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[Winter] Support Frigates

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Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#341 - 2012-08-22 12:22:49 UTC
Neotin Nahrain wrote:

But almost everything under that (merlin is an exception) is pretty much free target for destroyers.


No. It always depends on the setups pitted against each other. Destroyers have an edge, but they can be killed by a lone frigate as easily as they can chew through them.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.
Tamiya Sarossa
Resistance is Character Forming
#342 - 2012-08-22 13:47:36 UTC
All I can say is that I'd much rather run into one of these logi frigs than a griffin when soloing, and that despite being pretty confident that they'll have a battlefield life expectancy similar to that of Terran marines I'll have a lot of fun flying them as well.
Nexus Controller
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#343 - 2012-08-22 15:42:51 UTC
Given the fitting requirements (PG/CPU), it looks like deadspace medium RR fits in the logistics frigates with MAPC's. Is this by design? Looks pretty good if so.

:)
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#344 - 2012-08-22 19:38:51 UTC
Hey what's up with the align times on these? I can just about travel with GCC in my incursus, taking only occasional structure damage, but these will probably die instantly. Not helped by the fact that they will most likely have GCC permanently.

How about some pirate love CCP.
Anaphylacti
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#345 - 2012-08-22 20:22:17 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Hey what's up with the align times on these? I can just about travel with GCC in my incursus, taking only occasional structure damage, but these will probably die instantly. Not helped by the fact that they will most likely have GCC permanently.

How about some pirate love CCP.


They've clearly shown how much they love pirates by wanting to make gate guns kill triage carriers in 4 1/2 minutes.
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#346 - 2012-08-22 20:35:50 UTC
Anaphylacti wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Hey what's up with the align times on these? I can just about travel with GCC in my incursus, taking only occasional structure damage, but these will probably die instantly. Not helped by the fact that they will most likely have GCC permanently.

How about some pirate love CCP.


They've clearly shown how much they love pirates by wanting to make gate guns kill triage carriers in 4 1/2 minutes.


I can't believe I am doing this and defending Greyscale, but please keep up with the times:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1830800#post1830800
Alara IonStorm
#347 - 2012-08-22 20:54:19 UTC
Marcel Devereux wrote:
but please keep up with the times:

The times become much harder to keep up with when they are posted on page 40.

No dummy there is peace in the Middle East now. How could you have not read it, it was posted right here at the bottom of the fall style section.
Marcel Devereux
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#348 - 2012-08-22 21:29:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Marcel Devereux
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Marcel Devereux wrote:
but please keep up with the times:

The times become much harder to keep up with when they are posted on page 40.

No dummy there is peace in the Middle East now. How could you have not read it, it was posted right here at the bottom of the fall style section.


I'm pretty sure Greyscale responded before page 40, although no one listened to him. And those shoes that are coming out with this fall are absolutely fabulous. What was that about the Middle East?
Tenris Anis
Schattenengel Clan
#349 - 2012-08-23 04:48:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Tenris Anis
Zedd Al'thor wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
So then they should take the nerf bat to destroyers, they take the same amount of time to train as a decent logi frig and can gank dozens of ships with no worry about having a negative sec status to on on your account that can't be biomassed. If you want to take that exploit in to consideration then everything that takes less than 51 days to use need to be nerfed.


Removing 51 day accounts doesn't get rid of the problem of logi frigs replacing triage carriers. The CFC has over 10,000 pilots, with very little training all of them will be able to fly logi frigs. If you have the numbers logi frigs are still better than triage carriers for repping structures.


And most them can already fly an osprey, which can literally do the same. If you have the numbers still do not waste 14 pilots to do the job that can be done by a single pilot. Opportunity cost are too high. Actually you should be able to just buy a triage carrier from the income 13 pilots can generate in one hour ;-)

Furthermore for that "hey lets just create accounts via the buddy programm" argument:

"Abusing the Buddy System is considered an exploit and will not be tolerated. Incidents will be handled on a case by case basis and action taken may include bans for all accounts involved and/or confiscation of ISK and items. Abuse includes, but is not limited to; farming gifts, making throw-away alts for grief-play purposes."

Remove insurance.
Anaphylacti
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#350 - 2012-08-23 08:26:40 UTC
Marcel Devereux wrote:
Anaphylacti wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
Hey what's up with the align times on these? I can just about travel with GCC in my incursus, taking only occasional structure damage, but these will probably die instantly. Not helped by the fact that they will most likely have GCC permanently.

How about some pirate love CCP.


They've clearly shown how much they love pirates by wanting to make gate guns kill triage carriers in 4 1/2 minutes.


I can't believe I am doing this and defending Greyscale, but please keep up with the times:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1830800#post1830800


ah yes shame on you for defending Greyscale but thank you for pointing this out to me. Maybe they do have a spot in their heart for pirates after all
MisterNick
The Sagan Clan
#351 - 2012-08-23 17:50:22 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Don't you care about the fact that the Tormentor used to be the mining frigate so it breaks the pattern of mining frigates becoming logi frigates?
Not really, no


This is why CCP devs best devs Lol

Besides, they wanted to make the tormentor into a minigeddon, and it does really look like the front of the geddon P

"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom."
CaleAdaire
Deep Core Mining Inc.
#352 - 2012-08-23 19:59:00 UTC
soooo... T2 Logi frigs?

Trust in God, Have Faith in Fusion.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#353 - 2012-08-24 06:39:37 UTC
I'm kinda sad though because the inquisitor looks MUCH nicer than the tormentor...

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Tub Chil
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#354 - 2012-08-24 07:38:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Tub Chil
I applaud this idea.

Also what about TII logistic frigs? please don't make me read 18 pages.
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#355 - 2012-08-24 10:29:54 UTC
Tub Chil wrote:
I applaud this idea.

Also what about TII logistic frigs? please don't make me read 18 pages.


We have no concrete plans to make a T2 logi frigate. It's an option we're keeping open in case we see the need in the future.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#356 - 2012-08-24 10:54:45 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Tub Chil wrote:
I applaud this idea.

Also what about TII logistic frigs? please don't make me read 18 pages.


We have no concrete plans to make a T2 logi frigate. It's an option we're keeping open in case we see the need in the future.



don't do it


please
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#357 - 2012-08-24 12:25:40 UTC
A T2 logi frig would be fine.

You just can't whine about it ruining 1v1, because it would be 1v2, and the other party could also bring a Kitsune and it would actually be worse than if a T2 logi frig landed on grid.

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}
Usagi Toshiro
Null Tax Crew
#358 - 2012-08-24 17:44:34 UTC
I think these frigates area a great idea! They will provide a great learning tool for the mechanics of RR fleets. RvB would use these daily and educate a new generation of pilots for the rigors of low/null sec fleet ops.

RvB usually runs Cruiser down for it's fleet engagements. The bigger ships being called primary first. The ability to RR these larger hulls would add a new level of tactics to our fights. It would allow FCs to fly a larger hull and stay on grid longer to call targets. This is a huge plus.

Now I know that logistics ships are called primary in many engagements and would expect no less. What it does bring to the table is new tactics and more ways to learn. This is a huge plus in my book. Big smile

Trolls are like stray cats. If you feed them they multiply. Please do not  feed the trolls.
Griffin Omanid
Knights of the Zodiac
#359 - 2012-08-25 03:31:54 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
These ships will be replacing the mining frigates that are being displaced by the new ORE frigate, taking the Inquisitor from the Amarr lineup instead because we already stole the Tormentor to make a mini-Armageddon.



Inquisitor:
Frigate skill bonuses:
10% bonus to Remote Armor Repair amount
10% reduction in Remote Armor Repair cap use
Role Bonus:
500% bonus to the range of Remote Armor Repairers
Slot layout: 3 H, 2 M, 4 L, 2 turrets
Fittings: 51 PWG, 135 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 225 / 500 / 330
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 400 / 200s / 2
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 310 / 3.6 / 1470000 / 4.95s
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 36km / 700 / 7
Sensor strength: 10 Radar
Signature radius: 34
Cargo capacity: 250


Nothing against logi frigs, but you changed the Tormentor with Inferno so you should be easily be able to change it again and make it a logistc frigate. Otherwise the Amarr logistic frig would be the only one which becomes a Stealth Bomber which feels a little bit crazy somehow

Proposal T2 BS Class Juggernaut
Mechael
Tribal Liberation Distribution and Retail
#360 - 2012-08-25 05:58:17 UTC
Michael Harari wrote:
Basically having super low sig, low skill requirement, super cheap logi is very bad for the game.

They scale without stacking penalty and work well even with poor skills. The benefit they give is out of proportion to both their in game cost and the player skill required to use them. Fighting them requires disproportionate effort, particularly if they are massed (which they will be).

I support your other changes fozzie, but this is a bad, bad idea.

An SFI, a cruiser designed from the ground up to be death to frigates would be unable to fight 2 probes and a merlin. A vagabond or cynabal, also designed as frigate killers would be similarly useless. A dual web autocannon hurricane would at best be able to escape from them with its neuts, and would be unable to break the tanks.

This gives a LARGE advantage for having SMALL advantage in numbers, and the nature of the advantage is one you cannot counter with piloting skill, but only with your own blob with ecm or high alpha anti frigate ships.


Wait, wait ... you're saying those cruisers are designed as frigate killers? Get out.

Whether or not you win the game matters not.  It's if you bought it.