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A little help with my ship fit (CNR)

Author
Lijah Sai
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2012-08-19 17:27:24 UTC
CNR

Rigs: Large warhead rigor I x3

Top: 7x Cruise missile launcher II (empty slot, recommend one? dont need a tractor beam, only going in to clear it out then in with a noctis)

mid: 100 MN MWD, Large shield booster II (this is where i need advice, i dont have enough CPU to have a XL SB, what skill is it i need to train?) adaptive invulnerability field II, shield boost amplifier I (working on II) and 2 specific deflection / dissipation field.

bot: co proccessor II and 4 Ballistic control system II


Also, with this fit, do you think I'm ready for L4 missions

DPS 629.6 with missiles alone, i dont have tech II drones. overall tank its almost 40k (13.5k shield, 12,452 armour, 12.451 structure)
thanks for any advice
Bommel McMurdoc
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-08-19 17:53:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Bommel McMurdoc
Well, for easier shield fittings, you can go with the skill "shield upgrades" you should also try and get as many of the "upgrades skills" including weapons and advanced weapons upgrades. Both will make fittings quite easier, for further resources on fitting upgrades you can also look to evemon "certificates" tab and look at the core fittings to at least standard.

As for that lone high slot you are talking about you can put a drone link augmenter on there. While on the subject of drones, you really should get tech 2 drones, at least Hobgoblin II's they will make dealing with frigates easier for you. Especially if you get warp scrambled in a mission.

as for the rigs.... why not go with a flare and a rigor then a CCC, to free up a little CPU? that's just an idea, don't take my word for it though. There's a lot of great fits out there for the CNR.


the fit in the link I am posting, is very expensive, but it's an idea that you can peruse for establishing some goals and think about some more cost effective modifications. http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/49928-Raven-Navy-Issue-CNR-Optimal-Level-4-Missioner-Updated-for-Inferno.html

the above link is a great fit for damage, it's a little weak on the defense but you can certainly eject the AB for a meta 4 cap booster. Make sure you mind the comments the poster put up, the implants would certainly prove to be a valuable asset for your CNR.
Kasutra
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-08-19 18:17:51 UTC
I don't see a cap mod. With a shield booster and an MWD, that cap is going to go down fast.
Lijah Sai
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2012-08-19 18:18:52 UTC
Kasutra wrote:
I don't see a cap mod. With a shield booster and an MWD, that cap is going to go down fast.


what would you swap out for a cap booster?
Bommel McMurdoc
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-08-19 18:26:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Bommel McMurdoc
Lijah Sai wrote:
Kasutra wrote:
I don't see a cap mod. With a shield booster and an MWD, that cap is going to go down fast.


what would you swap out for a cap booster?



afterburner. Really, the Afterburner is a convenience than a necessity. only a few missions would require a AB like 'Recon' or long warpgate (over 30km's) distances.
Jazmyn Stone
Perkone
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-08-19 23:37:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Jazmyn Stone
Rigs: 2 rigor
1 flare (I changed from 3 rigors)

Depending on skills, but I use Arbalest launchers just to get everything to fit, instead of T2

7 Arbalest launchers, CN missles (about 620 dps, and plenty enough for any mission)
8th slot is empty, there is nothing I need there.

Pith X-L shield booster, (some people don't use deadspace mods)
SBA II
2 CN hardeners and 1 res amp (depending on mission)
Heavy Cap booster II with 800 charges (15 in cargo, just for those "oh, shi*" times, but that's only happened a few times)

4 CN BCS
DC II

10 Light Drones (depending on mission) Use to carry medium drones, but there just not needed.

(This is similiar to Liang's fits)

Sometimes if you go with the T2 launchers, you just run into fitting problems, especialy if using T2 BCS. Kirst uses T2 launchers, with a similiar fit, but has to use named hardeners and res. amps. If I have a mission where I have a long way to go to the next gate, I may fit a AB, but then I'll drop the SBA. Otherwise, an AB isn't needed.

What ever you use, if you are struggling thru the mission, then you must change something, or get more skills. (I've been thinking of "cheaping" up my fit just to make some of the missions interesting again.)

Missions can be done with less, as I had to work hard to get to this point. Now the L4 missions are too easy.

You have more dps than I, so you must have plenty of missile skills. (I have 6.5M is missiles along) . So you must be lacking in some shield skills. I have 63000+ hp. You should be able to figure out what you need. T2 needs level 5, faction or deepspace only need level 3 (and isk)

I'm mostly at Irjunen CPF, if you need more info, or need help, just give me a yell.

-Jaz

Always remember Tovil-Toba, and what was done there.

Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-08-19 23:59:55 UTC
Don't need mwd. MWD also gimps your cap.

The reason you don't have cpu for the mid slots is because you have 4 bcu in low. Drop 4th bcu.

Try NOS for the 8th high slot.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Holdings
#8 - 2012-08-20 09:34:24 UTC  |  Edited by: John Ratcliffe
I love my CNR - awesome ship for Lvl 4s Smile

My fit is:

7 CN CM Launcher
Black Eagle Drone Link Augmenter

Gist X-Type Shield Booster
Gist x-Type Shield Boost Amplifier
Cap Recharger II
CN Invuln
2 Gist active resists (changed for each mission)

3 CN BCU
2 PDS II

3 x CCC 1s

I use CN Faction CMs.

Booster perma runs. 5 Hammerhead IIs deal with Frigs.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#9 - 2012-08-20 10:25:36 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
I love my CNR - awesome ship for Lvl 4s Smile

My fit is:

7 CN CM Launcher
Black Eagle Drone Link Augmenter

Gist X-Type Shield Booster
Gist x-Type Shield Boost Amplifier
Cap Recharger II
CN Invuln
2 Gist active resists (changed for each mission)

3 CN BCU
2 PDS II

3 x CCC 1s

I use CN Faction CMs.

Booster perma runs. 5 Hammerhead IIs deal with Frigs.


You realise that your bling faction fetish fit does less dps than an actual good fit which doesn't need all that nonsense, right?
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Holdings
#10 - 2012-08-20 10:37:12 UTC
Vilnius Zar wrote:
You realise that your bling faction fetish fit does less dps than an actual good fit which doesn't need all that nonsense, right?


It's not intentionally bling - I put that together at the start of the year when I had really low skills and couldn't run a T2 build. Happy to change it if you can point to something better, but it does Lvl 4s very well TBH.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#11 - 2012-08-20 11:03:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Vilnius Zar
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Vilnius Zar wrote:
You realise that your bling faction fetish fit does less dps than an actual good fit which doesn't need all that nonsense, right?


It's not intentionally bling - I put that together at the start of the year when I had really low skills and couldn't run a T2 build. Happy to change it if you can point to something better, but it does Lvl 4s very well TBH.


Bit of a pet peeve I must admit but I really don't understand why people put on bling stuff you don't need, and generally those fit perform badly as well. Good example is that clown who lost a 3 billion fit Fleet typhoon with zero dps, obviously an idiot, obviously clueless on the game. Not saying all bling fits are clueless pilots but more often than not they are.

The main issue is not using rigor rigs, those really help increasing your applied dps against non-BS targets so using them speeds up your missioning meaning more income and less boredom. the downside is that you can't get a perma tank anymore but you can solve that in two ways. Either just accept that you have limited tank life (which is almost never a problem) or switch to a cap boosted fit. If you use a cap booster you only waste one slot on cap, not 3 rigs and 2 low slots, result is that you can focus your dps&tank a whole lot better that way and because you kill faster you also need less tank to begin with.

Have a look here, would you want a tad more tank you could drop the AB in favour of more resists but it really isn't needed and speed can always be useful, either to get to a gate or to pick up a mission item.

[Raven Navy Issue, PVE - LVL 4 Guristas]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Signal Amplifier II

100MN Afterburner II
Caldari Navy X-Large Shield Booster
Thermic Dissipation Field II
Caldari Navy Kinetic Deflection Field
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Small Tractor Beam I

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I


Hobgoblin II x5
Garde II x3
MarvinOne
Zilog Enterprises
#12 - 2012-08-20 11:19:56 UTC
fit needs adjusting IMHO ( i flew CNR for more than a year)
a) replace a rigor with 1 flare (all 3 T2 ofc)
b) navy missiles
c) a painter
d) gist a-type large shield booster + a shield boost amp
e) remove cap booster
f) remove afterburner

Vilnius Zar wrote:
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Vilnius Zar wrote:
You realise that your bling faction fetish fit does less dps than an actual good fit which doesn't need all that nonsense, right?


It's not intentionally bling - I put that together at the start of the year when I had really low skills and couldn't run a T2 build. Happy to change it if you can point to something better, but it does Lvl 4s very well TBH.


Bit of a pet peeve I must admit but I really don't understand why people put on bling stuff you don't need, and generally those fit perform badly as well. Good example is that clown who lost a 3 billion fit Fleet typhoon with zero dps, obviously an idiot, obviously clueless on the game. Not saying all bling fits are clueless pilots but more often than not they are.

The main issue is not using rigor rigs, those really help increasing your applied dps against non-BS targets so using them speeds up your missioning meaning more income and less boredom. the downside is that you can't get a perma tank anymore but you can solve that in two ways. Either just accept that you have limited tank life (which is almost never a problem) or switch to a cap boosted fit. If you use a cap booster you only waste one slot on cap, not 3 rigs and 2 low slots, result is that you can focus your dps&tank a whole lot better that way and because you kill faster you also need less tank to begin with.

Have a look here, would you want a tad more tank you could drop the AB in favour of more resists but it really isn't needed and speed can always be useful, either to get to a gate or to pick up a mission item.

[Raven Navy Issue, PVE - LVL 4 Guristas]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Signal Amplifier II

100MN Afterburner II
Caldari Navy X-Large Shield Booster
Thermic Dissipation Field II
Caldari Navy Kinetic Deflection Field
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Scourge Cruise Missile
Small Tractor Beam I

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I


Hobgoblin II x5
Garde II x3

Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#13 - 2012-08-20 11:30:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Vilnius Zar
MarvinOne wrote:
fit needs adjusting IMHO ( i flew CNR for more than a year)
a) replace a rigor with 1 flare (all 3 T2 ofc)
b) navy missiles
c) a painter
d) gist a-type large shield booster + a shield boost amp
e) remove cap booster
f) remove afterburner


a) after having done the math using actual realistic scenarios, there's zero reason to use 2 rigors +1 flare over 3 rigors, and would you start to use T2 ammo then that would favour rigors. So no.
b) which has nothing to do with the fit as such, a non-issue
c) not needed, with 3 rigors you get to cruiser-like explosion radius (also, painters are a pain to use and only having 1 causes cycle issues)
d) dumb faction fetish bling bullshit, it's not needed and makes you into a gank target.
e) sure, give a fit without a cap booster that allows for rigor rigs and 4 BCS
f) not needed, there's enough tank already and increased speed can, in some missions, give faster completion times.


In short, you wrote a lot of nonsense.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Holdings
#14 - 2012-08-20 13:30:29 UTC  |  Edited by: John Ratcliffe
Is there any point in fitting a TP if you also fit 3 Rigors?

P.S. Apologies to the OP for hijacking his thread, but I'm sure the responses will help him too Big smile

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#15 - 2012-08-20 15:17:18 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Is there any point in fitting a TP if you also fit 3 Rigors?

P.S. Apologies to the OP for hijacking his thread, but I'm sure the responses will help him too Big smile


In fact there is. More math than likely wanted here:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=145812&find=unread
Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#16 - 2012-08-21 11:28:29 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Is there any point in fitting a TP if you also fit 3 Rigors?

P.S. Apologies to the OP for hijacking his thread, but I'm sure the responses will help him too Big smile


Painter will still help against cruisers increasing applied dps but against BCs it'll be ineffective. The problem is that 1 painter simply doesn't work due to module cycle time and having to wait till your missile hits the target, so in theory it helps but in practise you'll miss out on a whole lot of targets and it's annoying as fck. You'd need 2-3 painters to make up for the module cycle issues but it would still be very annoying (one of the reasons I'm no fan of the golem, it NEEDS painters).

If you want your effort to actually net results then don't fly a Raven hull but get a turret ship like a Mach, NM/Pally or a Navy Mega/Kronos. Raven hull will for ever be slower to complete missions due to mediocre dps and missile travel time, they're easy to use and all that but they're not amazing.
Aamrr
#17 - 2012-08-21 13:30:37 UTC
Is there any reason nobody is looking at a dual-ASB setup? They work marvelously, in my experience.

[Raven Navy Issue, Mission]

Co-Processor II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II

100MN Afterburner II
Large Ancillary Shield Booster, Cap Booster 150
Large Ancillary Shield Booster, Cap Booster 150
Thermic Dissipation Field II
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Shield Boost Amplifier II

Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Cruise Missile Launcher II
Auto Targeting System II

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I


Hobgoblin II x5
Hammerhead II x5
Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#18 - 2012-08-21 14:11:34 UTC
Aamrr wrote:
Is there any reason nobody is looking at a dual-ASB setup? They work marvelously, in my experience.


Cost, those charges start to add up isk wise.
Aamrr
#19 - 2012-08-21 14:49:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Aamrr
You're joking, right?

We're seeing plenty of cap boosted setups. A shield boost amplifier uses that capacitor about 3 times more efficiently than a typical cap/shield booster combination. If a ship can run missions with a capacitor injector, it can run them with an ancillary shield booster.

Just to humor you, let's look at the cost you're complaining about. The median selling price is approximately 8000 isk/unit (I use 400 charges). I use approximately 5-10 per mission. Each mission pays out somewhere between 10 and 20 million isk, not including salvage and LP.

I'm spending about 50,000 isk to earn ~15 million isk. That means that for every three hundred missions I complete, I'll have to do one more. I usually spend forty times that paying for T2 missiles, and consider it well worth the expense.

Capacitor charge cost is most definitely not a legitimate reason to avoid the ancillary shield booster.
Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#20 - 2012-08-21 16:20:32 UTC
Aamrr wrote:
You're joking, right?

We're seeing plenty of cap boosted setups. A shield boost amplifier uses that capacitor about 3 times more efficiently than a typical cap/shield booster combination. If a ship can run missions with a capacitor injector, it can run them with an ancillary shield booster.

Just to humor you, let's look at the cost you're complaining about. The median selling price is approximately 8000 isk/unit (I use 400 charges). I use approximately 5-10 per mission. Each mission pays out somewhere between 10 and 20 million isk, not including salvage and LP.

I'm spending about 50,000 isk to earn ~15 million isk. That means that for every three hundred missions I complete, I'll have to do one more. I usually spend forty times that paying for T2 missiles, and consider it well worth the expense.

Capacitor charge cost is most definitely not a legitimate reason to avoid the ancillary shield booster.


Yes, lets entirely forget you can use normal shield booster without cap boosters for the most part, relying on cap regen, and ONLY need to pop booster charges in case of heavy tanking. If you only need 8-10 shield boosts per mission you could have done it with a normal shield booster without cap boosters alltogether.
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