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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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POS's Flogging the Dead Horse

First post
Author
Morgan Dinn
Nano Rhinos
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#121 - 2012-05-04 11:16:44 UTC
+1 !!!
NoxiousPluK
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#122 - 2012-05-04 11:39:55 UTC  |  Edited by: NoxiousPluK
Does anyone still have the images from the OP?

Edit: nvm, they seem to work again.

Also see my post with an alike-system on the previous page.
Andy Landen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#123 - 2012-05-04 12:06:29 UTC
Wolodymyr wrote:
Andy Landen wrote:
So? War-decs only matter to pos's in high sec anyway, so..
Yeah but it's pretty important.

No structure that can be anchored in highsec should be anchorable by any entity that is immune to wardecks and always has concord protection.

Basically these structures would go up but there would be no way to take them down because there would never be a way for people to shoot it down without getting Concorded.

letting individual people own a POS (or any anchorable structure) is a good idea. But if they every go into an NPC corp the POS can't come with them.


Then I propose that CCP allow people to wardec individuals when they are in NPC corps. Even a noob can join a player corp for protection. Or hire mercs to dec the dec'ers and rep the pos.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." Albert Einstein 

Flamespar
WarRavens
#124 - 2012-05-04 12:36:39 UTC
Oh. And I also want a dead horse for my CQ
Kusum Fawn
Perkone
Caldari State
#125 - 2012-05-08 03:40:33 UTC
sooo.. where are we on this?

Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.

Accki
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#126 - 2012-05-08 11:43:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Accki
Bump back to the top,



Was it just me or did the Dev response on page 3 sound like he was taking the p_iss out of us? What?



more work, less talking/fanfests untill completed Smile
Skipper Auscent
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#127 - 2012-05-11 23:42:37 UTC
these are cool ideas +1
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#128 - 2012-05-12 00:43:21 UTC
Kusum Fawn wrote:
sooo.. where are we on this?



The same place we have been since 2006: devs with their fingers in their ears saying 'We can't hear you, la la la "



I did however, work out a way that POS could be docked with, as a work around to the current issue of POS being non-permanent structures.

Basically the POS becomes two structures. The first structure, which is permanent, is the Concord claim marker, which is an asteroid that the POS is built on. The second, which is the POS tower, is the destructible portion. Once the tower is online, the player docks with the tower (in reality the asteroid) and begins configuring the POS. The individual modules appear on the surface of the asteroid, and as current are either online or offline.

Yes, this does mean that the POS guns, etc, are back inside the shield. However, when the POS is destroyed, all the items players have stored in their hangers there are jettisoned, meaning a larger possible payout in highsec, where players leaving major items in it is more likely. In 0.0 and lowsec, you have dreadnaughts, use them.

Players docked with a POS that is destroyed are launched in thier pods and warp out, and are untargetable if they are not logged in. (yes, this has possibilities for abuse, but they still have to log back in at some point. and may have a long way to go in their pods.)

The reduction in objects however means that lag around POS will be reduced, and also allows that new POS moduals could be created.

Example:

Drone Hive: Proportionate bonus to the drones compared to other POS weapons. Lower power, higher CPU compared to same sized missile battery)

Small: five medium drones.
Medium: Five Large drones
Large: Five Fighters (yes, that means if you warp out, they chase your ass)
xCabalx
The Wallstreet Bulls Corporation
#129 - 2012-05-13 02:59:42 UTC
Connecting modules to each other (reminds me a bit of X-COM) would be a nice and better sight for every eye in EVE! +1+
Andy Landen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#130 - 2012-05-13 13:56:25 UTC
Ship hangar array should work like station ship hangar. Each player sees the ships that they docked with and have access to nothing else. Unless they transfer that ship to the public section. POS control should completely rest with the pos owner, which initially is the player that anchored the pos. That player can transfer control/pos ownership to another player. The pos owner would have access to all ships, of course. Same with the corp hangar array. All pos modules come together to act like a station with the player docked to it in their CQ managing their own assets and jobs.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." Albert Einstein 

Kusum Fawn
Perkone
Caldari State
#131 - 2012-05-21 20:23:51 UTC
Andy Landen wrote:
Ship hangar array should work like station ship hangar. Each player sees the ships that they docked with and have access to nothing else. Unless they transfer that ship to the public section. POS control should completely rest with the pos owner, which initially is the player that anchored the pos. That player can transfer control/pos ownership to another player. The pos owner would have access to all ships, of course. Same with the corp hangar array. All pos modules come together to act like a station with the player docked to it in their CQ managing their own assets and jobs.


I can only guess you mean Corp CEO when you say "owner", and mean people with the correct roles to transfer and move things between hangers.

oh btw bump.

Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.

Andy Landen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#132 - 2012-05-22 22:22:24 UTC
Kusum Fawn wrote:
Andy Landen wrote:
Ship hangar array should work like station ship hangar. Each player sees the ships that they docked with and have access to nothing else. Unless they transfer that ship to the public section. POS control should completely rest with the pos owner, which initially is the player that anchored the pos. That player can transfer control/pos ownership to another player. The pos owner would have access to all ships, of course. Same with the corp hangar array. All pos modules come together to act like a station with the player docked to it in their CQ managing their own assets and jobs.


I can only guess you mean Corp CEO when you say "owner", and mean people with the correct roles to transfer and move things between hangers.

oh btw bump.


If the pos was anchored for the corp, then yes. I am asking CCP to allow the pos to be anchorable for the individual as well, so that the owner would be the player that anchored the pos, or whoever he transferred ownership to. I would not allow roles for transferring ships between hangars, but if someone has the role to offline the ship maintenance array and unanchor it, then all ships would pop out and be accessible by anyone in the pos, of course. So, on second thought, even allowing the pos owner to move ships out of personal areas of the hangar is a bad idea. So by access and control, I guess what I really mean is view only, or unanchor first and then have access, and control. But if players put their ships in the corp area of the array, then anyone can access and control them.

Might add in something about pos charters for high sec only being given to players anchoring for a player corp.

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them." Albert Einstein 

NuclearSunset
TooLEGIT.
#133 - 2012-05-30 08:21:19 UTC
+1
Clara Xavier
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#134 - 2012-09-12 19:15:28 UTC
Yes. I am 100% ready to be flamed out of the forums. Bring it girls!

So eveyone says "OMG POS's are terrible and need to be revamped, etc... etc...". I have an option that I think would really make a lot of people very happy.

1. New POS Modules:

Personal Hangar Array (Lower CPU, Powergrid than Corporate Hangar Array, Lower storage and not tabbed based on corporation)
Personal Ship Maintenance Bay (Lower Powergrid than Ship Maintenance Bay, Lower storage, maybe take away the fitting option aka require a regular SMA for ship refits)

2. Access Control Lists.

This is partially implented in theory. If you access the management window of a POS you can go to the Structures tab then the Access tab and you can set Corporation Roles that have 3 basic functions for using a POS mod. Those include: View, Take, Use. My main issue with this is that they are tied to corporation roles. This creates major security issues if you want to lock down how ships or resources are stored or used because it because a corporation wide item (with the exception of tabs within a CHA.

Currently the only way to bypass this is strictly control Config Starbase roles in a corporation and setup a unique POS per access group (or person) and give them there own tower with a password only they know.

So If I have your interest I will explain a little farther. In the computer world we have these things called access lists. Access lists are populated with a unique ID that represents a user or group in a system or directory (AD, LDAP, local users/groups). Why not take that system and adapt it how corporation roles are allocated (like titles almost currently) and how functions of a tower are controlled.

Ok that was a lot. Let's look at this piece by piece. Let's go back to our tower and under the Access tab. Imagine instead of having the basic options of Config Starbase, Starbase Fueling, Alliance, and Corporation you could go one step further and specify a list of groups or corporation members to have that function? OMG that would be great right. I would also like a little UI redesign so you could specify more than 1 user or group per View, Take, Use role. This would allow a high degree of granularity if necessary or still give the blanket option that a CEO could have a Directors or Everyone group that he just drops in to allow more generic access to something.

3. Ok so what does that have to do with #1 and new POS modules again ...

So we implement some stuff that can use less grid (aka therefore a few of them per small tower). And each wormholer or remote system liver can be given permissions to his one little piece of storage that is sizeable enough to actually make life decent along with the piece of mind that his **** won't go walking off to any random person in the corporation with no logging.

4. O s**t he said "logging"

Wouldn't it be great to have logging on POS modules if you wanted. CCP says o well don't risk what you can't lose. This is 2012 and your users are intelligent. You can implement systems that keeps say the last 24 or 48 hours of access to a POS module. Make it an option that has to be explcitly turned on for all I care but give us the option. Purge the data without a backup after the said small window as well. At least give leadership a leg to stand on when trying to identify a thief.

5. Some Minor Adjustments.

A. You are able to refine items in refining arrays.

This would allow trash loot to be refined in a POS and provide those few alternate minerals a remote corporation might need to produce replacement ammunition or drones without relying on mining alone. (I'm neither for or against adjusting the refinement amount. Personally I think with max skills you should get at most 80% in a POS and 100% of ice).

B. Allow the production of all types of everything in a POS

In particular I only know of not being able to build POS mods in a POS. This would greatly help a corporation or small group of players getting themselves established in any space. It's easy to sneak a BPC around. It's not so easy trying to sneak 20 medium gun batteries, 2 warp disruptor batteries, 2 stasis web batteries around. If there is any other things you can't produce in a tower fix it so you can. That is the only one I now of right now.

C. Allow POS services to be rented out easier.

Tie production and research modules to the new Personal Hangar Array and also allow research to be started from a persons local hangar. This would secure blueprints to a person. It also would allow corporations to have a unique tax on research or production services that may not otherwise be available. This would be amazing across the board. Imagine if you could have a research POS that instantly can be rented out to pubbies in high-sec looking for a slot. You set the price. If they're willing to pay for it so be it otherwise they wait for a slot to become available. In 0.0 - lowsec it simply allows a player to accomplish something they would already be able to do but with theft security that normally requires a lot of layers to effectively protect against. All in all if you have a director level spy I think it should still be able to access stuff like this via changing a tower password, cancelling the job and taking from the array or the corp hangar ins station or however you would have secured it before.

D. Can T3's refit in POS's yet? I'm not in a position to test this at the moment.

6. Final and mostly un-related gripe. Take sov mechanics away from Starbase Config and give them new roles.

In Closing ...

All in all I don't think a complete POS replacement is necessary just a major dose of TLC. I also do not think that you need to implement some nature of psedo outpost that needs to be probed down by hostiles. POS's are annoying enough for an alliance of any size to bash and they are relatively easy to setup and affordable to run even the most remote of systems.
CCP Phantom
C C P
C C P Alliance
#135 - 2012-09-12 20:13:37 UTC
Thread was automatically locked for inactivity and now has been unlocked again.

CCP Phantom - Senior Community Developer

Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#136 - 2012-09-12 22:12:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Alx Warlord
I have written some things rellated to the new POS system, maybe a good place to harvest some Ideas. Please take a look!

[Discussion] - New POS System (Construction Block Built - Starbasecraft)
Souisa
WESCORP 2.0
#137 - 2012-09-13 04:32:03 UTC
This suggestion was 6 years ago. And it was a damn good one. Nothing has really changed since tho. What the hell are CCP doing? ...

o/

Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#138 - 2012-09-14 18:42:37 UTC
To start with they should just sticky this, or better yet find the original and sticky that. A lot of good thought went into this, and i dont think I've ever seen an idea with more universal support from freaking everybody.
Bael Gar
Russian SOBR
DarkSide.
#139 - 2012-11-03 22:43:04 UTC
Too long without posting
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID
#140 - 2012-11-04 12:24:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Hakan MacTrew
I love this. So much better than the current system.

I know that CCP are talking about having POS's that can be made to look like anyhting, but IMO that will just end up with a load of giant dicks in space. Look at spore!

Awesome sauce to the OP +1