheartening is so many members of the supposed supporters of the Empire that don't understand this. They seem to ignore the enemy militia members firing on members of the Amarr bloc in Amarr (the system), but want to call out people who attack the Minmatar in their systems.

As for privateering, we've discussed those supposedly NRDS entities you are referring to before. They fired on militia, and not just the ones with criminal status. That being the case, I still think your definition needs some refining, or you should reevaluate your view of them as NRDS entities.


This is where I plenly disagree. I do not speak only out of ethics, but also out of pragmatism.

This is not a full scale war, this is proxy war. You do realize that this war will only end because one side or the other, or both, will come to an agreement in which the militias will have little if not nothing to do with. The STPRO once occupied 100% of the gallentean contestable territory. Did they win ? No, the war continued. Our actions as militia capsuleers mean very little in the end. It is purely about symbols and ideals that have to be shown to get the moral superiority.

Enemy forces are constituted of (mostly) capsuleers. They do not die. Deliberately agressing them (for example by attacking their territory) only means a waste of crews, and harden the enemy resolution.

Years have passed and nothing has changed. Governements do not seem to really care anymore. This is a war where capsuleers are thrown into like we throw starving slaver hounds in an arena. We do not even know what are the consequences on the native populations of the systems that are being contested. This is the only opaque point that still makes the engagement in this war a valid one.

So in the end, everything that sill keeps an ersatz of meaning revolves around the contestation of enemy systems and occupied planets, and its impact on the populations here. Do going offensive makes you dictate the war ? Not really. It does not really destroy the enemy forces for the simple reason that they are capsuleers. Nobody cares, because they do not die (at the contrary of conventional navies). The only reason that could back up offensive operations is the will not to see the enemy conducting the same operations in your own space.

But eventually, this is trade with a null result : what you prevent in your space, you bring it in the enemy's space.
Ryven Krennel
Hopscotch
#16 - 2011-10-16 14:10:38 UTC
I suspect we will have to agree to disagree. This discussion also is headed toward a null result. The principal purpose of this thread still remains, however, which was simply to announce our founding. While I understand the desire to sound out our views on subjects of individual importance to you, I have to abstain from delving into them too deeply in this particular thread, or at this time. Thank you, at any rate.

"Oh, good, we're surrounded.  That makes this easy."

Ruah Piskonit
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#17 - 2011-10-17 03:07:45 UTC
I am waiting for your basic policy guideline and mission statement. Not an answer to Lyn.

i accept eve-mail.

But otherwise, I wish you guys focused crystals and Gods speed.
Ryven Krennel
Hopscotch
#18 - 2011-10-18 03:40:26 UTC
Our Mission Statement:

Imperial Outlaws is an Amarr Empire para-military corporation dedicated to the protection and service of God and Empire. I.LAW accepts members of all races so long as they follow corporate rules and pass a trial period.

I.LAW is primarily a corporation engaged in the Amarr/Minmatar war, though it's reach spreads all over the cluster, wherever it's enemies may be found. I.LAW members are active and a powerful asset to the Amarr militia. I.LAW pilots are team-players and are willing to work to help and protect their fellow corp-mates. Respect and maturity are essential for I.LAW pilots, as poor conduct is disciplined as seen fit.

I.LAW operates under a NBSI policy in space. Our standings are constantly updated and the list grows for both reds and blues as we encounter more people. Those Amarr corporations and individuals operating in low-sec are encouraged to seek blue standings if necessary.

Members are required to maintain -4.9 or higher security status.



That should help to clarify a few things.

"Oh, good, we're surrounded.  That makes this easy."

Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#19 - 2011-10-18 07:15:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Rodj Blake
Ryven Krennel wrote:

I.LAW operates under a NBSI policy in space.


Disappointing.

Still, at least it explains why you call yourselves outlaws.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori

Kithrus
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#20 - 2011-10-18 11:34:01 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Ryven Krennel wrote:

I.LAW operates under a NBSI policy in space.


Disappointing.

Still, at least it explains why you call yourselves outlaws.


I'm not sure. I personally don't take offense to NBSI because sometimes there is a place for the monsters that roam the stars so the holy don't have to become those monsters.

Its noble in a way when you think about it but I digress.

Darkness is more then absence of light, it is ignorance and corruption. I will be the Bulwark from such things that you may live in the light. Pray so my arms do not grow weary and my footing remain sure.

If you are brave, join me in the dark.

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