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Is perfect refining possible without the Ore specialties?
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Barrak
The Painted Ones
#1 - 2012-09-17 11:03:53 UTC
Hi,

I am thinking of turning my trader into a refiner and am wondering what level of skills he would require to perfectly refine any ore that gets mined?

He will not be mining himself rather he is the middle man between the miners and the market.

If possible I'd be interested in knowing answers based on a strong faction standing and no faction standing.

Regards

Barrak
whaynethepain
#2 - 2012-09-17 11:41:09 UTC
How about refining contracts?

Set up a contract for x amount of veld for x amount of trit?

A travelling refiner may welcome the trade.

Getting you on your feet.

So you've further to fall.
Barrak
The Painted Ones
#3 - 2012-09-17 11:43:03 UTC
whaynethepain wrote:
How about refining contracts?

Set up a contract for x amount of veld for x amount of trit?

A travelling refiner may welcome the trade.



Thanks for the reply, but:

1. I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Please explain in a little more detail
2. Do you know the answer to the question (not be fascias).

*edit*

One of the reason I am thinking of doing this is that I have a spare training slot and I don't really need to put anymore skills into trading.

Regards

Barrak
whaynethepain
#4 - 2012-09-17 11:56:12 UTC
Hi, sorry, terrible answer, wasn't trying to be flippant

1. is it easier to contract someone else to do it?

2. Not well enough.

Getting you on your feet.

So you've further to fall.
Pinstar Colton
Sweet Asteroid Acres
#5 - 2012-09-17 12:58:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Pinstar Colton
Refining V
Refinery Efficiency V
+2% Beancounter refining implant (Requires Cybernetics III)

Will net you a perfect refine with ANYTHING at a base 50% station, this includes ice, modules, ships, ammo and any ore.

*Edit*
Don't forget the 6.67 or higher standings at whatever station you intend to use to refine too, to eliminate the 'we take' waste.


Having gotten my start as a refiner, I can tell you that logistics will be your biggest headache. I'm not saying it's not worth it, but it won't be a piece of cake if you want to process any kind of volume.

In the cat-and-mouse game that is low sec, there is no shame in learning to be a better mouse.

Gumby Ambraelle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-09-17 13:09:08 UTC
Pinstar Colton wrote:
Refining V
Refinery Efficiency V
+2% Beancounter refining implant (Requires Cybernetics III)

Will net you a perfect refine with ANYTHING at a base 50% station, this includes ice, modules, ships, ammo and any ore.

*Edit*
Don't forget the 6.67 or higher standings at whatever station you intend to use to refine too, to eliminate the 'we take' waste.


Having gotten my start as a refiner, I can tell you that logistics will be your biggest headache. I'm not saying it's not worth it, but it won't be a piece of cake if you want to process any kind of volume.


He is correct, to do any volume will mean freighters and moving bulk ore and refined minerals from location to location.
This will also mean paying attention to the various market locations for the fluctuations in the mineral prices.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#7 - 2012-09-17 16:25:59 UTC
Pinstar Colton wrote:
Refining V
Refinery Efficiency V
+2% Beancounter refining implant (Requires Cybernetics III)

Will net you a perfect refine with ANYTHING at a base 50% station, this includes ice, modules, ships, ammo and any ore.

*Edit*
Don't forget the 6.67 or higher standings at whatever station you intend to use to refine too, to eliminate the 'we take' waste.


Having gotten my start as a refiner, I can tell you that logistics will be your biggest headache. I'm not saying it's not worth it, but it won't be a piece of cake if you want to process any kind of volume.



Those would require Ice and Scrapmetal Processing as well.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-09-17 17:02:09 UTC
Barrak wrote:
Hi,

I am thinking of turning my trader into a refiner and am wondering what level of skills he would require to perfectly refine any ore that gets mined?

He will not be mining himself rather he is the middle man between the miners and the market.

If possible I'd be interested in knowing answers based on a strong faction standing and no faction standing.

Regards

Barrak


You can't skip the standings part as it is separated from the refining waste. The amount of taxed mineras is dependant on the total you get out of your refining after all skills/implants are taken into account. Then the corp take it's % of your minerals. If you want to keep it all, you have no choice but to grind them.
Pipa Porto
#9 - 2012-09-17 17:10:03 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Pinstar Colton wrote:
Refining V
Refinery Efficiency V
+2% Beancounter refining implant (Requires Cybernetics III)

Will net you a perfect refine with ANYTHING at a base 50% station, this includes ice, modules, ships, ammo and any ore.



Those would require Ice and Scrapmetal Processing as well.


That's what the Beancounter implant is for.

You can get perfect refining in a number of common ways (with a 50% base station):
Refining V, Refinery Efficiency 4, Ore Processing 1
Refining V, Refinery Efficiency 4, +4% Beancounter Refining Implant
Refining V, Refinery Efficiency V, Ore Processing 1
Refining V, Refinery Efficiency V, +2% Beancounter Refining Implant

Ice and Scrapmetal Processing work the same way as the rest of the Ore Processing skills.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#10 - 2012-09-17 17:13:52 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Those would require Ice and Scrapmetal Processing as well.

Just to confirm that you DON'T need those, or any material skills, if you have a "Net Yield" of 100%.
Barrak
The Painted Ones
#11 - 2012-09-17 17:22:41 UTC
thanks all.

It's just something I'm looking into at the moment. I have a trader that doesn't really require any further trading training and am also looking at a Rorq pilot to compress and be able to haul.... to some degree.

Just one of the thousand things I want to do in EvE Oops
Styth spiting
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-09-17 17:22:44 UTC
Barrak wrote:
Hi,

I am thinking of turning my trader into a refiner and am wondering what level of skills he would require to perfectly refine any ore that gets mined?

He will not be mining himself rather he is the middle man between the miners and the market.

If possible I'd be interested in knowing answers based on a strong faction standing and no faction standing.

Regards

Barrak


It depends on what ores you want to refine. Arkonor takes a few weeks of training while high sec perfect refines take maybe 3 days training.

With refining you have 2 percent values, loss and taken. Taken is based on the corporation that owns the station, so higher standing will lower the value. Loss is based on refining skills, which involve refining efficiency and the associated ore refining skill.

You will also need corp standing in the station(s) you will be refining at. IIRC with a standing of 6 you will have 0% taken


So with refining efficiency IV and IV of the associated ore skill (veldspar processing, etc) and a standing of 6 you can refine all highsec ores.

For the higher end ores you will need refining efficiency V for the higher end ore processing skills.
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#13 - 2012-09-17 21:15:27 UTC
0% tax refine is standing 6.67 or 6.70, not 6.00.

Also, the Connections skill does help. If you raise your standing to above 0.00, even to just 0.01, and train Connections to 4, your standing increases from 0.01 to 1.61. Or train Connections to 5 for standing 2.01.

Unfortunately, you can't do this with a corp that doesn't have agents, such as some/all of the Jove corps.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#14 - 2012-09-17 21:52:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Those would require Ice and Scrapmetal Processing as well.

Just to confirm that you DON'T need those, or any material skills, if you have a "Net Yield" of 100%.

Then why did I have 100% "Net Yield" on everything last year except Ice and Scrap ?

Trained them to level 3, THEN got 100% on them.

I trust my own experience on this one, sorry.

edit: Besides, those Implants take up valuable slots, and Implants can change with Jump Clone use.

Better to just train the Scrap and Ice as it's only a couple of days to lvl 3.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Pipa Porto
#15 - 2012-09-17 21:58:21 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Those would require Ice and Scrapmetal Processing as well.

Just to confirm that you DON'T need those, or any material skills, if you have a "Net Yield" of 100%.

Then why did I have 100% "Net Yield" on everything last year except Ice and Scrap ?

Trained them to level 3, THEN got 100% on them.

I trust my own experience on this one, sorry.



Because you didn't have the implant.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#16 - 2012-09-17 22:00:48 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Those would require Ice and Scrapmetal Processing as well.

Just to confirm that you DON'T need those, or any material skills, if you have a "Net Yield" of 100%.

Then why did I have 100% "Net Yield" on everything last year except Ice and Scrap ?

Trained them to level 3, THEN got 100% on them.

I trust my own experience on this one, sorry.



Because you didn't have the implant.



See Edit. Smile

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Pipa Porto
#17 - 2012-09-17 22:05:52 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Those would require Ice and Scrapmetal Processing as well.

Just to confirm that you DON'T need those, or any material skills, if you have a "Net Yield" of 100%.

Then why did I have 100% "Net Yield" on everything last year except Ice and Scrap ?

Trained them to level 3, THEN got 100% on them.

I trust my own experience on this one, sorry.



Because you didn't have the implant.



See Edit. Smile


Which confirms that you don't need any material skills to get a Net Yield of 100%. Well done.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#18 - 2012-09-17 22:19:23 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:


Which confirms that you don't need any material skills to get a Net Yield of 100%. Well done.


Either way works. Stop being a pr***.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
whaynethepain
#19 - 2012-09-17 23:23:17 UTC
Guys, get a fleet.

Getting you on your feet.

So you've further to fall.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#20 - 2012-09-17 23:31:16 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Then why did I have 100% "Net Yield" on everything last year except Ice and Scrap ?

Trained them to level 3, THEN got 100% on them.

I trust my own experience on this one, sorry.

edit: Besides, those Implants take up valuable slots, and Implants can change with Jump Clone use.

Better to just train the Scrap and Ice as it's only a couple of days to lvl 3.

If you had to train to 3, that implies you were at poor facilities, as you only need level 1 for 100% yield. It could be 99.99% and gotten rounded, or you had low standing.

I had a 2% refining implant in my head for a long time, and I refined scrap just fine. It was a long time before I finally chose to train Scrap Metal Processing 1, solely because I wanted to free-up the implant slot.

I also did the same with an alt, so I can assure you that the material skills are unnecessary.
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