Intergalactic Summit

Unfortunately, the root of the problem lies in psychology of a (former) slave. Despite they are saying that they are freeing slaves, in fact, they want to get their own slaves. This is the ultimate desire of the slave - to become a master and get own slaves. At first, they won't show it, they will be 'freeing their own kind' and 'punishing slavers'. But when all of 'their kind' will be freed (I hope not!) and 'slavers' will be punished enough, they will start enslaving former slavers.

The only possible solution to stop this, is to make them forget their past in slavery. Or just burn them all.

Fascinating.

Truly fascinating.

Could you come over here where my boot can hear you?

ms.Kim. There is one nation that has extensive studies on the minds of slaves, freed slaves and slaves that have rebelled. I feel your opinion is not validated by knowledge. Cases that you describe do happen, but they are not quite common enough for such a wide generalization. I might have to expound on the issue at somepoint, but this is not the intended topic for this discussion.

Blackshell. Amarrian sees his people betrayed and murdered. He notes people doing so are Matari, he notes other Matari either celebrating the murderers as heroes or doing their best to be quiet. Amarrian notes that since the matari will not address the problem Amarrian and his fellow Amarrians will have to.

I continually invite matari to prove me wrong.To show their word can be expected to hold them. That when they fail they will see and seek to correct their failures. When I denigrate you and your kin for your failures I expect an acknowledment of how I am right in seeing a mistake, or evidence of how I am mistaken. So far your kin claims to no mistakes and no responcibility in anything, let alone to offer ways to correct such mistakes.

Minmatar had a hundred years of peace to order their governmental system, peace backed by the word of a legitimate Emperor of Amarrian Throne. That is longer than most your kin live. You had a lifetime to order your affairs and you decide to blame Amarrians for the inadequacies of your system? You can not keep order, let alone the law, on your own streets and you clamour how it is the fault of ours? You need our magnamity in feeding your people and accuse us when you go hungry?

If it is indeed all our fault, do not be dismayed, your cries will be heard and we will seek to correct the mistakes. It might not be in a fashion you like, but such is the role of those not ready for the rigors of freedom.

Or you prove me wrong, show to all of Amarr you can order yourselves with wisdom. Show that you recognize your mistakes and seek to correct them, let us know that your demands for religious freedom extend to all, irrelevant of race and religion. Let us know and see that you do enforce your laws and agreements even if those laws are broken to harm us. Stand on your own two feet, instead of accusing this or that for you not doing well on your own.

By doing that, I will still call you a heathen. I will still support a reclaiming. I will still hold my Faith superior to your beliefs. I will still hate you for your sins.

I will however have to admit that I was wrong in saying you should be declared forsaken and be delt as such. I will begrudgingly have acceed to the liberals that for now you have shown that reclaiming can be best accomplished with time, patience and peaceful missionaries. I do not expect I will have to make those concessions of opinion any time soon.

Isn't it curious how when some people run out of arguments against a point of view they resort to labelling it as propaganda?

To continue:

It is Written that:
"Only through many hardships, Is a man stripped to his very foundations
And in such a state, Devoid of distractions
Is his soul free to soar, And in this He is closest to God"

So, when we examine the Minmatar, we can see that having expanded into space to a mere handful of systems, to obtain different varieties of mud for their orgies, that the Minmatar culture was in danger of lapsing into hedonism, as the Gallente did, where the colour of your body hair not matching your dress being the Biggest Problem Ever. Such is the triviality of Gallente.

Anyway, as the Imperial Fleet arrived, in one action, the Minmatar were rescued from self-destructive hedonism, and given Purpose and Drive.

And so, a few years later, we have the Minmatar Republic, consisting of large numbers of intensely spiritual and purposeful people, shaped into tools and weapons by the actions of the Imperial Navy.

Truly, the Minmatar became closer to God through the divine intervention of the Golden Fleet.

Katran, "freedom" is the state of being able to make your own choices and decisions without being directly controlled by some superior. Yes, it can lead to dark places that coddled Amarr nobility are not used to. You have the ability to fight to escape, though, and make your own way. The slaves we seek to liberate do not have that ability, or that choice.

You are fortunate that you were given freedom. You were given choice. What you do with it is irrelevant to a freedom fighter; it only matters that you have it. Of course, it's regrettable that the reception of the newly freed (particularly children) is very brutal in certain places -- often completely without the knowledge of the freedom fighter responsible (especially if it's a capsuleer, as we can be a bit... detached).

As such, I think you're laying blame in the wrong place. You were, of course, justified in avenging yourself of what you called a "lecherous pig" of an instructor, but perhaps instead of focusing on thwarting the freedom fighters who have good intentions, you should focus on what the problem really is: the crime, corruption, and disorder that certain parts of the Republic suffer from.

Imagine if you will a prison. The inhabitants are exactly the kind of people you'd expect to be inside a prison. One day there is a prison riot. Then Pandora's Box of murders, rapists, gangster, arsonist and psychopaths of all kinds break out of their cells, tear the guards to pieces and declare themselves an autonomous state.

And we do nothing.

Now imagine that years later this group of malcontents are no longer satisfied with just beating on each other for their jollies. The few literate amongst them see the potential for power within there if they can only rally enough of the former inmates behind their make-shift thrones. So they do exactly that, but it isn't enough. They want more power, more followers. The answer, to them, is obvious: There are still other prisons out there with legions of brigands just waiting to be recruited. They need only break in and "parole" them.

And still we do nothing.

Yet even this is not enough, for criminals are an independent lot, not to be trusted or relied on and their own leaders know this. Far better to get recruits who can be molded, shaped, made truly obedient. Young minds who can be indoctrinated, just smart enough to know how to kill but not smart enough to question why.

And still we do nothing.

We sit within our own borders, living our lives in Peace with God, only to find ourselves constantly assailed by those who would destroy our way of life - and for what? What do they gain from this besides more cannon fodder for the legions of their armies? They kidnap our people to bolster their own ranks so that they can kidnap more of our people. They pin medals on the chests of monsters that any civilized society would have executed. They harass our Empire, raid our ships and worlds, burning and stealing everything in their wake. And then they have the audacity to go crying before CONCORD - a group that they, themselves, seem to have no qualms about attacking when they refused to bow to the will of this "nation" of gang leaders & warlords - crying because Amarr are finally retaliating. Crying that our fleets have sallied forth to repay these endless attacks on our people, our worlds, and our entire way of life.

Crying that we're finally doing something about these misbegotten terrorists, that we are bringing Divine Retribution to those who took our offers for peace as a sign of weakness.

They do not tell you stories like mine in the Republic training camps, do they? Of course not. They don't tell you about how slaves who refuse to be "liberated" being executed as "collaborators." They don't tell how many of the orphans that they're "liberating" they create themselves. They don't tell you about the violation & murder of entire families because they found a single wizened Vherokior gardener on their estate, or that how they just killed him too when they found him praying from the Scriptures in his terror. The don't tell you about any of those things that might make their Gallente allies question the morality of their alliance.

And of course the "official Republic government" (if rulership by collection crime syndicates can honestly be called a government) denies everything. The terrorists are always "independent loners" operating "without official sanction" ... even when their fleets number in the hundreds and include battleships. Yet when we move our fleets to destroy them, suddenly we're "threatening Minmatar sovereignty." Odd, why should they care about the fates of people they themselves deem to be outlaws?

The Amarr, and even moreso we Ammatar, have long since grown weary of all these lies. CONCORD has hopefully learned not to trust the Minmatar as well, else a hard lesson was wasted. A time will come when the Gallente wise up & realize that their alliance with these criminals is winning them no friends or sympathy elsewhere and abandon them to their fates. What will happen then? Will the Amarr come sweeping in and retake the Minmatar back in irons?

No, because they don't really want to. Evil always turns upon itself in the end. The Amarr and Ammatar shall simply wall-up their borders so that no more terrorists can get through. Without vulnerable Amarrians to prey upon they will soon turn on each other, with every petty gang boss & warlord back-stabbing each other over "boosters" and "pleasure girls" (even more-so than they do now). They will scorch & burn their own worlds to feed their endless lust for violence & war. And when the flames have finally died out shall the Amarr & Ammatar shall return, victorious without having fired a shot, and the few beleaguered survivors that remain will finally come to appreciate the virtue within the Salvation that we offer.

legitimate emperor of whom? The slaves you hold? The slaves you wish to hold? If I were still a slave would this emperor be my legitimate ruler? There has never been peace between your faith and my people, there never will be. You speak of mistakes, it is not a "mistake" to act in a way that secures our freedom and our lives. If you regard this dishonesty as the pinnacle of wretchedness, a reason to never trust us, then you are blinded to the realities you force, and hope to force, on us.



The irony of this statement is astounding, an Amarrian slaver, talking about "standing on your own two feet". HAH. Ignorant barbarian.

Katran,

Your opening words are hyperbole at best, slanderous at worst and a sheer affront to your blood in either case. To reduce the whole Republic to psychopaths and criminals is a strawman so grandiose that it's worthy of chronicle.

It is incredibly easy to attack the Republic armed with the knowledge that they're all barbaric rapist invaders, isn't it? Except that both of us know that isn't true and no, no I will not imagine your Prison scenario, for it brings no worth to this discussion.

Now that I've cut through this tumor, let me continue to say that I do genuinely feel sorry for how you and your family have suffered at the hands of the Republic and malcontents alike. I can not speak for their Republic, but as an unaffiliated Minmatar (although I am sure, as an unaffiliated Minmatar, my words mean naught) I sincerely hope that you can someday live your life in peace and indeed, practice your Faith freely.

My interest is piqued upon your perception of the war, I shall admit. I would very much like to continue to hear your thoughts, although it is with my hope that you will consider articulating them in a less emotionally loaded fashion than you have presented here, lest you evoke further vitriol.

I don't understand what you're getting at.

Not at all.

Why would I not be more interested in the opinions of somebody expressly touched by the war as opposed to the views of some profiteer who has a good laugh about destroying a mothership crewed by potentially thousands of men and women?